Knee Trouble - advice on set up please

billo01

Hi all,

I have suffered with both knees for a long while now, with experiencing sharp pain and burning sensation inside, mainly after cycling but now it seems the pain is more prolonged than is usual.

As a process of elimination and I've read several threads here about SPD set up and saddle height and was asking if anyone can point me in the right direction of advice for correctly setting these up to see if this helps with my problems.

cheers

ireland57

I don't have an answer for you as there are so many variables; maybe it's why no one else has posted too.

If you're knees are hurting that much it's worth getting a professional bike fit.

The Northern Monkey

Use flats.

I have rather bad knees, and just couldn't get SPD's to work for me.
It is known that SPD's and bad knees don't go well together.

GJC

I agree with northern monkey, spd made my knee problems worse changed to flats made hell of a difference.

GJC

Anonymous

Same here. Whilst I haven't used SPDs in about a decade, when I recently wrecked my knee, my physio warned me not to use them again.

billo01

Cheers for the replies.

Went for a ride yesterday and done quite a bit of climbing stuff. Through the ride started to get a constant pain on the right side of my left knee and the usual burning sensation inside afterwards. Anyways, today the knees are aching a bit but generally feel ok.

I've used SPD for years now so I'm going with the adivice and changing to flats.

Any suggestons on a decent set, quality, strength and light weight to go on my Ex9?

Many thanks

Anonymous

Its really worth going to see a good physio, since it could be caused by all sorts of things. Whilst I'm sure flats would help, I can't be certain, and I wouldn't like to suggest that someone spends money uneccesarily.

The Northern Monkey

yeehaamcgee
Physio's usually cost more that pedals though

Anonymous

Didn't pay for mine.

Noel PT

Sounds like a tight ITB or TFL. Basically runners knee. I often get it when I neglect my stretching. Get yourself a foam roll and do some myofascial release.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myofascial_release

Fenred

I have exactly the same symptoms as the OP, doesnt seem to make any difference if I use spd's or flats. I've gone thru meticulous bike set-up process on both my bikes and still no improvement. Was just about to book physio appt but may be worth trying myofascial release first, anyone reccommend a place to get these foam rolls?

Noel PT

They are all over the net. £20 +

Huck Finn

Hi guys, sorry to hijack this thread but...

Went out on the bike yesterday and did a 2 hour ride( the last of which was mostly uphill to varying degrees). I use SPD's also and have never had a problem.

Due to 10 years of football, my knees are not great and click a lot when i'm at rest. Anyhow, back to the ride. After about an hour i started to get a burning pain in my left knee, which seemed to be under the kneecap but right the way around it.

While riding, if i pushed down on the knee above the kneecap, it seemed to alleviate the pain, but this may have been psychosomatic.

As i was out in the sticks and alone, i had no choice but to carry on and by the time i got back to the car it was just a dull ache.

Within ten minutes of driving though, the knee had started to seize to the point i could hardly push the clutch in. I treated with ice a few times yesterday evening, but going up and down stairs caused pain under the kneecap and i had to sit with my leg straightened. The knee did not swell in any way.

Today, i have much more movement but it still hurts when bending, going up and down stairs and straightening the knee after sitting for a while with my leg bent.

Does anyone have any ideas or suffered from similar in the past?

Anonymous

It sounds like similar symptoms to when I dislocated my kneecap, actually, but not knowing much about knees, I can't say with any certainty that it is the same injury.
What caused mine, anyway, is that I'd dislocated my knee at one point, which had weakened the tendons and muscles around the joint. Afterwards, because of this weakness, and the way mountain biking uses certain muscle groups, my outside thigh muscles were not strong enough to keep my kneecap in place. So I had to do months of physio to strengthen and tighten up the muscles on the outside of the thigh so that they would pull the kneecap back into place and keep it there. Basically.

It's not something I would have guessed at all, since I can squat a considerable amount of freeweights, and I didn't think there was a weakness in my legs.
I'd urge you to see a physio.

Huck Finn

Thanks mate. Think i'd better book an appointment then. What i was hoping to do was rest it until it feels healed, then go out and see if there's a reccurance of the injury before seeking medical help. Does this sound sensible, or am i likely to do myself more harm in the long run.

When you had the "months of physio", did that mean no riding?

Anonymous

I'd still go get some professional opinions on it. You only get one set of knees, you know.
If it is similar to mine, then you'd actually just be making things worse every time you go riding.

alistaird

I agree with the suggestions here, see a physio and then get a professional bike fit (with someone who will talk with your physio.)

Alistair

Huck Finn

Cheers guys. I'll get something booked tomorrow.
I'll post here whatever the physio comes up with.

billo01

Be interested to hear how you get on Huck Finn.

I went to see my doctor last week. Basically he moved lower leg up and down and then side to side from the knee, I didn't experience any discomfort. So the bottom line is I'm being referred for physio, NHS I guess. The quack didn't seem to have any answers other than maybe a misalignment problem.

I still have the pain, although it has eased somewhat though this could be because the doc told me to keep off the bike till I get physio in around a months time, so you can guess I'm well peeved off with this having just bought my Trek.

The burning sensation is still there, it hurts going down stairs or when sitting, almost like a sciatica feeling in my legs and sometimes lower back. When in bed I can feel the calf muscle pulsating as if in spasm.

Hey ho, just keep takin the Ibuprofen. I'll let you know how I get on.

Anonymous

Just bought your trek? Pah. I bought my Marin when I couldn't even walk, I hobbled.into the shops and laid the cash out to the amusement of the shop staff

Huck Finn

That's pretty hardcore Yeeha :shock:

Just an update. Booked physio for next wednesday but 2 days on there's only slight pain in the kneecap when i move it now. I have full movement in the leg without too much pain so we'll see how it goes.

