South Downs Way on a loaded bike?

EnglishChris

hi,

I'm planning my first tour in the summer, down through France and Switzerland and will be trying to do a fair bit of it offroad. I'll be doing it on an On-One Inbred, probably with rigid forks.

I wanted a little dry run in the UK, close to London, with all the kit etc and had considered doing the South (or North) Downs Way..l. This would be fully loaded, with camping gear.

I've read a couple of forum comments (other forums) where people have advised not to try it on a rigid bike and definitely not to try it with panniers!

Has anyone got any experience of the route and whether its doable like this?

Cheers!

andymiller

People on cycle forums are often predicting dire consequences if you do x or don't do y. Provided you don't carry too much it's perfectly do-able on a rigid bike with panniers. Jumps and big drop-offs at speed are probably not a good idea.

EnglishChris

andymiller wrote:

People on cycle forums are often predicting dire consequences if you do x or don't do y.

Indeed I agree. Is there much terrain like that (jumps / drop offs)? I imagine its just the odd bit but having not done any of it, its hard to know. I'm sure I'd be fine if I allowed enough days to take it easy. After all the National Trust website says it can be cycled and I'm sure they wouldn't be advocating anything that was technical and that might catch out your average family cyclists...

andymiller

The line about the jumps and drop-offs was a throwaway. It's mainly firmly packed bridleways with some cheeky climbs. Watch out if it has been raining as the chalk can get very slippery.

Bodhbh

With knobblies or fat semi-slicks, reckon you can do it full-loaded, just there's a fair amount of ups and downs and some of the ups might be interesting. I remember doing it at the time thinking would like to have a pop again with the camping gear.

I'm sure I remember reading somewhere they did it loaded on a Dawes Galaxy, maybe it was the Ridgeway.

There's some SDW field reports at:

http://www.bikedowns.co.uk/Visitors%20comments.htm

Just noticed there's some from oen or two doing it on hardtails/hybrids with panniers.

EnglishChris

andymiller wrote:

The line about the jumps and drop-offs was a throwaway.

How did I miss that. Its been a long day! Thanks. :-)

EnglishChris

Bodhbh wrote:

With knobblies or fat semi-slicks, reckon you can do it full-loaded, just there's a fair amount of ups and downs and some of the ups might be interesting. I remember doing it at the time thinking would like to have a pop again with the camping gear.

Cheers. I've yet to buy my tyres - they will be 2 inch Schwalbe Marathons but I've yet to decide between the Dureme and Extreme. The decision seems to come down to the proportion of on / off road you're likely to do. If its hardpacked the Duremes might be fine, as long as it doesn't get gloopy, but then the Extremes probably wouldn't fare much better in the gloop anyway.

I've seen the BikeDowns site but didn't realise there were field reports... I'll take a look.

Cheers!

AndyOgy

I grew up riding the South Downs on a rigid bike. Anyone who says that you NEED suspension is a victim of marketing, like those who say you NEED disc brakes.

As for panniers - get decent ones and you'll barely notice their presence. Get a rack that has those wings that extend beyond the basic 'V' frame to stop the panniers flapping into the wheel. And avoid ones with the spring loaded mousetrap type thing on the top, the rattling will drive you nuts.

All the best with your trip. And watch out for the very steep and very technical uphill section about a mile before you cross the A27 when travelling East to West.

Bodhbh

EnglishChris wrote:

Cheers. I've yet to buy my tyres - they will be 2 inch Schwalbe Marathons but I've yet to decide between the Dureme and Extreme. The decision seems to come down to the proportion of on / off road you're likely to do. If its hardpacked the Duremes might be fine, as long as it doesn't get gloopy, but then the Extremes probably wouldn't fare much better in the gloop anyway.

For what it's worth, I did it on a MTB setup not so different from yours, albiet without a camping load. It was a last minute trip my communter/town bike was the only thing not in bits. It was fully rigid, for some reason it had the granny ring removed, and some fat marathons. It was all fine, only thing, I had to honk up few of the hills for lack of the granny ring.

EnglishChris

AndyOgy wrote:

I grew up riding the South Downs on a rigid bike. Anyone who says that you NEED suspension is a victim of marketing, like those who say you NEED disc brakes.

