A disaster in the fight against obesity...

McBoom

...brought to you by Denmark.

Denmark has introduced what is believed to be the world's first fat tax - a surcharge on foods that are high in saturated fat.

Butter, milk, cheese, pizza, meat, oil and processed food are now subject to the tax if they contain more than 2.3% saturated fat.

Some consumers began hoarding to beat the price rise, while some producers call the tax a bureaucratic nightmare.

Others suggest that many Danes will simply start shopping abroad.

Danish officials say they hope the new tax will help limit the population's intake of fatty foods.

However, some scientists think saturated fat may be the wrong target.

They say salt, sugar and refined carbohydrates are more detrimental to health and should be tackled instead.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-15137948

So the deeply ingrained and unfounded fear of fats has reached new limits, ensuring people eat even more sugar and refined carbs... making them less healthy and even fatter.

I can't even tell you how pissed off l will be if they do this here. At least the "some scientists" have a fucking clue.

EKIMIKE

It's crazy really. I cringe when someone carefully cuts away the fat from a piece of meat (bacon in particular) but will happily stack away a huge bag of crisps....

jim453

Why should people who are fit and healthy pay extra for an occasional treat because there are loads of fat people everywhere? Incredible.

I didn't realise the Danes were a particularly obese nation. What the hell are they going to do with all their pastries?

Cressers

It's yet another tax grab from an intrusive state. What business of theirs is what people choose to eat, dirnk, or smoke?

ooermissus

Cressers wrote:

It's yet another tax grab from an intrusive state. What business of theirs is what people choose to eat, dirnk, or smoke?

Any state that provides healthcare is going to make it its business.

inkyfingers

People just need to be better educated and more responsible for their own wellbeing. People are also just lazy, not only can they not be bothered to exercise, many can't be bothered to cook properly. I have a friend who eats nothing but processed microwave meals and drinks nothing but fizzy drinks, no fruit and no vegetables at all yet is constantly moaning about his bad skin and has several expensive courses of NHS treatment to try and "cure" his problem.

The problem is not unhealthy foods, the problem in unhealthy diets. On a saturday during or after my ride I will enjoy a big piece of cake and then in the evening i'll enjoy a nice bottle of red wine with my steak. Does that make me unhealthy, no it doesn't because the rest of the week I eat well and I ride 100 miles + each week. Why should I pay more tax on a couple of things I enjoy in moderation just because others are too lazy and feckless.

Crapaud

ooermissus wrote:

Cressers wrote:

It's yet another tax grab from an intrusive state. What business of theirs is what people choose to eat, dirnk, or smoke?

Any state that provides healthcare is going to make it its business.

Why? And all this comes from the 'merkins where private medical care is the norm.

What this bollox fails to appreciate is that people are different, but they treat everyone as homogenous. As Inkyfingers points out, it's not unhealthy food it's unhealthy diets. It'll make feck all difference to obesity anyway.

verylonglegs

It seems governments want us to live longer and work longer but go without the pleasurable things whilst we do so. Sounds like crap deal to me. There is no way I’d use that vegetable oil spread nonsense in my sandwiches or on toast…disgusting.

Alain Quay

It's easy to knock the Danes but look at the direction of travel regarding
obesity and medical care. Credit to them for attempting something.
The UK can't even run an anti-litter campaign.

'A 2010 report suggested 40% of Scotland could be classed as obese by 2030.
It already costs £0.5 Bn p.a. 'There is huge peer pressure on kids to eat junk because
all the other kids do. Where does it end? It is a clash between rights and
responsibility but in the end the current trajectory is untenable and
unaffordable. It won't be solved by market forces.

Mad Roadie

EKIMIKE wrote:

It's crazy really. I cringe when someone carefully cuts away the fat from a piece of meat (bacon in particular) but will happily stack away a huge bag of crisps....

it gets closer to home - My Mrs orders a skinny mocha, but with cream... on the basis the skinny bit makes the cream less BAD!

Cleat Eastwood

some one posted this in another thread


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM

have a look from 1:01:00 about sugary drinks etc. very interesting

esspeebee

My Danish acquaintances have a different take on this: it's not at all about public health, but instead about finding pretexts to tax everything they can after promising to freeze income tax as an election policy. Just plain government dishonesty, then.

Crapaud

Cleat Eastwood wrote:

some one posted this in another thread


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM

have a look from 1:01:00 about sugary drinks etc. very interesting

That was a very interesting vid, Cleat.

Stiff_Orange

Rather than stick, wouldn't a carrot be better.

Blanket tax rises like this affect everybody even if they are healthy or are poorly paid.

