Was I in the wrong?

chris_bass

Thjis morning i was in a very long queue of traffic at some traffic lights and i was overtaking the stationary cars on the right habnd side and someone went to cross the road between the cars and didnt look and stepped out in front of me. she glarred at me and gave me an earful.

Just to clarify, i wasnt going through a red light just getting up to the lights by passing the cars.

Was I wrong?

phy2sll2

No. She probably realised that too but a lot of people's instant reaction is to blame someone else. I would neither take it personally nor retaliate (I'm sure you didn't anyway, too busy enjoying your journey to work!)

saladdays

Spot on phy2sll2. For some people it's easier to shout than communicate, easier to blame than admit fault.

Chris Bass - Google Streetview?

Headhuunter

That happened to me a few years back. I was buzzing alongside stationary traffic near St Paul's (not at all fast) when suddenly this American woman emerged from the traffic without the slightest glance to see what traffic might be about. We both went down, she was carrying hot coffee which spilled all over the road... Her first response was to yell and scream at me...

veronese68

No, you are not wrong at all. You were passing on the right, you could have been a motorbike.
I used to ride a very loud Ducati and had a similar incident. but the podestrian had her music on so loud she didn't hear me coming, didn't hear me tooting my horn at her and didn't hear the engine revving. Jumped out of her skin when I gave her a nudge. Guy in the van next to me nearly died laughing.

chris_bass

thats good!

I was jsut not too sure if I am actually 'allowed' to pass the traffic or not?

I didnt retaliate, i actually said sorry, not too sure why just a natural reaction! And it was a nice cycle in although started to rain now, here's hoping it rains until 5 and not a minute afterwards!!

phy2sll2

Chris Bass wrote:

thats good!

I was jsut not too sure if I am actually 'allowed' to pass the traffic or not?

Yes, you can, and doing it on the right when the traffic is stationary is absolutely the right thing to do (as we keep being reminded!)

Chris Bass wrote:

I didnt retaliate, i actually said sorry, not too sure why just a natural reaction! And it was a nice cycle in although started to rain now, here's hoping it rains until 5 and not a minute afterwards!!

Your natural reaction is the same as mine then! Good thing I've never had a car crash as I think I would admit liability before even realising what's happened!

Headhuunter

I just had another pedestrian experience on Kingsway. Cycled to the gym at lunch time and on the way back was hurtling up Kingsway towards Holborn, no traffic nearby, when some silly bint decides to leg it across 2 lanes, looking at traffic coming along the other side of the road. Jammed the anchors on screaming and swearing at her. No apology for not mowing her down and burning a bald patch on my tyre... Simply a smirk... I was *this* close to running into her, she should be thankful I maintain my brakes or she would have had 80kg of me + bike smacking into her at 20ish mph

Daz555

Chris Bass wrote:

Thjis morning i was in a very long queue of traffic at some traffic lights and i was overtaking the stationary cars on the right habnd side and someone went to cross the road between the cars and didnt look and stepped out in front of me. she glarred at me and gave me an earful.

Just to clarify, i wasnt going through a red light just getting up to the lights by passing the cars.

Was I wrong?

Nothing at all wrong with filtering through traffic - standard acceptable practice for motorcycles for example. The only place you should not be doing it is when crossing junctions - a car could easily turn right in front of you or a van or lorry may swing out when turning left in order to navigate the corner.

HebdenBiker

Daz555 wrote:

The only place you should not be doing it is when crossing junctions - a car could easily turn right in front of you or a van or lorry may swing out when turning left in order to navigate the corner.

This is impractical in the city though, surely.

beverick

Sorry to be contrary here but I think you were potentially in the wrong.

HC rules 162 and 167 apply.

I think you were potentially guilty of careless or even dangerous cycling.

As the person overtaking you are obliged to ensure that the entire manoeuvre can be completed in safety (Rule 162 "Before overtaking you should make sure the road is sufficiently clear "). As you mention that you saw the pedestrian approach the kerb and step out (I assume before you overtook) you should have either not started or potentially aborted the manoeuvre (ie stopped).

Rule 167 states that you should not overtake "at a road junction", "where traffic is queuing at junctions" or "when you would force another road user to swerve or slow down" (the latter may be construed as including pedestrians). As you seem to have ignored all three pieces of "best practice" in this rule (ie should rather than must not) it could be construed that you were being careless and, depending on your speed, dangerous.

