Energy food

jame58rown

When do you think 'proper' energy foods such as gels become "acceptable"? (for want of a better word) I realise that if one is trying to lose weight then energy products aren't really such a good idea, but I weigh 58kg and if anything, I'm looking to gain a bit of muscle and hence weight.

I don't like the idea of using energy gels and looking like a 'poser' when a banana or cereal bar would do My rides are usualy 40 - 60km I'm always hungry afterwards and do get hungry on the bike, but I just don't know whether spending a load of money on gels just to have a slightly more comfortable last 20 minutes is worth it.

So, when do energy products really become necassary? Should I just stick to flapjacks and bananas?

Thanks.

amaferanga

For racing and emergencies.

I eat soreen and muesli bars mostly on training rides. Can't remember the last time I used a gel other than in races.

noiseboyfeetman

I put a flapjack in may back pocket for rides of 50+ miles, gels I might consider for longer rides of 70+ miles. For rides of 40 - 60km you shouldn't need gels, its probably just a case of eating correctly beforehand and your body getting used to it, i'd stick to flapjacks and bananas.

BeaconRuth

Exactly what Amaferanga said - for racing and emergencies. I don't think I've ever bought a gel or a specific sports energy-bar product because the ones I get given as freebies tend to go out of date before I use them. The last time I used a gel was towards the end of a 100-mile TT three years ago. Ordinary solid food does me fine - bananas, biscuits, jelly babies, jaffa cakes, flapjack.....

Ruth

jibberjim

I use gels all the time, simply because they are _much_ cheaper than using all that "real food" unless you buy extremely crap real food chock full of cheap saturated fats.

danowat

amaferanga wrote:

For racing and emergencies.

I eat soreen and muesli bars mostly on training rides. Can't remember the last time I used a gel other than in races.

This ^, although I don't use anything on training rides.....

amaferanga

jibberjim wrote:

I use gels all the time, simply because they are _much_ cheaper than using all that "real food" unless you buy extremely crap real food chock full of cheap saturated fats.

Cheaper than bananas and soreen?

jame58rown

Thanks for the replies, looks like I may stick to just food :P

jibberjim wrote:

I use gels all the time, simply because they are _much_ cheaper than using all that "real food" unless you buy extremely crap real food chock full of cheap saturated fats.

Which energy gels are these?

jibberjim

amaferanga wrote:

jibberjim wrote:

I use gels all the time, simply because they are _much_ cheaper than using all that "real food" unless you buy extremely crap real food chock full of cheap saturated fats.

Cheaper than bananas and soreen?

Gel - 10p per 100 calories
Banana - 15p per banana ~100 calories
Soreeen - 8p per 100 calories slice

So, no not cheaper than Soreen, but I don't like Malt loaf so that's not an option for me, but yes it's cheaper than a Banana.

danowat

jibberjim wrote:

amaferanga wrote:

jibberjim wrote:

I use gels all the time, simply because they are _much_ cheaper than using all that "real food" unless you buy extremely crap real food chock full of cheap saturated fats.

Cheaper than bananas and soreen?

Gel - 10p per 100 caloriesBanana - 15p per banana ~100 calories
Soreeen - 8p per 100 calories slice

So, no not cheaper than Soreen, but I don't like Malt loaf so that's not an option for me, but yes it's cheaper than a Banana.

:shock: can you tell me where you get your gels from please!

Ron Stuart

The only times when sports specific energy fuels are useful is when because of duration and rate of consumption of fuel stored, ordinary real food cannot be absorbed quickly enough.
With a combination of energy drinks and gels later on in long high intensity rides this can offset the hunger knock. Gels can be a bit of a bail-out if not enough consumption of real food fuel earlier hasn't been achieved but gels can be hard on the digestive system and in my opinion shouldn't need to be part of a leisure ride or medium intensity training/fitness riding.
There has been a large sports fuel industry sprung up around the boom in sportive/leisure riding with lectures going on up and down the country. I often ride with a guy who won the Tour of Britain in 1955 at the ripe old age of 21 then he went on to do the continental seen and the TDF and he tells me the average pace for stage races in those days was around 23 mph woolly jumpers heavy bikes, no sports fuel, worse roads and all, 50 years on it's around 26 mph.
You don’t need special sports fuel for low/medium intensity rides just plenty H2O flavored and any or some of these if you like, banana, fig biscuits, malt loaf, malt cake bars and/or café stop. Save your money for good quality comfortable clothing and a nice a holiday in classic bike country. 8)

amaferanga

jibberjim wrote:

Gel - 10p per 100 calories

Well since you've quoted regular prices for the bananas and soreen then its only fair that you do the same for gels (of course bananas are cheaper if you buy a box of 100). Which shop sells gels for less than 10p each?