If you live a fairly healthy life style, exercise regular etc. shouldn't you get a tax reduction. Then if you're fat and wealthy you end up paying paying more tax.

Phill B

the cost of fags and booze (of which i use neither thank god) is at an all time high. the figures for smoking related and alcohol related illness are at an all time high. raising prices of high fat foods will not make any difference, if people want it then people will get it at any cost, it is human nature.

McBoom

I wonder what their scientific basis was for this tax. Must have just cherry-picked a few poorly done studies, because despite the common perception, the supposed link between saturated fat and poor health doesn't exist.

Meta-analysis showing no link between sat fat and cardio disease: http://www.ajcn.org/content/early/2010/ ... 5.abstract

Also, the idea that eating fat makes you fat is just nonsense.

I recommend Gary Taubes - Why We Get Fat as a good read to explain why.

ooermissus

Phill B wrote:

the cost of fags and booze (of which i use neither thank god) is at an all time high. the figures for smoking related and alcohol related illness are at an all time high. raising prices of high fat foods will not make any difference, if people want it then people will get it at any cost, it is human nature.

Surely smoking related diseases are down.

Stiff_Orange

McBoom wrote:

IMeta-analysis showing no link between sat fat and cardio disease: http://www.ajcn.org/content/early/2010/ ... 5.abstract

Who sponsored the research to prove no link between sat fat and cardio disease

Supported by the National Dairy Council (PWS-T and RMK)

McBoom wrote:

Also, the idea that eating fat makes you fat is just nonsense.
I recommend Gary Taubes - Why We Get Fat as a good read to explain why.

Taubes includes information and studies which indicate that physical exercise increases appetite to a degree that makes it an inefficient tool in weight loss.

What complete and utter Bull crap!!! This is more American rubbish to justify why people are overweight, so they don't have to accept that they are a bunch of lazy pigs shoving high fat food down their throats.

Only one way to lose weight eat less, cut out crap and exercise more.

Worked for me and countless others.

McBoom

Stiff_Orange wrote:

Only one way to lose weight eat less, cut out crap and exercise more.

Worked for me and countless others.

The "crap" being sugar and refined carbs, yes. Butter, meat and cheese, erm no.

The easiest way to loose weight is a medium protein, high fat, low carb diet. Don't even need to bother with the exercise if you don't want to, it isn't needed. Worked for me and countless others. People who are fat, are so because they eat far too many carbs.

Must say, you read that book very quickly...

LeicesterLad

Agree this is a sh*t idea, im quite healthy, but love a fatty snack, so why should i be penalised?

However, i think people with self induced clinical obesity should be made to pay for any fat related treament that the nhs provides. Because the NHS spends a lot of cash on faties, that could go on people who deserve it.

cue the haters....

McBoom

LeicesterLad wrote:

Agree this is a sh*t idea, im quite healthy, but love a fatty snack, so why should i be penalised?

However, i think people with self induced clinical obesity should be made to pay for any fat related treament that the nhs provides. Because the NHS spends a lot of cash on faties, that could go on people who deserve it.

cue the haters....

I'm okay with that. Provided that well beforehand they publish nutritional advice for the population, recommending the replacement of refined carbs with fats in our diet. Not gonna happen though... they'll just tax fatty foods instead. This will lead to a greater consumption of carbs, and the feedback loop of hunger that goes with it, hence more obesity.

Stiff_Orange

McBoom wrote:

Stiff_Orange wrote:

Only one way to lose weight eat less, cut out crap and exercise more.

Worked for me and countless others.

The "crap" being sugar and refined carbs, yes. Butter, meat and cheese, erm no.

The easiest way to loose weight is a medium protein, high fat, low carb diet. Don't even need to bother with the exercise if you don't want to, it isn't needed. Worked for me and countless others. People who are fat, are so because they eat far too many carbs.

What a muppet!!!

You don't get fat from eating a Mcdonalds because of the bun, it's the fat in the cheap meat they use in the burger, the sugar in the ketchup and the fat the fries absorb when cooking.

Live in you little dream would where eating high fat is good, and carbs are bad. I'll happily pull the plug on your life support machine when you have heart attack.

pastey_boy

but please remember , obesity is an illness. feel sorry for the poor fatties as they helplessly shovel food into their red cheeked faces. :oops:

McBoom

Stiff_Orange wrote:

What a muppet!!!

You don't get fat from eating a Mcdonalds because of the bun, it's the fat in the cheap meat they use in the burger, the sugar in the ketchup and the fat the fries absorb when cooking.

Live in you little dream would where eating high fat is good, and carbs are bad. I'll happily pull the plug on your life support machine when you have heart attack.

HAHA!

Your exactly the kind of person that allows a law like this to be introduced.

