Why am I not faster on new bike?

wishitwasallflat

PS = m00nd0g thanks for the steer to Time Crunched Cyclist I will definetly check it out.

Bobbinogs

I found the All Condition tyres quite lifeless (they came with my 2010 Secteur Elite too). Something like GP4000s will help you feel like you are zipping along, even if you aren't.

wishitwasallflat

Thanks Bobbinogs - do you still run with the specced wheels and how have you found them?

Bobbinogs

Hi there, I still have the stock wheels but just use the rear for the turbo or the pair for the darkest winter and/or days when the rain is coming down in buckets and the forecast is more of the same

The stock wheels are ok (the rims are bombproof) but there are a few reported problems of the freehub locking up, which is what happened to mine after a winter of abuse. In the end I was 50/50 on replacing/repairing the freehub or rebuilding the wheel with a new hub. I went for the latter for the experience/longterm fix and the 105 hub I bought is definitely nicer.

I would plan on keeping the wheels as they are and thrash them throughout the winter and look at something nice for the spring to give you a timely boost (some nice handbuilts would be good if you are a bit heavy, I went for the RS80s which are fab).

Bottomline is that swapping the wheels won't make you noticeably quicker, but a winter of heavy training will.

wishitwasallflat

Thanks Bobbinogs - good advice which I will take

Fat-Boy-Roubaix

Not sure if this helps, but I was in a similar positon, not sure why but I was grinding, once I started measuring my cadence I discovered the benefits of closer ratios of the road bike gears, I avg 90 now and looking back at my first rides they were 65-70.

Try getting your spin up to 80, not trying to go really fast but go up through the gears changing at 85 sounds basic but it improved my average but more importantly improved my enjoyment!

Once 80-85 feels normal up it a bit more

wishitwasallflat

Thanks Fat-boy- R - seems wise with my knees spinning is the way to go and I do try to keep knee stress to a minimum. I have a basic computer now but will think seriously about getting one with cadence as well - expensive hobby ain't it!

StillGoing

PostieJohn wrote:

It's 'the engine' I'm afraid.

If you took a mini engine and stuck it in a Ferrari it wouldn't go any faster.
Although it might go a little quicker pushing less weight and with better aerodynamics.

Which is what you'll be doing soon enough.

As Fugg says, having a better bike, will make you want to ride more, which will help you lose weight, which will make you ride quicker, and so on.

Don't agree with that. I have a Trek 1.5 with Tiagra that I can maintain a better speed on than on my expensive bike a Basso Astra with SRAM Force/Red. Whilst out yesterday with a friend riding the TREK I noticed that when both of us were coasting he was gapping me on the TREK. When I rode past him he noticed a slight noise that sounds like interference somewhere. The wheels aren't binding but the cranks when they turn feel like there is a tight spot. If I cycle up hill on the Basso it's like trying to cycle through mud whereas on the TREK it's a lot easier. It just doesn't look as nice..

Wirral_paul

philthy3 wrote:

Don't agree with that. I have a Trek 1.5 with Tiagra that I can maintain a better speed on than on my expensive bike a Basso Astra with SRAM Force/Red. Whilst out yesterday with a friend riding the TREK I noticed that when both of us were coasting he was gapping me on the TREK. When I rode past him he noticed a slight noise that sounds like interference somewhere. The wheels aren't binding but the cranks when they turn feel like there is a tight spot. If I cycle up hill on the Basso it's like trying to cycle through mud whereas on the TREK it's a lot easier. It just doesn't look as nice..

You dont agree because your more expensive Basso isn't as quick as your Trek??

Personally i'd fix the blatantly obvious mechanical issue that you have on the Basso before using it as a reason to disagree - you cant really count a bike with a mechanical problem as a specific case, to disprove the generalised comment on the more expensive bike.

I think we can all make the assumption that the more expensive bike would actually fit properly and be in good mechanical condition with the generalisation discussed

StillGoing

We can't agree that. Rather than fly off on one, consider that there may be reasons of a mechanical nature why the OP isn't as quick on his new bike than on his original bike. Enough bikes have come out of a dealers with issues for it not to be unique FFS.

Wirral_paul

philthy3 wrote:

We can't agree that. Rather than fly off on one, consider that there may be reasons of a mechanical nature why the OP isn't as quick on his new bike than on his original bike. Enough bikes have come out of a dealers with issues for it not to be unique FFS.

I've not flown off on one at all.