SIS Go gel for example - 88kcal per sachet and typically cost about £1. So that's more like 114p per 100kcal.

jibberjim

amaferanga wrote:

jibberjim wrote:

Gel - 10p per 100 calories

Well since you've quoted regular prices for the bananas and soreen then its only fair that you do the same for gels (of course bananas are cheaper if you buy a box of 100). Which shop sells gels for less than 10p each?

I make them for that cost, indeed I actually make them around half that price, but that's due to discounts etc.

How exactly can you buy bananas by the 100? They'd go off surely?

jame58rown

Ron Stuart wrote:

The only times when sports specific energy fuels are useful is when because of duration and rate of consumption of fuel stored, ordinary real food cannot be absorbed quickly enough.
With a combination of energy drinks and gels later on in long high intensity rides this can offset the hunger knock. Gels can be a bit of a bail-out if not enough consumption of real food fuel earlier hasn't been achieved but gels can be hard on the digestive system and in my opinion shouldn't need to be part of a leisure ride or medium intensity training/fitness riding.
There has been a large sports fuel industry sprung up around the boom in sportive/leisure riding with lectures going on up and down the country. I often ride with a guy who won the Tour of Britain in 1955 at the ripe old age of 21 then he went on to do the continental seen and the TDF and he tells me the average pace for stage races in those days was around 23 mph woolly jumpers heavy bikes, no sports fuel, worse roads and all, 50 years on it's around 26 mph.
You don’t need special sports fuel for low/medium intensity rides just plenty H2O flavored and any or some of these if you like, banana, fig biscuits, malt loaf, malt cake bars and/or café stop. Save your money for good quality comfortable clothing and a nice a holiday in classic bike country. 8)

Thanks for a good reply

danowat

jibberjim wrote:

amaferanga wrote:

jibberjim wrote:

Gel - 10p per 100 calories

Well since you've quoted regular prices for the bananas and soreen then its only fair that you do the same for gels (of course bananas are cheaper if you buy a box of 100). Which shop sells gels for less than 10p each?

I make them for that cost, indeed I actually make them around half that price, but that's due to discounts etc.

Right, thats a little different, whats you recipe?

jibberjim

danowat wrote:

Right, thats a little different, whats you recipe?

http://jibbering.com/sports/gels.html

MartinGT

I use Gels & Bars when out on most rides of 50km. I have Gels & bars on all rides but only use them on an emergancy, which is rarely.

The thing with Gels & Bars, they get into you quicker than Soreen & Bannana. A Bannana can take a good hour to kick in.

To the OP. Youre 58kg and youre trying to gain muscle? I am afraid Gels & Bars aint going to do that. The use of these gels are more sugar than carbs and using them sat at a desk would be daft, but youre hardly going to gain weight using them.

Its normaly to be hungry after a ride unless you have overloaded on food pre or during the ride. Get some protein in you after the ride, best window to do it is 1h after.

Ron Stuart

MartinGT wrote:

I use Gels & Bars when out on most rides of 50km. I have Gels & bars on all rides but only use them on an emergancy, which is rarely.

The thing with Gels & Bars, they get into you quicker than Soreen & Bannana. A Bannana can take a good hour to kick in.

To the OP. Youre 58kg and youre trying to gain muscle? I am afraid Gels & Bars aint going to do that. The use of these gels are more sugar than carbs and using them sat at a desk would be daft, but youre hardly going to gain weight using them.

Its normaly to be hungry after a ride unless you have overloaded on food pre or during the ride. Get some protein in you after the ride, best window to do it is 1h after.

