Tour 2010 doping allegations

CyclingBantam

Apparently L'Equipe are due to be releasing further allegations about testing done on riders before last year. Apparently the UCI are already with a statement condemning the revelations.

If they are catching people great, I just hope it is not another big mess for the sport.

SpaceJunk

The rumour I heard is that the pre-Tour testing resulted in two riders needing to be watched closely.

One of the two was never tested during the TdF, the other didn't get tested after stage 3.

The fact that neither rider was supposedly monitored closely would suggest they didn't really figure much in the race. That said, makes you wonder why their suspicious results didn't get followed up - the UCI have no confidence in their system??

iainf72

Scores on the doors. Lower = lower risk

2010 TdF: Cancellara, Horner 0
Armstrong 4
Contador 5
Menchov 9.
Evans 4
Leipheimer 4
Millar 5
Contador 5
Ballan 5
Vinokourov 5
Wiggins 5

SpaceJunk

I love it.

The UCI have a scale of 0-10 of suspicions that a rider is doping.

0 is no suspicion, 9 is very suspicious.

Menchov wins with a 9, along with Barredo and Popovych.

Armstrong gets a 4, along with Evans.

My favourite? Contador gets a 5, along with Vino, Ballan and Wiggins.

SpaceJunk

I thought Millar was only a 4 Iain??

But in all seriousness, the list is ambit blah!, isn't it?

Even L'euipe warns about over interpreting the results.

iainf72

Full list

The 10's are quite funny

http://www.flickr.com/photos/49195174@N ... hotostream

SpaceJunk

Just a hypothetical, but if a team is systematically doping, and some of it's riders "scores" 8 + , whilst others only "score" 3s and 4s, should we assume:

A Some riders are better at covering up their transgressions,
B. The UCI passport measuring parameters are as suspicious as some of the riders, or
C. Something else?

Cumulonimbus

Cancellara 0

Cumulonimbus

SpaceJunk wrote:

Just a hypothetical, but if a team is systematically doping, and some of it's riders "scores" 8 + , whilst others only "score" 3s and 4s, should we assume:

A Some riders are better at covering up their transgressions,
B. The UCI passport measuring parameters are as suspicious as some of the riders, or
C. Something else?

Depends when you are tested. If one person is tested when their blood levels have been manipulated most then, while others arent, then they will be higher on the list than someone else. Also, systematic doping might not dope everyone equally, etc. There is also the possibility, as with all these figures that the dodgiest reading (s), have a clean reason, ie injury, illness. I know that when people have failed the bio passport they are told the times they failed and asked if they can come up with any other reasons for the readings.

blazing_saddles

Fuentes Frank and Junior Schleck combined total score equal "Bad" Bradder's

So, Chris Horner won the Tour, then?

I posted this a while back.
Page 19 of WADA's report on the testing, or rather lack of, for certain riders scoring 8-10.
http://www.wada-ama.org/Documents/World ... 010_EN.pdf

iainf72

Pavel Brutt : 0

So if the Italian coppers come up with anything from their recent activities that would provide some context on a 0.

LangerDan

SpaceJunk wrote:

Just a hypothetical, but if a team is systematically doping, and some of it's riders "scores" 8 + , whilst others only "score" 3s and 4s, should we assume:

A Some riders are better at covering up their transgressions,
B. The UCI passport measuring parameters are as suspicious as some of the riders, or
C. Something else?

Might be as simple as money. Doping costs. Why would you increase your costs - and risks of detection - by doping the entire squad? If a rider doesn't need as much assistance, either by virtue of greater physical ability or by the fact that his job is as a domestique on flatter stages, would you expend the same time and effort in preparing him?

iainf72

In team order (thanks to the asylum) Lowest to Highest

Cofidis
BB Telecom
FDJ
AG2R
Garmin
Cervelo
Footon-Servetto
Rabobank
Liquigas
Sky
Milram
Saxo Bank
Euskatel
Katusha
Lampre
Quick Step
Omega-Lotto
HTC-Columbia
BMC
Caisse d'Epargne
Astana
RadioShack

Cumulonimbus

iainf72 wrote:

Pavel Brutt : 0

So if the Italian coppers come up with anything from their recent activities that would provide some context on a 0.

