Formula R1 Brakes

skaffen

Hi,

I wonder if anyone can help. I've purchased a Formula R1 (front only at the moment) to replace my Elixirs. I'm having an absolute nightmare getting it not to rub, the clearance is minute, and the bike shop aren't being too helpful (saying "it's supposed to rub" - never had that with any other brakes).

I've got it to rub to a very small amount, but I wondered if anyone with Formula brakes could give me an idea how much clearance there should be, and how easy it normally is to get them clearing the rotor. So far I've bled them twice (just in case) and the brake actually feels pretty good when pulled, it's just spinning the front wheel you can hear rubbing (even if I've got it to a low-ish level now).

The other thing that concerned me is that with the caliper off the bike, pulling the lever only moves one piston (the one closest the wheel when mounted) unless there is pressure on that. If there is a bit of pressure on it, the other piston does move, but it did seem a bit odd (again, witth the Avids both pistons move fairly evenly).

Thanks for any advice.

nicklouse

until you have bedded then in pads do rub a bit.

what mounting is the fork?

skaffen

Hi,

Thanks, I think I'll give them a bit of a run in and see how it goes, it does feel OK (actually very good) I was just concerned with the pistons that there might be a problem (and they have been incredibly hard to centre compared to the Elixirs).

It's IS mount, 160mm rotor (just the standard one, not the floating one) on a Carbon Lefty. Have trued the rotor so I know that's not causing any of it.

nicklouse

might be an idea to get the mounts faced if it seems to be rubbing on both pads but inner of one and outer of the other.

but normally it is just bedding in that is needed.

skaffen

At the moment I've got the slight rub on one side and it all seems pretty squared up, so I don't think the mounts need facing. It's pretty minor but just seemed impossible to get clear and the piston thing made me wonder if it was self-aligning off centre slightly whenever the lever was pulled.

If it's normal for a bit of rub when new I'll give it a few good rides and see how it goes.

Thanks.

101_North

I'd similar issues with a new set of K24's. One of the front pistons didn't seem to be moving as well as the other from new. I tried cleaning it to free it up and gave them a bleed but it only made a slight difference. I still have one pad which is very tight to the rotor. I can push the pistons back and realign the rotor but it always ends up the same. Not had any issues with the rear.

The rotor clearance is also really tight so I reckon what your seeing is fairly normal. Much tighter then my old Avids.

If it helps I've just left mine now and it seems much better with time. I just can't be bothered attempting to center the front caliper any more. The brakes are quiet enough and could stop a train so I'm happy enough.

Give them some time as Nick said and see how it goes.

101

skaffen

Thanks guys, that's reassured me quite a bit. I'll see how it goes with them, it seems like a really good brake in general but it was just frustrating not being sure if there was a problem or not (and Formula aren't in a hurry to answer any questions!).

101_North

If you're still wanting some tech support try Silverfish the UK distributor. I got a far quicker response from them - and a good bit of helpful advice. Formual tech support got back to me eventually (were helpful but took a while) but I'd try Silverfish as they very quick and helpful when I contacted them.

http://www.silverfish-uk.com/contact-silverfish.php

101

skaffen

Just as an update, the brake seems to be settling down a little after a few rides, so it looks like something was just getting a bit stuck. The gap between the pads and rotor is still ridiculously small (by design I'm sure) but at least it's now possible to get the pads not to rub.

Thanks for the advice everyone.

cavegiant

If your LBS thinks they are drag adjust brakes, get a new LBS.

Unless of course you bought them online and asked your LBS to set them up and they are intentionally fucking with you.

Formula brakes have VERY tight tolerances, this is why they are so powerful. (opposite of shimano which is why shima are easy to set up and relatively weak)

You just have to be very careful setting them up. look into the brake and pull the lever slowly. make sure the rotor is not moved at all in compression. if it is (likely), then just move the caliper a bit by hand and try a gain. It takes a bit of trial and error, but worth the effort.

You buy fancy kit, it sometimes needs fancy set up.

agg25

Mine never rubbed from new when I bought my bike. Were quite squeaky though. However after changing the pads for the first time (after about a year of riding) noticed it was hitting the rotor on one side. I tried taking out the pads and pushing the pistons back it and then clipped the pads back in and tightened them up while braking but they still dragged. Took it to the lbs who loosened the adaptor bolts and then hit the brakes to centre them a bit more. They still weren't exactly right so he suggested placing two very thin washers in between the adaptor and the caliper to push them out a little bit so the rotor was centered better.
Awesome brakes all in all, very light and powerful, it's just the after sales support from Formula is typically Italian, unhelpful.

skaffen

My LBS doesn't sell Formula brakes unfortunately so these were bought online from the only retailer I could find with stock at the time (rhymes with bevansbycles.com). Didn't have a real problem setting them up, it's just that initially it was impossible to get any clearance. As people here suggested (and Formula eventually got back and concurred) it was just a case of getting them to bed in a little bit. The tolerances are small, but after a few rides it's now reasonably straightforward to line them up (ie. 5 minutes to get clearance instead of an hour and still getting them rubbing).

The particular online retailer used just seemed rubbish when trying to get someone to talk to. I really just wanted confirmation that these weren't DOA (obviously not, but the fact only one piston was moving off the bike was worrying me). Someone just saying "could just be a piston is a bit tight, try a few rides with it" would have sorted the problem. Instead coming back and saying "it's supposed to do that" just made me concerned (and confirmed that they hadn't a clue).

What's also odd is that Formula's manual actually says to line them up by loosening the calliper and pulling the brake, which didn't work and I thought that that was generally a pretty bad way to centre callipers anyway?

skaffen

it's just the after sales support from Formula is typically Italian, unhelpful.

I did eventually get a (short) reply from Formula in the end, which was just to give them a few rides (and to be fair that seemed to be the correct answer). Unhelpful or not the Italians do seem to make some good bike stuff, my wife bought me some SIDI Dragon 2s last year and they're the most comfortable shoes I've got

Took it to the lbs who loosened the adaptor bolts and then hit the brakes to centre them a bit more

That's interesting, because that's what the Formula manual suggests to do to centre them, but that didn't get anywhere near and the way I managed to get them clear was to manually do them (there's a good video by Hope on YouTube about aligning brakes which I've always thought gives better results).