Handbuilt Vs Factory Wheels

solboy
solboy Posts: 368
edited April 2011 in Road buying advice
I want to upgrade my wheelset and its basically between the following;

Shimano RS80s

DT Swiss R1900

Wheelsmith - IRD Aero Rims, Novatec Hubs and CX Rays spokes

I like the thought of both but have not personally come across the components from the Wheelsmith build but i am sure (based on what i have read on here) that they will be good.

I am looking for a strong, light and smooth wheelset that may help increase my speed and hopefully add a little bit of bling! Afterall i want something to show for the £300-400 outlay.

The spec from the handbuilts came from wheelsmiths based on what i said i use the bike for.
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Comments

  • hand builts - hope pro 3 hubs, open pro rims dt comp spokes...standard :D

    ....and thats coming from someone that has rs80's
  • solboy - the build you are referring to from Wheelsmith is a very good fast all round set of wheels. I have the same build 20f/24r with a Powertap rear and they have been excellent for 12 months or so. Derek at Wheelsmith knows his stuff.

    The IRD Cadence Aero / Kinlin 300 rims are pretty stiff although not super light. Although this allows lower spoke counts. The Novatech hubs are fine and are sold under a bunch of other names by other companies.

    The Open Pro wheels mentioned above are also good all round wheels and I also own a pair. Personally I'd go for Record or Dura Ace hubs. Probably not quite as quick as the Cadence and IME need a bit more truing.

    The great thing about either handbuilt is that if a spoke should come lose, break or whatever they can be replaced and the wheels can be trued easily. Not always so easy with Factory wheels.
  • The great thing about either handbuilt is that if a spoke should come lose, break or whatever they can be replaced and trued. Not always so easy with Factory wheels.

    Thats the main reason i use a handbuilt set on my better bike...which i think suprises people
  • dennisn
    dennisn Posts: 10,601
    handbuilts
    DA or Record hubs, DT double butted spokes, Mavic Open Pro or Mavic Reflex rims.
    Doesn't get much better than that, at 3 or 4 times the price.
  • giant_man
    giant_man Posts: 6,878
    out of those three - the handbuilts.
  • solboy
    solboy Posts: 368
    Guys can you advise what an Open Pro rim is please? Do i take it that its less of an Aero section?
  • Mavic Open Pro, they are tried and tested rims, built into a 28 hole they can be reasonably light, or with a 36 hole 3 cross they are a decent winter training wheel. Hub choice is pretty much down to how much you wanna spend, however like the other guys said a GOOD double butted spoke either DT or sapim
  • dennisn
    dennisn Posts: 10,601
    solboy wrote:
    Guys can you advise what an Open Pro rim is please? Do i take it that its less of an Aero section?

    The Open Pro is as good a clincher rim as is out there. It's been Mavics main seller for years, which says something about it's dependability. More wheels than you can count have been built with this rim. It is NOT an Aero section rim.
  • Supergoose
    Supergoose Posts: 1,089
    Worth noting, no wear indicator on Open Pro's so keep an eye on the braking surface and dont leave it too long like I did. When it gave way it was like a gun going off. I was very lucky.
    Rock 'n' Roule
  • Gazzetta67
    Gazzetta67 Posts: 1,890
    I Reckon Ambrosio Excellence rims are just as good as mavic open pro`s if not better.
  • solboy
    solboy Posts: 368
    Other than Wheelsmiths who should i be talking to about some handbuilts?
  • Harry182
    Harry182 Posts: 1,170
    Harry Rowland (no relation)

    http://www.harryrowland.co.uk/
  • Gazzetta67
    Gazzetta67 Posts: 1,890
    Paul Hewitt Cycles Leyland Lancs
  • ride_whenever
    ride_whenever Posts: 13,279
    Your lbs if they're any good.
  • solboy
    solboy Posts: 368
    Err that would be Evans..... :lol:
    I dont know of any LBS that do wheel building but i live near Gatwick.Please let me know of any if you know of any. :wink:
  • ride_whenever
    ride_whenever Posts: 13,279
    There have got to be some london ones that do... I'm oxford based so not much help.
  • Bobbinogs
    Bobbinogs Posts: 4,841
    Just get them posted. Paul Hewitt qouted me about a tenner. Still went for the RS80s though, but mainly because I wanted a decent factory set to compare with my handbuilt set (Record hubs with Open Pro rims) on my retro bike. RS80s are a lot stiffer but the handbuilts roll like butter, if butter rolled. Not sure which wheel set is best but I don't really care to be honest, both are lovely.
  • solboy
    solboy Posts: 368
    Harry Rowland has suggested i go for Mavic Open Pro rims, Ultegra Hubs and Sapim Race spokes. This is where i get confused as i dont have enough experience to compare this build with the wheelsmith build. As there is £120 differenct in the cost i assume there is a difference in quality?
  • moonshine
    moonshine Posts: 1,021
    solboy wrote:
    Harry Rowland has suggested i go for Mavic Open Pro rims, Ultegra Hubs and Sapim Race spokes. This is where i get confused as i dont have enough experience to compare this build with the wheelsmith build. As there is £120 differenct in the cost i assume there is a difference in quality?

