He fought with Ricco

Tusher
Tusher Posts: 2,762
edited March 2011 in Pro race
in a restaurant. And presumably won.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/video-z ... -on-doping

Is there no end to The Boy's talents?

Comments

  • Yellow Peril
    Yellow Peril Posts: 4,466
    I assume he popped out from behind Renshaw at the very last moment and slotted the Cobra square on the chin.

    He's not the biggest guy in the peleton fight club but I imagine he would be quite tenacious in a ruck.
    @JaunePeril

    Winner of the Bike Radar Pro Race Wiggins Hour Prediction Competition
  • LangerDan
    LangerDan Posts: 6,132
    Can I assume he also chinned the various members of HTC managment who are self-confessed dopers?

    Thought not....
    'This week I 'ave been mostly been climbing like Basso - Shirley Basso.'
  • TMR
    TMR Posts: 3,986
    LangerDan wrote:
    Can I assume he also chinned the various members of HTC managment who are self-confessed dopers?

    Thought not....

    Such as who?
  • afx237vi
    afx237vi Posts: 12,630
    edited March 2011
    The Mad Rapper wrote:
    LangerDan wrote:
    Can I assume he also chinned the various members of HTC managment who are self-confessed dopers?

    Thought not....

    Such as who?

    Aldag and Zabel.

    And Brian Holm according to Wikipedia.
  • TMR
    TMR Posts: 3,986
    afx237vi wrote:
    Aldag and Zabel.

    I am surprised TBH. Thanks.
  • Tom BB
    Tom BB Posts: 1,001
    Was it Zabel who used the "...I only tried it once and didn't like it" defence?

    Bit like when your a kid and tell your mum you only had one puff on the ciggy and didn't like....or tell the missus that you only cheated the once etc.... 8) (I have no experience of the latter btw!)
  • Tusher
    Tusher Posts: 2,762
    Didn't Zabel find it that the dope had a negative effect on him physically, and that's why he only tried it once?

    Or am I gullible?
  • dougzz
    dougzz Posts: 1,833
    afx237vi wrote:
    The Mad Rapper wrote:
    LangerDan wrote:
    Can I assume he also chinned the various members of HTC managment who are self-confessed dopers?

    Thought not....

    Such as who?

    Aldag and Zabel.

    And Brian Holm according to Wikipedia.

    Is it fair to say that it's broadly accepted that pretty much everyone in the 90's to 0 whatever was juiced at some point. If so, do you think teams should completely disassociate themselves from a whole generation of riders that now work in management/coaching roles? Without Vaughters would the Garmin team even exist? No Lance no RadioShack, Riis and Sunguard.

    I don't like the collective output from the peloton, too much booting an easy target like Ricco and not enough said about the likes of Contador and Valverde. But if you genuinely think cycling can just dissociate from a complete generation, then it simply can't continue in it's current setup. Who'll run the teams and who'll coach them if you dump all the past dopers?
  • Tusher
    Tusher Posts: 2,762
    As Dave Brailsford has just found out.
  • afx237vi
    afx237vi Posts: 12,630
    dougzz wrote:
    afx237vi wrote:

    And Brian Holm according to Wikipedia.

    Is it fair to say that it's broadly accepted that pretty much everyone in the 90's to 0 whatever was juiced at some point. If so, do you think teams should completely disassociate themselves from a whole generation of riders that now work in management/coaching roles? Without Vaughters would the Garmin team even exist? No Lance no RadioShack, Riis and Sunguard.

    I don't like the collective output from the peloton, too much booting an easy target like Ricco and not enough said about the likes of Contador and Valverde. But if you genuinely think cycling can just dissociate from a complete generation, then it simply can't continue in it's current setup. Who'll run the teams and who'll coach them if you dump all the past dopers?

    I agree to a large extent, but you have to admit that there's a certain amount of hypocrisy in condeming doping so vigorously (to the point of getting in a physical fight about it) when you surround yourself every day with people who did exactly the same thing for a much longer period. All dopers are equal, but some are more equal than others?
  • LangerDan
    LangerDan Posts: 6,132
    At least Ricco, despite being a moron of Biblical proportions, did serve some punishment. Those of the 90s have kept their palmares and winnings, revealing (or confirming, TBH) the truth only when forced to by the actions of others, and from behind the protection of retirement and the statute of limitations.