I'm guessing if it had been dislocated, i'd be in much more pain Yeeha?

Bill, i found another thread in here which sounds much more like your problems. Think it was about myofascial problems. Bloody knees are more complicated than i thought

The Northern Monkey

I was referred to a physio for my knee by the NHS. Was great - 2 times a week, free, and very well organised and explained

Best bit was the ultrasound vibrating thing. it felt SO good after that

Anonymous

Huck Finn wrote:

That's pretty hardcore Yeeha :shock:

Just an update. Booked physio for next wednesday but 2 days on there's only slight pain in the kneecap when i move it now. I have full movement in the leg without too much pain so we'll see how it goes.

I'm guessing if it had been dislocated, i'd be in much more pain Yeeha?

I'm still not sure on the sequence of events. I remember having a mahoosive crash which left my knee in absolute agony for a few weeks, but eventually subsided, and then a while later after being off the bike for a while, my knee started to hurt like all hell whenever I put any power through it.
From the various scans, and examinations, the doctors and physio reckon the knee must have been dislocated or wrenched out of place at one point (possibly the huge crash), and that in turn damaged the various ligaments, soft tissues etc round the knee, meaning that afterwards, the kneecap and to a lesser extent the joint were not being held in place properly and were migrating to the wrong place. It's that secondary effect that the physio helped.
Oh, and snowboarding. Snowboarding is awesome, it's great fun, and it turns out it really works the exact muscles the physio was trying to reinforce!

Fenred

Noel PT wrote:

They are all over the net. £20 +

Bought one, two sessions in with it doing the ITB release exercise (fark me, how much does that hurt!?!?) and almost immediate relief Cheers for the suggestion Noel!

@Billo01 Your symptoms sound identical to mine, knees, lower back etc would reccommend giving the foam roll a try in addition to everything else you're doing.

Huck Finn

yeehaamcgee wrote:

Huck Finn wrote:

That's pretty hardcore Yeeha :shock:

Just an update. Booked physio for next wednesday but 2 days on there's only slight pain in the kneecap when i move it now. I have full movement in the leg without too much pain so we'll see how it goes.

I'm guessing if it had been dislocated, i'd be in much more pain Yeeha?

I'm still not sure on the sequence of events. I remember having a mahoosive crash which left my knee in absolute agony for a few weeks, but eventually subsided, and then a while later after being off the bike for a while, my knee started to hurt like all hell whenever I put any power through it.
From the various scans, and examinations, the doctors and physio reckon the knee must have been dislocated or wrenched out of place at one point (possibly the huge crash), and that in turn damaged the various ligaments, soft tissues etc round the knee, meaning that afterwards, the kneecap and to a lesser extent the joint were not being held in place properly and were migrating to the wrong place. It's that secondary effect that the physio helped.
Oh, and snowboarding. Snowboarding is awesome, it's great fun, and it turns out it really works the exact muscles the physio was trying to reinforce!

Don't get me started on snowboarding! I've been three times, all ending in injury! Twice i twisted my right knee and the third time broke my wrist. Obviously i'm not very good but i thoroughly enjoyed my short lived time on the board. It might be of interest to you yeeha, as i see your a fellow Welshman, but two of those injuries were done on Pen Y Fan

Anonymous

I've been lucky so far on the snowboard. I've fallen tons of times, but I'm mostly grizzled scar tissue by now, after years of crashing mountain bikes, so all i've had are a few bumps and scrapes.
I though I'd broken my hand recently on the board, but it turns out it's just a hyper-extension injury, so it's all good

billo01

Fenred,

Where did you get you're foam roll from, if that's what you purchased and also the exercises, where did you get the techniques from?

Can you ponit me in the right direction?

I can't wait for the physio appointment to come through so I'm going to make a start on doing something myself.

I started back on circuit training on Tuesday after two week lay off. This involves a good warm up, circuits, then warm down through to core exercises. Avoided the circuits that involve overload on the knees and generally feel ok though still have that stabbing pain in the knees but not as intense.

I'll give the ITB release a go though as I need to get back on the bike.

Cheers all for the posts

Fenred

Here you go mate:

Foam roller-

http://physiosupplies.com/acatalog/Roun ... llers.html

How to do it -

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_q ... oller&aq=0

When you start dont be supprised if you can only manage 3 or 4 on each leg as it's very painful if your IT band is very tight!!

Hope it helps you, post up how you're getting on...

Huck Finn

Hi all, said i'd post results results of physio on left knee but forgot.

Scans revealed a weakness in a few tendons around the knee, especially the cruciate and medial ligaments.

Physio seemed to think these were old footballing injuries exaserbated by riding clipped in to pedals.

I'll have to find the stretching exercises i've been given and post some images(it would be hard work purely describing the exercises)

A few weeks on, i'm back in the saddle and riding up to 15-20 milers again, albeit on flat pedals, which were strange at first but i'm learning to love again!

Although the only pain i get now is stiffness in the knee, after every training session- bike, weights or anything else, i've been told to treat the knee with ice until such a time as there is no pain.

I've been told to start light weights also on my knees. Leg extensions for quads and hamstrings. Been told to avoid squatting heavy weights on a dodgy knee.

Anonymous

Did the physio tell you to stay away from SPDs indefinitely, or just until the pain goes away?

Huck Finn

He said it's something i can look at once the left knee has healed and sufficiently strong once more, although any weakness and damage done in the past(which the body has naturally compensated for) could return again, if tethered in pedals at a future date.

I really can't stress the difference flats have made, they are so much better on the knee!! Got a nice gash on the right shin instead of knee pain now