This may be further exacerbated by the fact that a competent cyclist should expect, and be able to predict, the likleihood of pedestrians crossing between stationary vehicles.

Finally, the 'standard' rule of safety is that you should never be travelling so fast that you cannot stop, on your own side of the road, in the distance you can see to be clear.

Bob

Headhuunter

beverick wrote:

Sorry to be contrary here but I think you were potentially in the wrong.

HC rules 162 and 167 apply.

I think you were potentially guilty of careless or even dangerous cycling.

As the person overtaking you are obliged to ensure that the entire manoeuvre can be completed in safety (Rule 162 "Before overtaking you should make sure the road is sufficiently clear "). As you mention that you saw the pedestrian approach the kerb and step out (I assume before you overtook) you should have either not started or potentially aborted the manoeuvre (ie stopped).

Rule 167 states that you should not overtake "at a road junction", "where traffic is queuing at junctions" or "when you would force another road user to swerve or slow down" (the latter may be construed as including pedestrians). As you seem to have ignored all three pieces of "best practice" in this rule (ie should rather than must not) it could be construed that you were being careless and, depending on your speed, dangerous.

This may be further exacerbated by the fact that a competent cyclist should expect, and be able to predict, the likleihood of pedestrians crossing between stationary vehicles.

Finally, the 'standard' rule of safety is that you should never be travelling so fast that you cannot stop, on your own side of the road, in the distance you can see to be clear.

Bob

The manoeuvre in this case was filtering rather than overtaking... Overtaking implies that he was riding past slow moving traffic like a tractor or something. I agree that you need to take things slowly and carefully whilst filtering but it's pretty much impossible to tell whether some dozy iped is going to step out into traffic without looking 5 cars down when you have already started filtering through. Of course a cyclist should look out for pitfalls ahead but the onus is surely on the ped to check before wandering willy nilly into the road.

I think this comes down to whether or not cyclists are allowed to FILTER... I have always assumed it is allowed having seen cyclists, moped riders and motorcyclists, including POLICE motorcyclists at it in London.

The rules you quote above are clearly aimed at motor traffic passing a slower moving vehicles, not 2 wheelers passing through a traffic jam in a city.

Stiff_Orange

I had the similar experience, but in my case I was in a bus lane (where cycling is permitted) along side a dual carrigeway. The 2 lanes of traffic were stationary, but the bus lane was clear. I was doing about 25-30mph (slight downhill), there was a pedestrian crossing (lights not a zebra crossing) which was green, but because the traffic was stationary some pedestrian decided they didn't have to wait for pedesterian signal to turn green and stepped out from behind a van.
I just managed to avoid her, leaving most of the tread on the tyres on the road. I don't know if she said anything, but the guy who was about riding 20 yards behind me gave her a right mouthful.
I'm sure when I was taught the green cross code, you never crossed while the signal was red, whatever the road conditions.

bails87

Stiff_Orange
The green cross code means nothing though. That's just like telling kids not to go home with strangers. Good advice when you're a child, but nothing wrong with it when you're a bit older

Obviously the ped shouldn't have stepped out, and should have looked. But there's no reason not to cross just because the red man is showing.

Headhuunter

Stiff_Orange wrote:

I had the similar experience, but in my case I was in a bus lane (where cycling is permitted) along side a dual carrigeway. The 2 lanes of traffic were stationary, but the bus lane was clear. I was doing about 25-30mph (slight downhill), there was a pedestrian crossing (lights not a zebra crossing) which was green, but because the traffic was stationary some pedestrian decided they didn't have to wait for pedesterian signal to turn green and stepped out from behind a van.
I just managed to avoid her, leaving most of the tread on the tyres on the road. I don't know if she said anything, but the guy who was about riding 20 yards behind me gave her a right mouthful.
I'm sure when I was taught the green cross code, you never crossed while the signal was red, whatever the road conditions.

I can see your point of view but I would never, ever fly along a clear bus lane with traffic stationary on 1 side at 25mph+... I've seen too many peds wander through and too many cars pull into bus lanes (illegally) to make a quick and nifty cut into a turn on the left. They generally don't check much before pulling out, like the peds they assume everyone is stationary and glance into the mirror perhaps assuming they might see the bulk of a bus but not checking for a bike. If you're flying along, you'll just slam into the side of them...

I tend to filter at no more than about 18mph and a lot slower if it's not along a wide bus lane...