Build a bike or Cyclescam it?

mowflow

I have a dilema as per the title.

My current situation is that I'm getting more and more into road. Like the people in every second post I was a mountain biker but am finding road more accessible and enjoyable now that life is more hectic.

I've never bought a road bike but have a Ribble 7005 Audax that was pulled out a skip and have been hammering about on that. As I'm now getting more serious and actually thinking about joining a club I'm thinking it would be nice to get something that actually fits (I've always felt a bit stretched on the Ribble).

As is so common I have the Cyclescheme available to me through work. This would allow me to get any of the usual suspects from LBSs. I won't list them all as they've been done to death on here.

The other option is to buy one of the Chinese carbon frames as discussed in another thread. Shift the FUlcrum wheelset, Campagnolo Mirage/veloce groupset over from the Ribble and build myself a bike.

I've always built my own bikes in the past and love to tinker. I'm just not sure what would be a better ride and what would be most cost effective. Builds always have a habit of spiraling.

What would you do?

petemadoc

If you can get a bike on the cycle to work scheme it's a no brainer . . . . the sales have just started so treat yourself to the best you can afford.

There will still be upgrades to tinker with

mowflow

Trouble is that we use Cyclescheme which stuffs the LBS for 10% apparently so they never let you get anything that's been discounted, or at least that's what i've heard. I did ask my boss about using the Wiggle scheme so I could get the Cayo but he was confused why I couldn't just get any old bike.

petemadoc

The cyclescheme still makes sense for 99% of people but you want to get the right bike and not just something your LBS push on you cos that's the one with the most profit or they have the most stock of. If it's a decent LBS then ask to try a few out, they're bound to have something that suits.

If they turn out to be a pants LBS then push your boss for the wiggle voucher

if you boss won't go for it then buy a Chinese frame and build it up .

Be warned . . . . . the cost will spiral

I'm no expert but I reckon some of those frames on ebay that sell for £250 posted are probably pretty good. I ended up ordering one from carbonzone with a paint job that all in cost £400. I'm not even going to add up the rest or I'll just cry.

rolf_f

PeteMadoc wrote:

I'm no expert but I reckon some of those frames on ebay that sell for £250 posted are probably pretty good. I ended up ordering one from carbonzone with a paint job that all in cost £400. I'm not even going to add up the rest or I'll just cry.

They are good value but make no sense if you have access to C2W. Many of those Chinese frames are the same as some of those used by the likes of Ribble - and they only charge about £450 for them anyway. Once you account for the C2W discount on the frame and the rest of the bike the sensible route is obvious. FWIW, I got a full Campagnolo Centaur on C2W for about £1200.

The DIY route has to be more fun though!

mowflow

How did you manage that rolf? I thought the limit was 1000.

petemadoc

I think you have to put the extra £200 cash in yourself.

turboslave

Ribble and planet x both offer purchasing by cyclesheme, this would allow you to build up one of thier frames to the spec you want.

last year I bought my madone on the scheme 2.5K, then spent another £400 personalising it to the right spec/fit. oh and a wheel upgrade.

This year I bought an argon 18 for £1600, again on the scheme, this was discounted from 2K and I was able to build it to the spec I wanted, inc tyres bars saddle etc so no more spent on it This has turned out to be a better buy than the madonne.

September brings a new member to the family, and yes it will be on cyclescheme, its a no brainer, but I will only buy a bike I can get to my required spec, its always good to get to know your LBS, no more off the peg for me.

I like others also came over from MTBong many years ago and although I still enjoy the off road rides I find the road so much more appealing, no more cleaning off the cack, constant servicing and replacing rims cables tyres chains, just hop on, work out and put the bike away ready for the next ride.

Good luck

CakeLovinBeast

mowflow wrote:

How did you manage that rolf? I thought the limit was 1000.

I've been to plenty of LBS's recently that will let you use the C2W money as a "deposit" and add as much as you like on to that... It's not entirely legit, but then you're also supposed to use the bike for commuting and I know plenty of people who don't do that either...

dcurzon

considered self build, also considered C2W. Close call really... Taking Ribble as an example, using the BikeBuilder, if i want to upgrade from Sora to 105, its an additional £239, and change the wheels from the ProLite Como, to RS80, is an additional £300.

