Headset Help. My heads battered

johnnygooner

I'm looking to replace my worn headset with the Cane Creek Angleset. My Bike is a 2011 Orange Alpine 160 with the tapered head tube. The calculator on the Cane Creek website is about as easy to understand as the mandarin translated version of Tolstoys War & Peace. Does anyone have any experience of this product? Firstly, does anyone know if they make one that fits? From my investigation it seems not. I appreciate the actual head angle adjustment is dependent on the head ttube length, but am I right in thinking that once installed the head angle can be adjusted? Perhaps not out on the trail but adjusted all the same. The calculator seems to suggest not. I would have thought the cup(s) rotates to acheive variants in the head angle but to me the website seems to suggest that you decide which adjustment you want before buying.

My heads battered and this coming from a chartered Engineer!! Albeit structural. Can anybody help?

nicklouse

so first thing first what fitting does your frame have for the headset? and you had better have a straight 1 1/8the steerer on the fork or it is new fork time.

Pics of yours if you dont know. (yes they do have one to fit but....)

adjustment requires the removal of the headset and re fitting.

johnnygooner

Thanks for the response. My fork is a Fox 36 Float with a tapered steerer tube 1 1/8" - 1.5" however I dont know and cant seem to find out the intternal diameters of the head tube. I guess I'd have to drop the fork and push the headset cups out and measure it. Not sure I fancy that just to measure the headtube.

What can you make from that?

nicklouse

and the frame is a? look at the headset standards info on Parktools or the link in the FAQs but as states Tapered fork and you would need a new fork.

johnnygooner

The frame is an Orange Alpine 160. Thanks for the advice but by the sound of it I'll probably just put a new Hope headset in. Would've liked to play about with different head tube angles but defo not prepared to spend £800 on a new fork as well as nearly £200 on the Angleset just to do so

johnnygooner

Gonna resurrect this one as, unless I've misunderstood him, Nicklouse maybe wrong. I'm now pretty certain I can get a Cane Creek Angleset to fit my Orange Alpine/Fox 36 Float forks with tapered steerer tube. Seemingly though, to match up the dimensions of the above combo, the bottom part of the headset is of the external cup (EC) type rather than zero stack (ZS) type it came with giving an increased stack height of about 13mm. Question 1; Will that difference bring about a noticeable change in the bikes geometry?
Question 2; Does changing the head angle involve changing the headset cups and if so how easy is that to do?

Thanks in advance

nicklouse

1; half a degree.

and as above the cups need removing.

still dont believe you can Link to what makes you think you can get a suitable lower cup?

HandjobDan

Don't forget about the raise in BB height also depending on length of frame. Changing BB heights can seriously affect handling.

johnnygooner

The Standardised Headset Identification System (SHIS) for the head tube/fork combo on my Orange Alpine 160, assuming Zero Stack top and bottom as came with the bike thus maintaining the geometry as it was intended is ZS44/28.6 at the top, that is an internal bore of 44mm in the head tube and steerer tube diameter of 28.6mm, and ZS56/40 at the bottom which translates to an internal bore of 56mm in the head tube base and a crown race seat diameter of 40mm. Cane Creek offer their Angleset headset in ZS44 top with an EC56 bottom which conforms to the required dimensions. 

So all of the above is why I think I can get a Cane Creek Angleset to fit.

Is it much of a job to change the cups? What's the process? Are there any specialist tools involved?

Good point re the change in height of the bottom bracket. Hadn't considered that. Although the difference in stack height would be more like 8-9mm rather than the 13mm as I noted in an earlier post due to the fact that even zero stack headsets do actually have some stack height!! Without doing the trigonometry, which I will do once I get some dims, I'm guessing the change of height of the bottom bracket couldn't be anymore than about 4mm. Is that enough to make a difference?

All advice greatly received

nicklouse

Ahh I see they have updated their site and range.

looks like you can do what you want. But note the angle is not adjustable it is a fit and use as is.

there is a good video on their webby showing how it is done.

HandjobDan

Probably not noticeably if any. My Spitfire frame has adjustable geometry and they quote a BB height change of around 16mm which most riders say translates to a fair change in handling. With your measurements you're looking at a quarter of that so I doubt you'd notice.

johnnygooner

Thanks for the comments

Dan, thought as much.

Nick, can you elaborate on your last posting. The change in head angle comes from the offset in the cup as can be seen and as is explained in the video. The headset comes with the different cups and to change the head angle involves changing the offset cup. In your last post you say the angle is not adjustable. It seems to me that it is! Are you suggesting they want nearly £200 pounds for an ordinary headset? Have I misunderstood you?

Your comments will be greatly appreciated

nicklouse

OK there is the basic kit (one set of cups) and the full kit. one fixed cup and three alternative angle cups.

but yes once the cups have been fitted it is not adjustable. it would need removing and refitting after having been rotated 180 degrees or replaced with one of the other cups from the kit.

the parts the provide the adjustment are the black cups.

johnnygooner

Right I'm having a go. I'm gonna get one.

Nick, the 'adjustment' is in the fitting of the offset cup only and the headset comes with the full range ie 3 cups.

Im gonna buy the tool for knocking the cup out as its only £35 from chain reaction.

Watch this space!

nicklouse

and for pressing them in? there are presses for about 35 quid or make your own.