So the sugar in the ketchup is bad?

And the 50+g per 100g of refined carbs in the bun, which will be turned in to blood sugar almost as quickly, isn't?

You're trying to have your cake and eat it.

Stiff_Orange

pastey_boy wrote:

but please remember , obesity is an illness. feel sorry for the poor fatties as they helplessly shovel food into their red cheeked faces. :oops:

No No it's not their fault. It's the big bad food companies forcing them to do it.

Don't worry McBoom seems seems to have the solution, if they just sit on their fat a***s eating butter and lard they'll lose weight. The US diary council has had research done to prove this.

Stay tuned for next weeks research announcement, "cyclists are totally unharmed when hit by cars." sponsored by the Ford Motor Company.

McBoom

pastey_boy wrote:

but please remember , obesity is an illness. feel sorry for the poor fatties as they helplessly shovel food into their red cheeked faces. :oops:

Yes, they are shovelling more carbs down their throat, because the carbs they've just eaten made them hungry. Unless they break the cycle then they'll get fat. Not easy to do with the "advice" that fat is bad for you.

McBoom

Stiff_Orange wrote:

No No it's not their fault. It's the big bad food companies forcing them to do it.

Don't worry McBoom seems seems to have the solution, if they just sit on their fat a***s eating butter and lard they'll lose weight. The US diary council has had research done to prove this.

Stay tuned for next weeks research announcement, "cyclists are totally unharmed when hit by cars." sponsored by the Ford Motor Company.

I had a small glass of double cream for my pudding. 3 hours later I'm not hungry. If I'd had some cake I would be, and may well eat some more cake.

And anyway, it was a meta-analysis. Looking at existing research to see if the commonly held view actually has any basis.

Also, you haven't addressed you ketchup vs bun contradiction.

Stiff_Orange

McBoom wrote:

Stiff_Orange wrote:

What a muppet!!!

You don't get fat from eating a Mcdonalds because of the bun, it's the fat in the cheap meat they use in the burger, the sugar in the ketchup and the fat the fries absorb when cooking.

Live in you little dream would where eating high fat is good, and carbs are bad. I'll happily pull the plug on your life support machine when you have heart attack.

HAHA!

Your exactly the kind of person that allows a law like this to be introduced.

So the sugar in the ketchup is bad?

And the 50+g per 100g of refined carbs in the bun, which will be turned in to blood sugar almost as quickly, isn't?

You're trying to have your cake and eat it.

First if you read my previous post I ridicule the law.

Secondy Yes. The sugar in the ketchup is bad, sugar is addictive it's the ketchup and special sauce on a McD that get kids hooked on them.

Atkins was proved to have negative health effects and has now dropped of the face of the planet, but you are still trying to flog it.

deptfordmarmoset

Cleat Eastwood wrote:

some one posted this in another thread


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM

have a look from 1:01:00 about sugary drinks etc. very interesting

+1. I can't say I fully understood the science - far too challenging for me - but it was fascinating nonetheless. And reflecting back at the nonsense I eat and drink, it seemed to give an insight as to why I'm not fat*.

*relatively speaking, of course. I couldn't hide behind just one of the Schleck brothers. I reckon I could behind both of them though.

Omar Little

McBoom wrote:

The easiest way to loose weight is a medium protein, high fat, low carb diet. Don't even need to bother with the exercise if you don't want to, it isn't needed. Worked for me and countless others. People who are fat, are so because they eat far too many carbs.

Why overcomplicate things? People who are fat are so because their calorific intake is greater than what they use up.

Easiest way to lose weight is to eat less and move more. Any magic diet offering an easy fix is just snakeoil salemen trying to over complicate matters to sell their solution to the gullible.

McBoom

Omar Little wrote:

Why overcomplicate things? People who are fat are so because their calorific intake is greater than what they use up.

Easiest way to lose weight is to eat less and move more. Any magic diet offering an easy fix is just snakeoil salemen trying to over complicate matters to sell their solution to the gullible.

If you're eating the all the wrong things, then eat less move more isn't going to work, certainly not beyond the short-term.

"People who are fat are so because their calorific intake is greater than what they use up"

Saying that people gain weight because they consume more than they use up is a redundant statement. It's sounds like you're giving a cause and effect, but actually just saying the same thing twice.

Here's a recent piece on the effect eating less to lose weight.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-14882832

So the mantra of cutting 500cals per day from your diet, resulting in weight loss of 1lb per week, as you'll hear everywhere, is actually incorrect. Net loss will actually be more like 0.5lb due to a drop in metabolism. I believe this demonstrates why it needs to be "overcomplicated"; because your suggested approach is oversimplified.