As for panniers - get decent ones and you'll barely notice their presence. Get a rack that has those wings that extend beyond the basic 'V' frame to stop the panniers flapping into the wheel. And avoid ones with the spring loaded mousetrap type thing on the top, the rattling will drive you nuts.

All the best with your trip. And watch out for the very steep and very technical uphill section about a mile before you cross the A27 when travelling East to West.

Thanks for the advice - I have good racks and Ortlieb panniers for the summer trip so they should be fine for the SDW, although the racks I've got Old Man Mountain, to fit my disc brakes and don't have the extra wings!

EnglishChris

Bodhbh wrote:

EnglishChris wrote:

Cheers. I've yet to buy my tyres - they will be 2 inch Schwalbe Marathons but I've yet to decide between the Dureme and Extreme. The decision seems to come down to the proportion of on / off road you're likely to do. If its hardpacked the Duremes might be fine, as long as it doesn't get gloopy, but then the Extremes probably wouldn't fare much better in the gloop anyway.

For what it's worth, I did it on a MTB setup not so different from yours, albiet without a camping load. It was a last minute trip my communter/town bike was the only thing not in bits. It was fully rigid, for some reason it had the granny ring removed, and some fat marathons. It was all fine, only thing, I had to honk up few of the hills for lack of the granny ring.

Cheers, thats useful. I will do it, just try to keep my loads light...!

Bodhbh

As a side point, one thing I found useful with the Ortliebs when riding over rough stuff is to buy some spare attachment hooks, the ones that hold the pannier against the rack:

http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/ortlieb-lowe ... prod14084/

Then you can hook at two adjacent points of the rack frame rather than one. With just 1 hook, panniers do seem to pop out the attachment point at the bottom a fair bit and start flapping. Occasionally, they undo themselves and fall off altogether, so no harm carrying a spare 1 either.

andymiller

Having lost an Ortlieb pannier riding off-road, I'd suggest:

- if you have adapters in the hooks glue them in place otherwise they fall out;

- get two luggage straps and use the to secure the bags ro the rack. This will not only provide a degree of extra security but stop the bags moving and rattling around.

EnglishChris

Bodhbh wrote:

As a side point, one thing I found useful with the Ortliebs when riding over rough stuff is to buy some spare attachment hooks, the ones that hold the pannier against the rack:

http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/ortlieb-lowe ... prod14084/

Then you can hook at two adjacent points of the rack frame rather than one. With just 1 hook, panniers do seem to pop out the attachment point at the bottom a fair bit and start flapping. Occasionally, they undo themselves and fall off altogether, so no harm carrying a spare 1 either.

Thanks - thats a good idea. These are for the QL2 system and my panniers (Roller Classics) I think have the QL1. Any idea what the difference is and whether they'd fit?

Andy - good advice also... Not sure if I need the adapters with my new racks (OMMs) but will check and use glue if I do. And get some spares. I've read a few people talk of the same problem.

andymiller

EnglishChris wrote:

Not sure if I need the adapters with my new racks (OMMs) .

You may not - I have Tubus; OMM may be made if larger diameter tube.

mea00csf

We did pretty much what your thinking of doing a few years ago. While you will initially find the panniers hard work on the uphills (really hard work!) you'll adjust. Photo showing the bike fully loaded:



That was carrying tent/sleeping bags/thermarests/spare clothes/tiny camping stove with pans and food.

We drove to Eastbourne and parked the car just on the road near the station and took the train to winchester. We started cycling in Winchester, there's a really nice B&B just outside of Winchester which is right on the trail which we stayed at as driving to eastbourne, taking the train to Winchester had taken quite a lot of the day. We then did about 40 miles and stayed at Gumber Bothy, which is highly recommended. 2nd day was 30 miles and we camped in Plumpton, this did add an extra 200m of climbing, but i think you generally have to come off ridge wherever you camp around that area. 3rd day was about 30 miles to Eastbourne where we packed the bikes back into the car and got a B&B.

