Fitness for ETape or similar... what does it take?

springtide9

Sorry dumb question.... but I have to ask...

I would like to do something like the ETape (or similar) next year. The question is, what kind of fitness is required as a minimum so that you know you are safe from not being kicked off the road early? [as you are too slow]

I did my first 100 mile Sportive on Sunday, and although i knew it was a charity ride, I was hoping that I would have had more of an idea of where I currently am in terms of fitness and how much I would need to improve.

But, looking at the riding times, I think the only feedback that I have managed to get out of it is that I probably stopped for less time that some, and other riders were more social that I was. And some people were a lot quicker.

I guess I need to do a few more events that are less charity focused, as well as more riding with other people. The easy answer is to join a local club, but my reluctance is that most clubs seem to do a 9:00-9:30am set off, where as (due to family commitments), I'm wanting to get out at 6am (or earlier), so that I get back in time to have the afternoon with the family.

I understand that not all events are the same and comparing one route to another in terms of distance and assent is not easy, but would probably give me some idea of what I should be aiming for.

So lets talk figures... a 'typical' UK Sportive (if there is one) of around 100 miles and 5000ft assent (1500m)... what kind of time should you be aiming for if you were planning on attempting something like the ETape? (or ETape Dale). Just looking for very rough guidelines as part of a 'gap analysis'
Or if the above is not enough, what kind of distance and assent (and time) would I need to achieve?

Obviously events like the ETape are expensive - so really want to make sure that I'm prepared - rather than turn up and hope for the best.
I understand this is a very open ended question with no real answer, but as above, just looking for some rough guidelines. It could be, I can't commit enough at the moment to attempt it... which is what I really want to know or not.

wjcrombie

If you can do any of the "large" UK sportives (dragonride etc)you will be fine with the Etape or the like. My view is that once you get to a certain level of fitness then you are capable of doing any event, more fitness is really about how quickly you do it and how good you feel at the end.

In terms of riding with a club - for me this is more about company than trying to measure how good you are... In my club we have a few people who like you want to get out at silly o'Clock in the morning and various other times not inline with the standard club runs. We all use our clubs forum to get like minded people togeter for a ride. It works for us...

springtide9

Thanks. Currently looking at a few local clubs and will work on that.

The only bit I'm still struggling with is the speed. I understand what you are saying, but I guess the most unfit person can do any event given enough time (OK maybe not, but you understand what I mean)

What would be considered 'reasonable' average speed or time (in terms of a person seriously thinking about entering something like the ETape), fora person to complete an event like the 200km Wiggle Dragon Ride?

I can't do this ride this year due to conflicts (even if I could get entry), but can obviously simulate a similar ride in the South West. My Sunday ride wasn't far short (if I add my commute to the event)... not perfect, but it would give me a very rough idea. Are we talking 14-15mph averages, or is it more like 18-20mph (which is obviously a huge difference)

Just to muddle things up a bit, I'm also doing a few MTB events; this coupled with 2 small children means that I'm unlikely to get as many road events in as I'd like to get, to get more of a feeling where I am currently at.

Just as a FYI, I'm not trying to win anything as I'm in my 40's and don't have the time or commitment, but also don't want to spend £500 on an event (which I know is just a tick in the box), and not be fit enough to finish the event. Also know that training is going to take time, hence why I'm thinking about it now. Maybe I'm being just too cautious... but this is because of the $$.

lochindaal

You are definately better starting training now, it's not too cautious.

You should be finishing a UK Sportive comfortably, assuming you're not racing round going for your a PB. This doesn't mean that you won't feel tired you should just feel you've more in the tank if required.

I did the Dragon ride in 7 1/2hrs and the Etape the same year in 8 1/2 hrs.

What you can't get your head around until you've done one is the length of an HC climb. If you could fit one in on a holiday before you go it would certainly help. The mental pain can be harder than the physical part.

It also doesn't have to be as expensive now you can sign up online from the UK. Book evrything yourself rather than through a travel company taking the pi**.