    Sipam make more than one type of spoke, with CX-rays being their top of the range spoke which are about £2.50 each IIRC. I know these are what Wheelsmith uses. Are these the same as HR "Sipam Race" spokes? I've no idea.
    Worth checking.
  • moonshine
    moonshine Posts: 1,021
    Just checked... Sapim do a mid range butted spoke called "race"
    Dotbikes sell a box of 100 race spokes for £42, a box of 20 CX-rays are £45. There is your difference.
  • Bobbinogs
    Bobbinogs Posts: 4,841
    Yepp, I have one of each of the Sapim spokes as I bought them when I was looking at getting handbuilts. The main difference is that the CX Ray is more bladed, so it is thinner, lighter but somehow it is stronger and lasts longer! Hence the price.

    The Sapim website is pretty good:

    Race
    Usage : RACE,TRIATHLON, MTB, TREKKING
    Weight : 360g (64 x 260 mm)
    Fatigue test / wheel revolutions : 980.000
    Strength on middle section : 1350N/mm²


    CX Ray
    Usage : RACE, TRIATHLON, MTB, DOWNHILL
    Weight : 278g (64 x 260 mm)
    Fatigue test / wheel revolutions : 3.500.000
    Strength on middle section : 1600N/mm²
  • estampida
    estampida Posts: 1,008
    so,

    handbuilt all the way

    1) The wheelsmith can advise on correct component choice, Bladed spokes on a DH bike, what a lot of advertisement!!!!!. As I would not file down a hub that is going to get that kind of rocking.

    2) Factory wheels although hand checked may not be acceptable (I have seen wheel build factorys that just check spoke tension for dish of the rim) You can do this but spoke tension changes with tyre pressure so it will never be in the same..............

    I really cannot be bothered listing anything else but check

    http://www.dcrwheels.co.uk/custom-wheel ... es-advice/

    for spoke blab,

    and I would choose hope pro III just to stand out from all the ultegra and campag of the world, and have the best warrenty.
  • wildmoustache
    wildmoustache Posts: 4,010
    Unless you are a big heavy guy I'd get the RS80s. That is a damn fine wheel with a lighter rim and better/ as good hub than any of the handbuilt options that's been talked about here.

    I also find those Shimano wheels (I have a pair of DAs in my stable) mute road buzz very nicely.

    But they are undeniably more of a pain to repair than the handbuilt options. That said, one click of the mouse and you've bought them, as opposed to burning time on the build with handbuilts.
  • markos1963
    markos1963 Posts: 3,724
    I'd go for handbuilts(especially from Wheelsmith) simply because he can build me the wheel to suit MY needs( and he has done) Whilst the RS80s might be a very good wheel it's made for a mass market and therefore compromises have to be made.

    I was a bit on the heavy side for Wheelsmith to use CX Rays so he used Sapim Lasers instead and still got my wheels under 1400gms for less than £450, a good example of how going handbuilt is for me the way to go.
  • giant_man
    giant_man Posts: 6,878
    You got Lasers on the front and ACIs on rear markos1963?

    1400g is good ...
  • markos1963
    markos1963 Posts: 3,724
    You got Lasers on the front and ACIs on rear markos1963?

    1400g is good ...

    Lasers on front and non drive side on rear, ACI on drive side( this was with the Gigantex rims which are lighter I think than the IRDs)
  • giant_man
    giant_man Posts: 6,878
    Yeah that makes sense. And what hubs?

    You got some pics of said hoops? Or are they already on here somewhere?
  • designman
    designman Posts: 405
    Markos what deep section wheels are those on your Orbea?
    Do you mind me asking where u got them & how much?
    Thanks.
  • moonshine
    moonshine Posts: 1,021
    I would add that i got a pair of race / TT wheels - the Gigantex 50mm carbon tubs with 20/24h black novatec hubs and black sapim CX-rays from Derek at Wheelsmith last year and they have been superb. I went to him for a couple of reasons.... reviews on here, great selection & advice from him, competative pricing and he is also localish to me...

    I have been really impressed by the quality of the wheels and they have not needed to be touched with a spoke key at all.

    I like when people ask me where i got my wheels from.... i am quite proud to say i had them built & recommend the builder.... it gives a bit of pride and has an artisan / exclusive feel to it.

    I have been back in touch with wheelsmith re, getting other wheels built for different bikes, but not taken the plunge yet,but that is because i don't really need them....

    I'm a handbuild convert and doubt i'd go factory again.... the handbuilts often don't look as bling as a swish factory setup, but i think they are likely to be a better long term investment as sourcing replacement parts for (even common) factory wheels can be a mission & take months.