You can definetly do the SDW without suspension, it's pretty much just hard packed bridleway. I'd want decent grippy mountaiin bike tyres though

Our photos are here https://picasaweb.google.com/mea00csf/S ... ayAug2009#[/img]

EnglishChris

mea00csf wrote:

We did pretty much what your thinking of doing a few years ago. While you will initially find the panniers hard work on the uphills (really hard work!) you'll adjust. Photo showing the bike fully loaded:

That was carrying tent/sleeping bags/thermarests/spare clothes/tiny camping stove with pans and food.

You can definetly do the SDW without suspension, it's pretty much just hard packed bridleway. I'd want decent grippy mountaiin bike tyres though

Cool - thats great info, thanks very much! You did well to get all that kit in just two panniers and a bar bag...maybe I wont be as loaded as I seem to think I might be!!

Got my Marathon Duremes through today and the tread isn't as deep as I thought it might be. Though I have (on another thread) heard from someone who did the Great Divide on an Extreme and a Dureme without any bother so maybe they perform better than they may look. I was hoping they'd be ok if the route is mainly hardpacked....

Butterd2

I did the South Downs way fully loaded, camping overnight nearly 20 years ago now, I had front sus (2" of travel!) but think my brothers were still riding rigid at the time, unless something has changed dramatically in the meanwhile you'll be fine.

takeonafrica

I just did the SDW this last weekend loaded up. On my hardtail MTB with rear panniers (sleeping bag/bivvy/thermarest/camera/clothes/food etc).
Was a fantastic day and a half ride!! It'll be no problem without suspension and loaded up too. I was lucky with the weather - sunny and dry, so it didn't matter my tyres were bald. I would have used my touring bike but it's still in many pieces mid-repair.

I was using my mates Altura panniers which are fantastic. Was reluctant to use my Ortlieb panniers at they regularly fly off the rack over rough terrain - I have lost the little plastic inserts which have a habit of falling out. For my next trip I'll be super-gluing them in (that or wrapping the racks in old inner tubing to thicken them).

andymiller

takeonafrica wrote:

I just did the SDW this last weekend loaded up. On my hardtail MTB with rear panniers (sleeping bag/bivvy/thermarest/camera/clothes/food etc).
Was a fantastic day and a half ride!! It'll be no problem without suspension and loaded up too. I was lucky with the weather - sunny and dry, so it didn't matter my tyres were bald. I would have used my touring bike but it's still in many pieces mid-repair.

I was using my mates Altura panniers which are fantastic. Was reluctant to use my Ortlieb panniers at they regularly fly off the rack over rough terrain - I have lost the little plastic inserts which have a habit of falling out. For my next trip I'll be super-gluing them in (that or wrapping the racks in old inner tubing to thicken them).

A day and a half ? You must be b@stard fit.

IIRC I saw the Ortlieb plastic inserts on sale on the actionoutdoors.co.uk website. Alternatively a heavy-duty rubble bag fits neatly inside a pannier and will keep everything dry.

takeonafrica

andymiller wrote:

A day and a half ? You must be b@stard fit.

Lol! Not really. Still put in a lot of hours in the saddle... left 3pm Friday, cycled til dark/9.30. Hit the trail 7.30am and got in to Eastbourne about 7pm Saturday. The legs were def feeling it that second afternoon and had to push up those last few hills!

hosiescott

i think i read in the veteran cycle club magazine once that an old chap did it on a 3 speed moulton, with a canvas tent

dilemna

andymiller wrote:

takeonafrica wrote:

I just did the SDW this last weekend loaded up. On my hardtail MTB with rear panniers (sleeping bag/bivvy/thermarest/camera/clothes/food etc).
Was a fantastic day and a half ride!! It'll be no problem without suspension and loaded up too. I was lucky with the weather - sunny and dry, so it didn't matter my tyres were bald. I would have used my touring bike but it's still in many pieces mid-repair.

I was using my mates Altura panniers which are fantastic. Was reluctant to use my Ortlieb panniers at they regularly fly off the rack over rough terrain - I have lost the little plastic inserts which have a habit of falling out. For my next trip I'll be super-gluing them in (that or wrapping the racks in old inner tubing to thicken them).