It's a great experience!

I am the god of hell fire

Hi

You sound a little like me!

40 something with kids and limited opportunity to get the miles in

I am doing this years Alpe D'Huez Etape
I have never done a sportive of any description before
In fact I have only been riding a road bike for 3 years or so

My main motivation was from a thread I posted much like yours a little while ago which pretty much had me slammed as a dreamer
After that there was no way it was going to beat me!!

In mitigation I have been doing a fair amount of sneaky practice
6AM rides in January with lights - check
Night rides in March - check

And Im also fortunate enough to have the Peak district nearby to get some easy hill practice in

Added to that is an annual lads trip to watch the Tour for the last few years
2y ago I took a borrowed bike from La Mongie the final 5km up Tourmalet wearing beach clothes, last summer I rode my own bike from the bottom and then rode another Col just for fun to see how it went

It went OK and so I took the plunge and entered this years event

I have ridden through my first winter on the road and am feeling pretty sweet with 12 weeks or so to go

I am not in a club but have fit mates to chase and keep me honest
My riding is 50:50 solo and with company

My advice would be to go for it but to be wary of your MTB getting in the way
I thought I was a fit MTBer when I took to the road a little while ago

I may have been but its just not the same fitness wise

My Cotic has been ridden once in 2011 whilst my roadie has been hammered
As a consequence I am in the form of a pretty big mid life crisis

Best of luck
The anecdotes from others are helping too
Last week a chap at work was describing being in the pens at the start and hearing the wave of noise from people clipping in sweeping towards him as he waited to start

Great stuff

cheers!!

springtide9

@ lochindaal : Thanks v much for the info. A bit cheeky, but can I ask what was the distance/asset of the Dragon ride? Just that I looked at the results last year and it appeared to be 180km (rather than 200km as per this year), so wondering if the course has changed?

One more question, can you remember what the overall cut-off time was for the ETape? Just wondering how much slack you had with your ride.


@I am the god of hell fire : Yes we sound alike. Hopefully the MTB riding will just go hand in hand with the road, as MTB is really my main hobby. I tend to want to do long endurance events rather than anything too technical, and have found the cross over to the road very similar in terms of requirements on your body.
Due to family commitments I usually get 3 decent rides a month split between MTB and Road, but hopefully now the summer is here I'll start getting some evening rides in during the week. I also use the gym or swim most weekdays, which is where the majority of my fitness currently comes from.

In terms of where I currently am, I did a 100 mile ride on the weekend reasonably comfortably in 7hrs. which I think had roughly 5-6k feet of assent. When I say reasonably comfortably, I added 25 miles & 2.5k feet onto the day for the commute to and from the event, so didn't go all guns out for the 100. I was very tired at the end of the day (got very cold after the event and on my return commute), but seem to have recovered this week OK, just skipping Monday's gym session.
It sounds like I really need to be riding a similar 100 mile event or ride in more like 6 hrs, which is currently my 40-50 mile speed. Hmm, sounds like I have some work to do.
On the climbing side, that is going to be hard to try and replicate. Sounds like I need to head to Wales, climb some mountains, descend, and climb them again and again. Bristol isn't flat, but it's hill rather than mountains around here. The idea of climbing for 2+ hrs sounds very very tough (as well as maintaining speed).

Thanks again... lots to think about.

lochindaal

Your right the Dragon Ride is now longer than when i did it, this was in 2009.

I did the Etape again last year. my biggest UK Sportive was the Fred Whitton 8 1/2 hours and the Etape 9 1/2 hours. I had a friend doing the FW who finished in 9 1/2 hours and missed the Etape cut off by about 10minutes (12 1/2 hrs). Last year was a very difficult one by the amount of large climbs.

I only started cycling a few years ago so I am not a natural "cycle" fit person. On both the Etapes I was around position 3500. If you have done enough training the cut off times are not a worry. My average speed has been around 19-20km/hr.