Not really a good idea to idea to wait till you have a problem with energy levels before taking on more carbs, granted that gels will deliver more quickly than solids but need with the exception of isotonic ‘Go gels’ plenty of water to work properly.
Certainly Soreen (malt loaf) isn’t quick to absorb into the system but that is what makes it a great fuel for early in a longer ride as it acts as a slow release fuel like raisins and other dried fruit. You shouldn’t class bananas into the same bracket as malt loaf as it is much quicker to release into the system. This is why you see certain top pro tennis players taking half a banana at times between games during a match.

Agreed with the need for protein after the ride 1hr min is good.

Another tip is on your ride is to bung a hydration tablet in one of your bottles around halfway to offset possible cramps on a hot day but don’t over hydrate in hot weather as this will only wash out more salts and minerals and lead to more likelihood of cramping.
Probably more use abroad :!:

amaferanga

jibberjim wrote:

amaferanga wrote:

jibberjim wrote:

Gel - 10p per 100 calories

Well since you've quoted regular prices for the bananas and soreen then its only fair that you do the same for gels (of course bananas are cheaper if you buy a box of 100). Which shop sells gels for less than 10p each?

I make them for that cost, indeed I actually make them around half that price, but that's due to discounts etc.

How exactly can you buy bananas by the 100? They'd go off surely?

Well yes of course the bananas would go off, but you were comparing apples with oranges. Now since it turns out you make the gels its more like comparing apples with pianos.

Jamie Mullen

Hats off to jibberjim for a great write up on the gel making process. Reminds me of a thread on the Mens Health forum about making your own protein bars for a fraction of the RRP.

To the OP, putting on weight (good weight) and engaging in any form of regular cardio over an hour in duration is going to be tough. As others have said, the diet required to build muscle and the diet required for endurance are two different things.

danowat

I buy gels for convieniance when racing (and possibly laziness), that convienance goes out the window when I have to start cooking!!!!

BeaconRuth

danowat wrote:

I buy gels for convieniance when racing (and possibly laziness), that convienance goes out the window when I have to start cooking!!!!

+1. (Although I would spell 'convenience' correctly. )

Priorities and perspectives a bit awry IMO. A lot of effort to find a cheaper solution to a problem which doesn't exist.

I'm off out for a ride and I think I'll grab a banana from the fruit bowl on my way out. I think I can afford 15p today, I'll get some additional vitamins, minerals and fibre thrown in for good measure and that will be perfectly adequate for my purposes.

Ruth

keef66

" these gels are more sugar than carbs "

I think you'll find that sugar is a carbohydrate.

Are you perhaps trying to point out that gels contain simple carbs like sugars (rapidly absorbed / utilised, high glycaemic index)

as opposed to complex carbs which you'd find in eg a banana or flapjack (slower to digest / absorb, but with a low glycaemic index so you get a sustained release of energy from them?

I'm in the flapjack / nana / fig roll /malt loaf camp. Water or very weak squash in the bottles; + electrolyte tab if it's really hot. Jelly babies are my choice for an emergency fix

Ron Stuart

BeaconRuth wrote:

danowat wrote:

I buy gels for convieniance when racing (and possibly laziness), that convienance goes out the window when I have to start cooking!!!!

+1. (Although I would spell 'convenience' correctly. )

Priorities and perspectives a bit awry IMO. A lot of effort to find a cheaper solution to a problem which doesn't exist.

I'm off out for a ride and I think I'll grab a banana from the fruit bowl on my way out. I think I can afford 15p today, I'll get some additional vitamins, minerals and fibre thrown in for good measure and that will be perfectly adequate for my purposes.

Ruth

+2 (go easy on the miss-spellers) Ruth.

I remember meeting you at that Trading Estate café near Hartlebury after doing the Snowdrop Express audax a few years back. I was the one with the faded Assos airblock yellow jacket and you had a nice new looking yellow one on. Is that the jacket on your website?
You also seem to have a similar overview to me on the subject of sports nutrition as well as clothing.

Good on you, nice to hear someone doing the coaching and not selling something else as well.

Also some of my comments previous were made with others in mind and those that do longer rides.

danowat

I can never spell that word!

Ron Stuart

danowat wrote:

I can never spell that word!

Could be a pronunciation thing. I often muse at Charlton Kirby’s pronunciation of peloton his version sounds more like ‘pelerun’

kev77

That gel thread is quality!

I am sending the misses out for ingredients, guess who's cooking this weekend!