Maybe you need to clarify why you dont agree then?? You stated that your Trek is faster than your Basso and used that as justification, but then went on to say that an obvious mechanical issue is there with your bike!!

The OP has made no mention of any strange noises so there's no reason to believe he has any mechanical issues

StillGoing

The OP doesn't make any mention of a mechanical issue, you're right. But what I am saying is try thinking outside of the box. It could well be there are mechanical issues with his new bike that are hampering his performance and as yet he is unaware of them. It doesn't necessarily need to be him. With my own mechanical issues it's taken me many months to realise there is an issue and it wasn't until I had the opportunity to have someone ride both bikes by my side that it became obvious. I was putting it down to a long period off the bike due to surgery and was taking me longer to recover. Turns out it isn't that at all as me speed instantly increased when I rode the Trek again, even with the crappy Tiagra gears.

wardieboy

First post on here Chaps, been lurking for a couple of weeks and felt compelled to respond to this thread...

I can relate to this - I decided to get into cycling in July, to improve fitness, with the long term vision of getting away with the lads, for a few weekends next year - touring.

I cobbled together a 'new' mountain bike with a road bias from two old bikes which were rotting in my shed, replaced tyres for slicks, switched headsets and bought new saddle to get as close to a road bike position as I could get. I ended up with a half decent bike, a little on the heavy side but certainly a lot faster than stock.

Started out with a few 7 mile spins and increased to a 20 miler over a few weeks, took the plunge and started regular commuting 10 x 5 miles per week, with extended runs over the weekends. To keep up the fitness levels I started monitoring avg MPH with my android phone - not the most accurate due to GPS being a little jittery but I could race in every day to work trying to beat by personal best. I started out doing the 5 mile commute in at around 23 mins and gradually got that down to 17 minutes on the MTB. There were lots of occasions on flats where I was running out of gears and spinning out, being constantly overtaken by road bikes gave me the urge to switch to a roadie sooner than expected.

I purchased an old roadie from ebay a couple of weeks ago (she may be old, but she's got it where it counts kid). As expected the bike is significantly lighter than the MTB and the gearing ensures I am in no danger of spinning out on the daily commute. I was expecting to see huge savings in on my first run into work due to the switch in bike (which was only this morning btw, after a two week holiday and clocking up 60 miles on the new bike), to my surprise I was only around a minute faster on the roadie.

I was expecting more but thinking about this, I am sure this is down to the relative short distance of my commute. With less junctions, more distance etc the gap would increase much further. Also, I am still after two weeks (unsurprisingly) still not comfortable with the gearings on the roadie - on the MTB I am always on the big ring switching between only 2 - 3 gears on the back, I always feet that I am squeezing the maximum out of the gears (only having 10 gears didn't give too many options but I felt I was always in the right gear at the right time). With the roadie I feel I am not always in the optimal gear for the incline/decline/flat that I am on. The gearing is a totally different ball game, one which I am enjoying getting to grips with!

The biggest thing I have found of benefit which as already been suggested is a computer with cadence measuring, spinning at 85 over a 20 mile run really does put a smile on your face when you get that feeling that you can go on for miles.

My piece of advice to the OP (in my very limited experience) is to 'learn' the new bike, which gear for which hill, flat, decline and to monitor cadence.

wishitwasallflat

Thanks wardieboy (and others) - like you I tweaked my hybrid to get it more like a road bike and replaced a fair few things. Cadence is something I definely need to think about - but only bought a simple SIGMA wired computer a while ago so upgrading to one withe cadence is a leap my wife may not accept. She is super understanding and letting me get a £1k bike was amazing so I don't want to push my luck too far. Selecting gears on the new bike is also a craft to be learned. Riding in the drops is taking time as well although yesterday I did a 50 minute ride (short of time kids swimming lessons) over a flatter than usual route for me and must have managed maybe 60-70% of that time in the drops. I also surprised myself by taking some of the hills in higher gears and speeds than ever before - averaged 15 mph on that run which is 0.5 faster than before but not many hills and no big ones.

Ultimately I think it's the hills and the weight that stops me as I am just still too fat to fly!

One thing I wondered about though - could the wheel bearings be too tight (cup and cone)? Is that something anyone has experienced with Spesh own brand hubs on new bikes - or am I grasping at straws? If that is a common problem, is it as simple as it looks to check and adjust them or should I just ask the place I bought it (Specialised Concept Store) to check it at 6-8 week free service (due in 4-5 weeks)?