How often is someone like him tested? Of course, blood-doping is not the only form of doping.

inkyfingers

What I find interesting is how that compares to the usual forum doping sweepstakes...LLS and Schleck snr only a 2.

LangerDan

Funny how a score of 9 or 10 either gets you 3rd in the TdF or 85th (or justs gets you in a handbag fight with Rui Costa)

Has anyone collated the scores by team or do I have to pick that out of the table?

SpaceJunk

iainf72 wrote:

In team order (thanks to the asylum) Lowest to Highest

Cofidis
BB Telecom
FDJ
AG2R
Garmin
Cervelo
Footon-Servetto
Rabobank
Liquigas
Sky
Milram
Saxo Bank
Euskatel
Katusha
Lampre
Quick Step
Omega-Lotto
HTC-Columbia
BMC
Caisse d'Epargne
Astana
RadioShack

Based on the above list, just how crap are BMC? Based on performances, you'd think they would come I with the French teams.

inkyfingers

iainf72 wrote:

In team order (thanks to the asylum) Lowest to Highest

Cofidis
BB Telecom
FDJ
AG2R
Garmin
Cervelo
Footon-Servetto
Rabobank
Liquigas
Sky
Milram
Saxo Bank
Euskatel
Katusha
Lampre
Quick Step
Omega-Lotto
HTC-Columbia
BMC
Caisse d'Epargne
Astana
RadioShack

Two points i'd note....first is no surprise, second a little more so.

1. No french rider has, or would ever dope
2. HTC maybe not quite as whiter than white as they'd like us to think

Cumulonimbus

inkyfingers wrote:

2. HTC maybe not quite as whiter than white as they'd like us to think

Yes, Siutsou, Rogers and Martin pull the average up a lot.

SpaceJunk

And judging by the shenanigans post stage last year, Barredo's "10" was indicative of a lot of testosterone??

FJS

inkyfingers wrote:

Two points i'd note....first is no surprise, second a little more so.

1. No french rider has, or would ever dope

A couple of French riders is relatively high up on the scores individually

inkyfingers

FJS wrote:

inkyfingers wrote:

Two points i'd note....first is no surprise, second a little more so.

1. No french rider has, or would ever dope

A couple of French riders is relatively high up on the scores individually

Whoooosh....

SpaceJunk

Love Robbie Hunter's tweet:

"Great job by UCI to have confidential details of riders leaked to the press.. In my eyes thats a major problem.. Get ur house in order!!"

Of course, the fact that it appears riders could still be doping and getting away with it is insignificant in comparison.

josame

Tony Martin and Linus :shock:

andyp

Remind me who Hunter rides for these days? People in glass houses...

58585

Do we know the basis for the scores? Are they based on long-term analysis of blood passports or purely tests in the build-up to the 2010 tour?

edhornby

Geraint Thomas gets a 6? is this because of a lack of data that skews his result and he'll drop down the ranking over time

RichN95.

I wonder if any individual circumstances were taken into consideration. For example, Geraint Thomas, rated surprisingly high at 6, doesn't have a spleen, which is going to effect his readings. I imagine Alex Dowsett's passport probably goes all over the place.

inkyfingers

RichN95 wrote:

I wonder if any individual circumstances were taken into consideration. For example, Geraint Thomas, rated surprisingly high at 6, doesn't have a spleen, which is going to effect his readings. I imagine Alex Dowsett's passport probably goes all over the place.

You would hope that personal medical factors would be taken into account, if they are not then the whole system is surely meaningless.

Just out of interest, why would Alex Dowsett's be all over the place?

RichN95.

inkyfingers wrote:

Just out of interest, why would Alex Dowsett's be all over the place?

He's a haemophiliac

58585

Who's going to be first to suggest the UCI could have decided to "downgrade" selectively?