A day and a half ? You must be b@stard fit.

IIRC I saw the Ortlieb plastic inserts on sale on the actionoutdoors.co.uk website. Alternatively a heavy-duty rubble bag fits neatly inside a pannier and will keep everything dry.

Note to take out rubble .

dilemna

EnglishChris wrote:

mea00csf wrote:

We did pretty much what your thinking of doing a few years ago. While you will initially find the panniers hard work on the uphills (really hard work!) you'll adjust. Photo showing the bike fully loaded:

That was carrying tent/sleeping bags/thermarests/spare clothes/tiny camping stove with pans and food.

You can definetly do the SDW without suspension, it's pretty much just hard packed bridleway. I'd want decent grippy mountaiin bike tyres though

Cool - thats great info, thanks very much! You did well to get all that kit in just two panniers and a bar bag...maybe I wont be as loaded as I seem to think I might be!!

Got my Marathon Duremes through today and the tread isn't as deep as I thought it might be. Though I have (on another thread) heard from someone who did the Great Divide on an Extreme and a Dureme without any bother so maybe they perform better than they may look. I was hoping they'd be ok if the route is mainly hardpacked....

Many of us lament the passing of the superb bullit proof Marathon XRs. Why is it that companies ditch perfectly good best selling products? It always beats me. Maybe if enough people shout Schwalbe would re-introduce them?

Try to carry as little as possible. You will be thankful for your austerity when climbing the hills. Less is more. Enjoy your ride.

EnglishChris

Dilemna - I nearly picked up a set of the XRs cheap but was a bit put off by their weight...
I'm quite happy that my new touring wheels plus Duremes combo seem to weigh a little less than my mountain bike wheels and Marathon Plus combo which I used for commuting...

The new wheels are heavier (XT hubs, Rigida Sputnik rims) but the Duremes are so much lighter than the Marathon plus, and from the first commute on them today, feel good on the tarmac too...

I am becoming a little paranoid about weight. Not so paranoid that I'm buying Ti bolts, but paranoid enough to avoid my usual failure of over packing, and really trying to keep the kit down to only what I really need...

In the process of fitting mudguards at the moment which is a little bit of an experiment as the Inbred doesn't have the bridge at the top of the seat stay or by the bottom bracket. Think I've got it figured out though, just need a couple of brackets...

takeonafrica

In case anyone is interested, i put together a little video of riding the South Downs Way the other weekend - http://helenstakeon.com/uk-weekends/bik ... downs-way/

andymiller

dilemna wrote:

Many of us lament the passing of the superb bullit proof Marathon XRs. Why is it that companies ditch perfectly good best selling products? It always beats me. Maybe if enough people shout Schwalbe would re-introduce them?

The basis for all the wailing and gnashing of teeth seems to be that the Duremes use a different compound to the XRs; and a lot of people seem to automatically assume that different means worse. I don't know whether they are better, or worse, or just different: time will tell.

EnglishChris

takeonafrica wrote:

In case anyone is interested, i put together a little video of riding the South Downs Way the other weekend - http://helenstakeon.com/uk-weekends/bik ... downs-way/

This looks great - can't watch it at work (videos blocked) but will look later. The article is useful in itself - you bivvied out for the night? I was contemplating doing this, thought it might be less hassle than trying to find somewhere to put a proper tent up.

I like your site, and that you're replicating Al's microadventures... am trying to do the same though moving house and the cycle down through France / Switzerland are kind of getting in the way a little! When's the packraft trip?

takeonafrica

Bit of a coincidence about al's microadventures as only heard about them since I've been back in the UK! Still, they're a great idea. I'm basically doing what I always used to at the weekends, just now writing about them too.

Yeah, bivvy'd. This is new to me this summer and loving it. So much freedom without having to bother with a tent. Not sure you'd find me using it in the rain though!

Packraft is coming with me when I bike the Great Divide later this year - there are several rivers and lakes near the route... I head off in August.

EnglishChris

Awesome.

I have a bivvy bag that is unused so far so may test it out on the SDW.

What do you do for a living that allows you so much time off for great adventures? I've been reading about the Great Divide - sounds amazing!