Ribble sell the Como's for £103, and the RS80's for £312, so in reality, the upgrade to RS80 should only be an additional £209, not £300
They sell Sora for for £195, and 105 for £415, so the upgrade should only be £220, not £240.
So they have made an additional £110 right there, on top of their own normal retail price...

self build brings the satisfaction of knowing that you have built it all up yourself, but obviously theres the possibility of also fucking it all up yourself too!

mowflow

I'll be paying a couple of LBSs a visit over the next week to try some bikes to see if anything really grabs me and if there are any deals to be had. So far have got Cannondale CAAD8 105, Synapse 105, Felt F(something) and Cube attempt down for looking at but i'll see what's in store. I had a look at Ribble but when I specced a bike the price quickly spiraled out of control.

The trouble I'm having is that I don't really want to throw extra money at the voucher even though I do have a couple of hundred spare. I really like the smoothness of the Campagnolo groupset on my current bike, even though it's basic, but can't see anything in the price range that's got Campag (when I spec a carbon Ribble with campag the price shoots through the roof unless you take wheels that weigh a ton).

I keep thinking about the fact that a voucher bike will cost me £70 a month or so (maths isn't my strong point) where as a Chinese carbon frame would be a £300ish initial outlay and that's it since I like all the other components from my current bike. But on the other hand, the thought of having something shiny and new for once is very appealing.

Thanks for all the advice, I'll let you know what I end up doing

CakeLovinBeast

I'm in roughly a similar position, though I don't really have anything spare right now and coming from a mountain bike background, I wouldn't be 100% confident in building up a road bike for myself in any case. Our C2W scheme at work is run via Halfords, but to give them their due, they've sourced me a Cube Attempt which I ultimately decided was the bike for me. I just had to hunt a bit to find the right LBS to give me the advice I needed to make an informed decision...

mowflow wrote:

...I keep thinking about the fact that a voucher bike will cost me £70 a month or so (maths isn't my strong point)...

Bear in mind that that number is the cost from your GROSS salary. In terms of actual NET loss, the amount is more like £50 (assuming you use the full £1000)

mowflow

I know what you mean about Ribble dcurzon. The price of upgrades seemed a little over the top in some cases and the price of speccing the bike as you want quickly rises. I kept thinking what's the point on spending £1000 on a bike where everything apart from the frame is worse than what I currently have when I can buy a frame for a fraction.

Was supposed to be checking out a Cube Attempt this afternoon but the store that advertised don't actually have any. They sounded like numpties on the phone to be honest. It's not looking good for the Cyclescheme option.

rolf_f

dcurzon wrote:

considered self build, also considered C2W. Close call really... Taking Ribble as an example, using the BikeBuilder, if i want to upgrade from Sora to 105, its an additional £239, and change the wheels from the ProLite Como, to RS80, is an additional £300.

Bike Builder is a pricey way of doing it - the Special Edition bikes are cheaper but much less upgrade choice. But for C2W perfectly fine as the 1k limit cuts down on bling. I just upgraded to Centaur which was the bulk of the top up over 1k. I do use the bike for commuting so the basic finishing kit and slightly clumpy Khamsins make sense.

mowflow

Update. Been to see 2 bikes so far.

First bike, Cube Attempt. Felt comfortable in the 56 but stretched in the 60, sadly no 58 in stock and none available with the double. It was a bonus that the 56 had a double as I'd only seen triples and that was the main turn offs for me. First experience with Shimano and although it was 105 I didn't notice any improvement compared to my relatively low spec and heavily used Campag Mirage. The bike did still do it for me to some degree.

Second bike, Cannondale Synapse. Was a bit unsure of this one, but won't be able to tell for sure until the test ride on Monday. Components are comparable with the Cube but the geometry is more relaxed which I don't think will suit me. I prefer to do shorter 20 - 30 mile rides where I hammer it as fast as possible and From what I hear this isn't really this bikes purpose. There is another shop with a CAAD8 which may be more suitable but it's quite far away and getting there is a problem. We'll see how the test ride goes.

I've pretty much wrote off the Chinese carbon idea. I was getting too caught up in just wanting carbon for the sake of having it. Although in saying that I am now starting to consider the Ribble option. After being underwhelmed with 105 I feel that Veloce or Xenon might be preferable on a Ribble which makes it affordable for me.

petemadoc

mowflow wrote:

Update. Been to see 2 bikes so far.

