Tubeless...

Thewaylander

Also With an innertube that is a much easier fix, but thats por's n con's you sum up the plus and minus

If i had 2 bikes i would but other wise no to much faff.

MattJWL

I didn't say it would not slice an innertube. It is however a pinch flat, since the tyre is getting pinched between rim ad obstacle.

Ah - I see. I thought you just sliced the sidewall with rock/glass/whatever. I never managed to pinch a TL tyre meeself.

If you find you're getting too many pinchflats, increase the pressure a bit. Because I'm a heavy (+slightly fat) git I run around 75% of the max pressure the tyre will take if I'm being aggressive. That way my weight still deforms the tyre enough to give a good contact patch (=grip) but doesn't rodger the tyre, rim etc.

MattJWL

Thewaylander wrote:

If i had 2 bikes i would but other wise no to much faff.

I use 2 sets of wheels for similar reasons - and did before I went TL as some tyres are complete bitch to get on.

sbsmac

I used to be able to count on an average of one thorn puncture every couple of rides until I bought some of this stuff ... http://www.jejamescycles.co.uk/panarace ... 51017.html Been going for a couple of years now without a puncture (touch wood). i even managed to strip out the self-adhesive liner and glue it into a new tyre with pritt-stick a couple of months ago ! To be fair. most of my rides are pretty unchallenging stuff - pinch-flats seem unlikely on my routes.

rickyrider

MattJWL wrote:

Thewaylander wrote:

If i had 2 bikes i would but other wise no to much faff.

I use 2 sets of wheels for similar reasons - and did before I went TL as some tyres are complete ***** to get on.

Yep - some tyres are definitely worse than others, particularly when new. But having fitted tubeless on my tubeless rims, I reckon I could change tyres without taking too much longer than using tubes. It was MUCH easier than I'd been led to believe, but I do think tubeless ready rims might have quite a bit to do with it, as mentioned above.

beverick

Having had a month's worth of pain and torture from the p*ncture fairy (including the cost of a new tyre and new tube) I'd be very wary of going tubeless.

I'm sure I'd have been walking the four miles home using tubeless having taken out the sidewall on the puncture prone Schwalbe Rocket Rons. A new tube, three patches on the inside of the tyre (as well as part of the tube box) and 20psi got me home.

BTW, the P** fairy would seem to be living in my garage. I've had substantially more blow-outs than is fair fsince 1 April (more than in the last three years combined in fact) including two after the bike had only been test ridden 100m after changing a puncture......

Bob

Thewaylander

rickyrider wrote:

MattJWL wrote:

Thewaylander wrote:

If i had 2 bikes i would but other wise no to much faff.

I use 2 sets of wheels for similar reasons - and did before I went TL as some tyres are complete ***** to get on.

Yep - some tyres are definitely worse than others, particularly when new. But having fitted tubeless on my tubeless rims, I reckon I could change tyres without taking too much longer than using tubes. It was MUCH easier than I'd been led to believe, but I do think tubeless ready rims might have quite a bit to do with it, as mentioned above.

yup but you would need to replace your sealant evey time really, so this isn't a cost effective thing .

rickyrider

Thewaylander wrote:

rickyrider wrote:

MattJWL wrote:

Thewaylander wrote:

If i had 2 bikes i would but other wise no to much faff.

I use 2 sets of wheels for similar reasons - and did before I went TL as some tyres are complete ***** to get on.

Yep - some tyres are definitely worse than others, particularly when new. But having fitted tubeless on my tubeless rims, I reckon I could change tyres without taking too much longer than using tubes. It was MUCH easier than I'd been led to believe, but I do think tubeless ready rims might have quite a bit to do with it, as mentioned above.

yup but you would need to replace your sealant evey time really, so this isn't a cost effective thing .

Guess so, but in the grand scheme of biking costs, sealant is pretty cheap - unless you change tyres that regularly?!

cat_with_no_tail

I have to say, I've only been running tubeless (TL ready NNs on Flow rims) for a couple of months, but I now officially consider myself a convert.

I had some very slight issues with it not sealing properly when the tyres were brand new. They'd very slowly leak air overnight when sat in the garage. That soon fixed itself.

I also had 1 flat, which as far as I can tell was caused by a very unlicky slate strike in just the wrong part of the tyre (quite close to the rim). Sealed it with a TL patch, and it's been good as gold ever since.