Fat man blames (or attempts to blame) tools for physical shortcomings - get off your ass and train more type replies expected of course but any others appreciated.

Bobbinogs

Don't fret too much. Try just concentrating on getting out and riding the bike, enjoying yourself, learning the craft and pushing the mileage up a little at a time each week.

Cadence? Just count out loud as your right leg revolves. "1,000, 2,000, 3,000" means you are doing about 60, "100, 200, 300" is just about right. Simples.

60-70% on the drops? yeegads. I don't see anyone on my club runs doing that because that is chaingang-type effort (and we don't do chaingangs). Hence, don't be afraid to stay on the hoods for most of the time, try a variety of other hand positions too to keep you fresh... and then do some hard work hard on the hills, etc.

I am not saying smoke a cigar on your way around, I am saying don't get too hung up over the minor detail for now like 0.5 up on your average, etc.

wishitwasallflat

Great tip and nice reply bobbinogs thanks - I was a bit raging about lack of time yesterday (I do love the kids but really I should be riding!) and determined to get the speed up and felt pretty comfortable on the drops and pushing hard (no pain no gain). My saddle/bar height is set up pretty flat so the drops aint' as deep as they probably are on proper racer's bikes so maybe that's why it didn't feel too extreme.

Shame about the cigar though I suppose the water bottle full of Stella's got to go as well then?

ak-77

Sounds to me like you're making good progress. If you're still 2 stone from where you're going then burning fat and building muscle will trump any change of bike. I'd concentrate on trying to make the rides longer, not faster. A long low intensity ride is less hard to recover from in my experience than a short intense ride.
Do you commute by bike? If you're not and you live at a reasonable distance that is a super way to get lots of miles in with a minimum of free time invested.

RoadyForever

Look at it this way, A stone is about what a bike weights - so you're carrying another two bikes around with you in your stomach and arse!

I lost a stone recently (within the last month infact ), I got too consumed with work and let myself go + crappy diet). Not having to carry that extra weight around is really noticeable when you're on a bike!

PostieJohn

It is a fine line between getting more from your cycling and over cooking it.
Diet and exercise will give you everything and more you crave it just takes time.
Don't run the risk of injury by, for example, balls out riding on your drops when you're not used to it, as a month off your bike will feel like forever.

I don't ever ride on drops, unless it's windy.

wishitwasallflat

Good advice much appreciated.

Re riding on drops: well being new to a road bike I kind of feel like the drops are there so better use them. On the plus side I pretty much don't get any hand numbness or tingling anymore mxing positions and in the drops doesn't seem to press on the nerves or carpla tunnel area at all. Also I like riding in them cause I feel my core and upper body working more. Will take your advice though Postie for sure and build slowly (at my age and with the two spare bikes on board as padding) I don't really have much choice on that one!

Keith1983

Well, I've just read the whole of this thread and find some of the posts a bit derogatory, but then this is the internet so it's somewhat inevitable.

I am relatively new to cycling and have a very modest bike. First of all to the OP, WELL DONE! Losing 2 stone no matter how you do it is an achievement. I think your target of 15mph is both realistic and achievable. Trying to increase your speed over a given distance will hopefully mean you maintain your weight loss which I think is your aim here? Keep enjoying your cycling and good luck with your goals.

PostieJohn

How's it going now?
I know it's only been a couple of weeks, but thought I'd check in with this thread, I was a little worried you were going to do yourself some damage, pushing to hard.

DavidJB

Wirral_Paul wrote:

As above really - I dont think you'll see much difference in average speed "out of the box" unless there is significant differences in say, the wheels/tyres. If your new bike came with 50mm+ deep section aero wheels and low rolling resistance tyres then you "might" see a 0.5-1mph increase.

More importantly really - is the new bike more comfortable / smoother / enjoyable to ride?? If so then you'll probably find you can ride a little further rather than faster but most importantly enjoy your cycling more. This as said above is the most important thing. Speed will come naturally to you when you get fitter / train more for speed. As weight loss is important to you now - then relax and enjoy your riding. 2 stone lost so far so you're clearly doing something right - keep up that great work

Doubt he'd see any speed increase using aero wheels @ 14MPH tbh. Read loads of times that they only start to make a difference over 20MPH.

wishitwasallflat

Delighted to hear anyone is still interested - I stopped replying to the thread as I didn't want to hijack this and turn it into a personal blog - but seeing as someone asked ...