Typically about 3000 don't finish

The worry is all part of the excitement

Tom Butcher

You'll probably find in large clubs while the main organised rides are sort of 9am starts there will be plenty of people arranging rides informally at all sorts of times - it's just getting into the club and knowing a few people first. That said nothing wrong with riding solo - in fact I prefer doing at least half my long rides on my own because it lends a bit more freedom to how far you go, what roads, what pace etc. Depends what clubs you've got round you but you might have a look at see if any have a decent website and forum - you can often pick up from the chat on there what kind of stuff goes off and if they'd suit you.

100 miles in 7 hours sounds pretty good if that's your starting point - like you say if you can get that down to 6 hours it'd be better but even for a fairly fit rider 100 miles in 6 hours would be a fair effort.

vorsprung

You could enter this

http://www.aukweb.net/events/detail/11-23/

It's cheap, it's not far for you to travel and it has 3900m ascent in 200km
Exmoor isn't the Alps but it's all climbing practice

Garrigou

SpringTide9, last year's Etape had a Broom Wagon cut-off at about 11 hours 30min for a 180km ride with 4400m of ascent. So, the average riding speed required (and averages are a bit deceptive because the Brrom Wagon speeds up and slows down of descents & climbs, too) was around 10mph.
On the 2008 event, the Broom Wagon average speed was almost identical, even though the route was shorter (around 165km) and with less climbing (3500m).
If you divide the total ascent by the length of the ride and call that average gradient (misleading, but it'll do) then those events had average gradients of 2.1-2.5%. The UK sportives you referred to as being 160km with 1500m have an average gradient of about 1%. For 'mere mortals' like me, once the average gradient of a route is above 1%, then each additional 0.5% increase in the gradient will knock about 2.5kph off my riding speed. So, if you rode similarly and had the endurance to get round 180km or so, then riding one of the 'average' UK events at 15mph (24kph) probably equates to you riding an Etape with a 2% average gradient at about 12mph. Might not sound fancy, but it puts you about 2 hours ahead of the Broom Wagon, I reckon.
And not all the companies running Etape deals are at rip-off prices. There are some very fair support/accommodation/transport packages from the smaller operators who are based in France all year round. The 'approved operators' are pricier.

springtide9

Thanks again, really useful info. Sounds like the cut-off id not that much of a worry for people who have done some training, so it's just a case of concentrating on getting fit for a respectable (for ones self) time.

Will look out for more Audax UK events as will as local road clubs - could be a good way to ride with larger groups. Thanks again,

Kléber

It's all relative. For me too many people do these rides and struggle, their ride is all about escaping the cut off, looking over their shoulders for them broom wagon. It makes for a negative experience where fear of failure is always around the corner.

I'd say go but you're much better off being able to enjoy the day rather than grovelling. These are not survival rides.

springtide9

Kléber wrote:

It's all relative. For me too many people do these rides and struggle, their ride is all about escaping the cut off, looking over their shoulders for them broom wagon. It makes for a negative experience where fear of failure is always around the corner.

I'd say go but you're much better off being able to enjoy the day rather than grovelling. These are not survival rides.

That is exactly what I am trying to avoid. If I am close to the cut-off I would rather wait until I was in much better shape.
I guess the problem for me (and maybe others?), is that unless you have done a similar event in the past, it's hard to know whether you are in this situation or not. Hence the question, 'how long is a piece of string' (how fast, is fast enough)

TMR

For what it's worth, my view is that you should get comfortable with being in the saddle for 6 or 7 hours at a time and do that as often as you can. Obviously it's difficult to balance cycling with family life, so it'll mean an early start at the weekend.

If you can't do the time, then the only other way to prepare I can think of is to take a leaf out of Chris Carmichael's book and ramp up the intensity.

thebongolian

Only done the etape once and that was a few years ago but it sounds like the distance won't be a problem if you're already doing centuries relatively comfortably.

They key is speed. I reckon if you are able to sustain 18+ mph on the flat on you own at any point in a 100+ mile ride you've probably got what it takes to do it comfortably