So far I'd say that it HAS been a bit more of a faff than using tubes. But as a fatty, I do feel a lot more confident ragging the bike over stuff I'd probably have backed off with tubes. And yes, I'm aware I could have used thicker tubes, or higher pressures, but I like the weight saving, and I run the pressure I like.

sheepsteeth

i like to run tubeless

the rims set ups i have used stans, joes, ust and tubeless ready specialized set up.

they are all as reliable as each other in my experience, fitting a rim strip is no difficult task but obviously UST is the simplest way to do business.

as for tyres, i have converted regular tyres with limited success and the fact it is limited means i dont trust it, so no longer do it. plus, getting regular tyres to inflate or seal in the first place is such a cunt ache i would rather be kicked up my backside until i bled to death than ever try it again. seriously.

the best way is to use tyres designed for tubeless use, with sealant on any tubeless rim set up. they inflate first time, remain sealed and behave properly when riding normal trails.

all of this is my experience and for those who have had other experiences, you must have done it wrong.

Northwind

Thewaylander wrote:

yup but you would need to replace your sealant evey time really, so this isn't a cost effective thing .

Speaking as an officially designated scotsman, you can reuse stans sealant, just use a big syringe or one of the little sealant bottles to suck it back up. It does get less effective though as you'll leave some of the solids in the old tyre.

Anonymous

I'll leave some solids in you in a minute.

Northwind

Well that'll make a nice change from your usual

Anonymous

I thought I'd surprise you tonight, seeing as it's a Wednesday.

Broonster

Any of you peeps out there run Stans Crest rims with Racing Ralph UST tyres?

I just got some and just had a quick faff about last night trying to get the tyres onto the rims. Fruck me, it's tough! That's gonna be this weekend's project and looks like I'll need to bring the soapy water out of the armoury, but I don't hold out much hope if last night was anything to go by :?

sheepsteeth

qre they dificult because they are too tight or too slack?

what are you using to inflate the tyres?

Broonster

sheepsteeth wrote:

qre they dificult because they are too tight or too slack?

what are you using to inflate the tyres?

Nah, haven't tried it properly yet mate and haven't got them actually onto the rim to attempt and inflate. Normally I can wrestle 'normal' tyres into a rim though, but with these it's looking like it's gonna be a helluva battle. VERY tight indeed!

sheepsteeth

aah, that should make the beggars easier to inflate with any luck.

Tim.s

It all ended in sadness and misery for me but I was using a conversion kit, I imagine the proper set ups are far more reliable and easy to use.

williambowland

Sorry - I took my eye off this thread and came back surprised by all the response. Thanks for all the info and experiences.

I reckon I will give tubeless a shot. Hopefully building a 456 Ti or Blue Pig X shortly having decided to stick with hardtails but wanting something a bit slacker and more compliant for Beast of Brenin and similar. Low pressures obviously a big plus for hardtails.

Be looking at Pro II on ZTR Flows plus big volume UST tyres. Be like riding a sofa =] ...

paulbox

I fancy having a crack at this tubeless lark and am just after a little bit of advice.

I bought some Pro II Evo / Crests last week, they already have a pretty thick bright green strip over the spoke holes, so I think that means I don't need any more tape of any kind.

I was under the impression that I needed to buy some specific tyres, but was riding with a guy at the weekend who told me that my regular High Rollers would be fine on the Crests. Is that right?

Taking it that the above is correct, do I just need valves and jiz? Or do I need a syringe and valve tools etc?

Thanks in advance, Paul.

Dick Scruttock

The rim tape i use on my crests is stans yellow tape, its not really what i would call green. Any pictures?

paulbox

Rick Draper wrote:

The rim tape i use on my crests is stans yellow tape, its not really what i would call green. Any pictures?

I got them from PedalOn: http://www.pedalon.co.uk/acatalog/hope_ ... crest.html

This picture (off their website) shows the tape as it is on mine, in the flesh it is greener than the picture makes it look.

cee

I recently got a set of pro2's on flow rims....

I will try the tubless thing...but i have some standard tyres to wear out first...and a set of NN UST's on the way.

PaulBox
I got my hope hoops without the tubeless stuff...so no valves and just the standard green hope rimtape with the wheel serial numbers and bulid date on them....

There is a hope kit which includes 2 valves, a roll of the very yellow 25mm rim tape and 120mm of sealant available for the flows for 20 quid...I have that....presumably there is a similar one for the crests.