First bike, Cube Attempt. Felt comfortable in the 56 but stretched in the 60, sadly no 58 in stock and none available with the double. It was a bonus that the 56 had a double as I'd only seen triples and that was the main turn offs for me. First experience with Shimano and although it was 105 I didn't notice any improvement compared to my relatively low spec and heavily used Campag Mirage. The bike did still do it for me to some degree.

Second bike, Cannondale Synapse. Was a bit unsure of this one, but won't be able to tell for sure until the test ride on Monday. Components are comparable with the Cube but the geometry is more relaxed which I don't think will suit me. I prefer to do shorter 20 - 30 mile rides where I hammer it as fast as possible and From what I hear this isn't really this bikes purpose. There is another shop with a CAAD8 which may be more suitable but it's quite far away and getting there is a problem. We'll see how the test ride goes.

I've pretty much wrote off the Chinese carbon idea. I was getting too caught up in just wanting carbon for the sake of having it. Although in saying that I am now starting to consider the Ribble option. After being underwhelmed with 105 I feel that Veloce or Xenon might be preferable on a Ribble which makes it affordable for me.

If you can be sure of the geometry you want then I'd go for a Ribble. You can spec it with whatever you want although the special edition bikes work out cheaper than using the bike builder thing. The new sportive racing looks pretty smart and I don't think the geometry is too relaxed if you run it without any headset spacers.

mowflow

Ribble is looking a more attractive option to be honest. Never heard a bad word about the frames (sportive or Gran Fondo) and although the other parts would be basic it would allow me to stay with a Campagnolo groupset and give me reason to gradually upgrade parts satisfying my tinkering needs.

rolf_f

mowflow wrote:

(when I spec a carbon Ribble with campag the price shoots through the roof unless you take wheels that weigh a ton).

Are you sure - when I specc'd bikes on Ribble, the wheel cost/weight + groupset options always worked out roughly equivalent. Certainly, they always seem to have one wheel option that is a good bit lighter than cheapest for a good price but the next option, whether Campag or Shimano, always seems to be marginally lighter still but vastly more expensive.

But I do use my GF for commuting so the basic Khamsins were a sensible non upgrade.

Edit - a bad word on the Gran Fondo; brittle paint. Chips and cracks a bit too easily. Nothing excessive though.
And another - doesn't come with a chainstay protector

alan_sherman

Maybe just buy a frame that fits? may even be able to re-use your forks.

Planet X team alu is a good buy
http://www.planet-x-bikes.co.uk/i/q/FRP ... -alu-frame

A club mate used to have one and rated it. he only bought it when his canyon had to be sent back to Germany leaving him without a frame temporarily.

mowflow

I'm not sure I follow you Rolf. I was wrong anyway, the reason the price was jumping so much was because I was always picking one groupset up from basic and that was boosting the price rather than the wheels.

With no intention of racing to any serious level and with roads like moon base alpha around here the reality is that basics would really do me. I can always upgrade later and shift the downgrades to my Ribble Audax.

I used to think I was quite decisive. I'm probably putting more thought into what bike than I have into any other decision in my life.

rolf_f

mowflow wrote:

I'm not sure I follow you Rolf. I was wrong anyway, the reason the price was jumping so much was because I was always picking one groupset up from basic and that was boosting the price rather than the wheels.

I just meant that it looked to me like the options for the Campag and Shimano equiped bikes seemed fairly equivalent. ie there wasn't anything that would make one groupset seem like a no brainer because that had, for example, much lighter, cheaper wheels available.

Sounds like you should just go with the Special Edition bikes option. The only upgrade I got was the Centaur groupset (and that was partly just to get the cartridge brakes - I'd originally gone for those as a sole upgrade to otherwise Veloce but it worked out that double the extra cost of the brakes bought the entire groupset!).

mowflow

Ah right, got you now. Yeah, there isn't a huge price difference or weight difference between the three groupsets at any comparable level, there's probably only £10 - £20 in it. Just trying to keep within the £1000, keep my preference for Campagnolo and get as good a spec as possible really.... This is of course if I do go for a Ribble. Another ride on a Shimano equiped bike should seal it either way.

Alan. Thanks for the suggestion but I'm not a fan of the Planet X frames purely because they don't do it for me visually. I know that's shallow but I'm a designer so I make a living out of being shallow.

RedJohn

mowflow wrote:

Trouble is that we use Cyclescheme which stuffs the LBS for 10% apparently.

Correct - all the 3rd party voucher schemes do this.