It's going great - my route is now 25 miles two to three times a week (was 20 before I got the new bike) and my average speed has crept up as high as 14.88 mph for a fair few of those rides (was 14.5)! As many suggested with the new bike it feels more comfortable (still not entireley convinced re the 155mm BG Avatar Gel saddle and considering a change but with my sit bones measuring plus 160mm choice seems limited) and enjoyable and I love riding it even though there was no dramatic increase in speed.

I am trying to forget about speed and get up to those 2-3 hour rides that everyone says help burn the fat - at the moment its about 1.75 hours to do 25-6 miles. I definetely notice an improvement in speeds on shorter and lower gradient hills and I can almost fool myself that I can climb (I do see red dots floating before my eyes sometimes on the steeper and longer hills but sadly that's blood pressure rather than my jersey!). I have to say thanks though to whoever it was on the Scott with the white (Shwalbe Ultremo?) tyres who cruised past me (apparenlty effortlessly!) on the hill at Walworth castle hotel a few weeks ago for helping me recontact reality!

Anyway thank you for being interested and fat man continues to shrink and get (just a little bit) faster!

markos1963

HI Wishit
Well done on your efforts so far.
I have seen quite a few riders on Sectuers and one thing that strikes me is the position they are riding in. It is a very upright and admittidly comfortable one. I would say that your reason for a lack of increase in speed over your previous bike is probably due to aerodynamics. So many people get het up over aero frames, wheels and kit as well as stressing over weight of their bikes when all they need is to take a few spacers out of the steerer tube and lower their body position. You may well have noticed an improvement when riding on the drops, I know I do, I can gain 1-2mph just by doing that without any extra effort. If you look at the majority of the top end bikes they all tend to have short head tubes and aggresive riding positions, this is the main reason the owners of them go so quick(apart from having good engines!)
I would look at your position on the bike and see if you can improve it. Can you take out any spacers? Is the stem pointing skywards? Could I live with a deeper drop bar? Don't take it too extreems too quickly, move a spacer at a time and ride for a week or so with it.
I 'm sure the extra speed will come, the Sectuer is a good bike but you'll need to tinker with it to get the best out of you.


Ps definatly invest in some better tyres, they will improve things no end. I use Ultremo R1 from JE James, only £20 each

wishitwasallflat

Cheers markos good tips and will chekc thos etyres out on JE.

Yes I am pretty upright and am working towards more aero postion but with a history of low back problems I am taking it very slowly and reckon I will change things only once I am really confortable at 25 miles plus - at present even moslty on the hoods my back is sometimes grumbling from 20+. Someone else posted a reccomendation for changing the tyres as well. The spesh all conditions it come with are apparently heavy and lifeless. I am just trying to decide whether to do it now or let these ones take the winter wear (I ride outside in all weathers) (well all except ice and snow!) and replace in the spring.

PostieJohn

All good stuff.
I'm glad it's going well and your getting enjoyment from all aspects of cycling, instead of beating yourself up over 0.5mph, (a little harsh but it certainly seemed the way you were going!).
Tyres are important, after all they are the only contact with the ground.
You might have a point about waiting for spring, but if you're running the tyres I took of Wifey's Dolce you need to get rid asap.
They weren't even cylindrical with an 'edge' running halfway down the side wall.

wishitwasallflat

Cheers postie I will pop out and check them now - do you mean an edge running around paralel to the rim or from inside to out? The ones I have a spesh all conditions and they have a slick centre and ridges on the outside edges. I must admit I have littel to compare them to but when someone said lifeless feel I thought yea immediately.

PostieJohn

You'd know these buggers if you saw them.
They were almost square, you had a slightly curved contact point, ridge, before coming back into the wheel.
Think of, ( above \ /, with a definite hard line 'join' between the symbols, and you'd have the profile of these beasts.

I gave her such a hard time about her riding etc, and all she could say was 'well I don't know why I'm so slow'.

It was only when I had a proper look at her tyres did I realise why it wasn't so smooth for her, I felt so guilty I almost told her!.

gilesjuk

One of the most limiting factors on a bike is aerodynamics. For example if you get a recumbent trike, fit a plastic aero shell over it you can easily hit high speed an upright cyclist can only dream of. One guy in the midlands claims to get up to 50MPH on his.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/stoke/hi/pe ... 369458.stm

So you need to try to increase your aerodynamics or become stronger.