I believe that while the stans rims are tubeless compatible (i.. a big deep bead well)...they dont neccesarily come to you ready to just sling sealant in...if im wrong...then i have wasted 20 quid!

paulbox

cee wrote:

PaulBox
I got my hope hoops without the tubeless stuff...so no valves and just the standard green hope rimtape with the wheel serial numbers and bulid date on them....

There is a hope kit which includes 2 valves, a roll of the very yellow 25mm rim tape and 120mm of sealant available for the flows for 20 quid...I have that....presumably there is a similar one for the crests.

I believe that while the stans rims are tubeless compatible (i.. a big deep bead well)...they dont neccesarily come to you ready to just sling sealant in...if im wrong...then i have wasted 20 quid!

I was told that the Crests & Flows don't need the UST tyres. The seal between my regular HR's and the rim is amazing, they really pop on when you reach the necessary pressure.

We need somebody to tell us if the green rim tape does the same as the yellow stuff in your kit.

Even if the green tape is ok, you still need the valves & sealant, so you haven't wasted £20. Did the kit include a valve core remover too?

CraigXXL

You can use most standard tyres but some like Panaracers don't work too well whilst others like Schwalbe tubeless ready and Specialized 2bliss work very well. You do need to use a tubeless kit to seal the rim and tyre and the Hope kit is better value than buying the Stans kit even though they contain nearly the same items.

cee

PaulBox

No valve core remover......

this is the kit....

Hope Tubeless Kit for Hope Hoops on Stans ZTR

I measured the rim tape and it is 25mm wide.

The green hope rim tape is the same as a on a set of non-tubless mavic rims a mate got....so as CraigXXL says....you need the kit with the yellow tape...

actually...I found this on the stans site : notubes.com under the description of the flow rims....

http://www.notubes.com/ wrote:

Fully tubeless compatible with the 25mm yellow tape and valve stem, or the Flow rim strip.

So yes...you need the yellow tape....the crest rims description says you can use either the 21mm or 25mm yellow tape and a valve stem....no specific rim strip for it though...

On Tyres.....

I have heard loads of folk saying that most non-tubeless tyres work ok with the sealant etc....but I have heard as many people have issues with them...

the general consensus seems to be....if you do tubeless....do it properly....with UST rims and UST tyres for the least potential for headaches.

paulbox

cee wrote:

The green hope rim tape is the same as a on a set of non-tubless mavic rims a mate got....so as CraigXXL says....you need the kit with the yellow tape...

I think you're right on the rim tape, I'm just going to call PedalOn to confirm.

cee wrote:

On Tyres.....

I have heard loads of folk saying that most non-tubeless tyres work ok with the sealant etc....but I have heard as many people have issues with them...

the general consensus seems to be....if you do tubeless....do it properly....with UST rims and UST tyres for the least potential for headaches.

But the Stan's ZTR rims are not UST, they use BST (Bead Socket Technology). UST is the system for converting standard rims in to tubeless isn't it... :?

You can still use UST tyres, but the web site also recommends standard Maxxis & Schwalbe (amongst others) tyres.

paulbox

PaulBox wrote:

cee wrote:

The green hope rim tape is the same as a on a set of non-tubless mavic rims a mate got....so as CraigXXL says....you need the kit with the yellow tape...

I think you're right on the rim tape, I'm just going to call PedalOn to confirm.

Just spoken to one of the lads at PedalOn and they have confirmed that the green tape needs to come out and be replaced with the yellow Stan's tape.

PaulBox wrote:

cee wrote:

On Tyres.....

I have heard loads of folk saying that most non-tubeless tyres work ok with the sealant etc....but I have heard as many people have issues with them...

the general consensus seems to be....if you do tubeless....do it properly....with UST rims and UST tyres for the least potential for headaches.

But the Stan's ZTR rims are not UST, they use BST (Bead Socket Technology). UST is the system for converting standard rims in to tubeless isn't it... :?

You can still use UST tyres, but the web site also recommends standard Maxxis & Schwalbe (amongst others) tyres.

Same PedalOn guy confirmed that there is no issue running the standard tyres on these rims.

Northwind

PaulBox wrote:

But the Stan's ZTR rims are not UST, they use BST (Bead Socket Technology). UST is the system for converting standard rims in to tubeless isn't it... :?

UST is a copyright (patent?) term for a specific method of making tubeless rims, I think Mavic own it. I'm not sure if Stans rims are actually UST-compliant, but it doesn't make any actual difference.