    I don't see any problem with forgiving these guys, taking advantage of the "good" skills they have and moving on, but it shouldn't be forgotten that cycling is in its current state precisely because of the actions of the Zabels and Aldags and that needs to be acknowledged too.

    Problem with Cav getting involved in such scraps is that one fine day, he'll end up picking on the wrong person - probably someone with the sociopathic tendencies of a Hinault and the patience of Job - who will "escort" a green-jersey wearing Cav out the back of the autobus and abandon him outside of the time limit.
    'This week I 'ave been mostly been climbing like Basso - Shirley Basso.'
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,241
    LangerDan wrote:
    At least Ricco, despite being a moron of Biblical proportions, did serve some punishment. Those of the 90s have kept their palmares and winnings, revealing (or confirming, TBH) the truth only when forced to by the actions of others, and from behind the protection of retirement and the statute of limitations.

    I don't see any problem with forgiving these guys, taking advantage of the "good" skills they have and moving on, but it shouldn't be forgotten that cycling is in its current state precisely because of the actions of the Zabels and Aldags and that needs to be acknowledged too.

    You have to remember that Ricco was widely disliked long before his first positive. So it's natural that he would get more abuse. Similarly if a celebrity was to be done for tax fraud (or similar), the likes of Jeremy Kyle or Piers Morgan would be more harshly judged than Stephen Fry or Rolf Harris.

    The prevailing mood of the time also needs to be considered. Some of the most popular television of the 70s would get you banned for life from show business these days.

    Judgements on people are never consistent, particularly when time is a factor.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • flanners1
    flanners1 Posts: 916
    RichN95 wrote:
    LangerDan wrote:
    At least Ricco, despite being a moron of Biblical proportions, did serve some punishment. Those of the 90s have kept their palmares and winnings, revealing (or confirming, TBH) the truth only when forced to by the actions of others, and from behind the protection of retirement and the statute of limitations.

    I don't see any problem with forgiving these guys, taking advantage of the "good" skills they have and moving on, but it shouldn't be forgotten that cycling is in its current state precisely because of the actions of the Zabels and Aldags and that needs to be acknowledged too.

    You have to remember that Ricco was widely disliked long before his first positive. So it's natural that he would get more abuse. Similarly if a celebrity was to be done for tax fraud (or similar), the likes of Jeremy Kyle or Piers Morgan would be more harshly judged than Stephen Fry or Rolf Harris.

    The prevailing mood of the time also needs to be considered. Some of the most popular television of the 70s would get you banned for life from show business these days.

    Judgements on people are never consistent, particularly when time is a factor.


    What like Adolf Hitler, Idi Amin, Stalin et al?

    Seriously though time is no such excuse or a reason for the lack of morals and cheating in the case of Pro cyclists. Judgements on people are never consistant no,neither are they in the present day, but there is a common theme that can be deduced and that is woefully clear within cycling.
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  • Yellow Peril
    Yellow Peril Posts: 4,466
    It appears that they live by the adage that "the crime is being caught" I would speculate that even today some "advisors" are seeking the next generation of undetectable PED's.

    As a bad analogy drugs in sport are a bit like smoking everyone knows you shouldn't do it (yes for different reasons I acknowledge) but it doesn't stop the next generation from partaking as they see themselves as invincible and getting caught (PED's) or dying (PED's and smoking) only happens to other people.

    If more winners had been caught and successfully booted out in the past then it wouldn't be such a problem. LA's immunity to discovery and Bertie getting off make it more of an attractive offer to new riders.

    If all PED abusers were as shambolic as Ricco then the sport would clean up a lot quicker
    @JaunePeril

    Winner of the Bike Radar Pro Race Wiggins Hour Prediction Competition
  • dougzz
    dougzz Posts: 1,833
    Is it simply the nature of cycling as a sport that makes the cheats tolerated? In other sports people regularly sound off about each other, and grudges are formed and evolve over time. But it seems in cycling with the odd exception everyone likes to say nice things about each other, or they say nothing. Cycling requires cooperation of team mates and to some degree the entire peloton. Whilst it's not that easy to help someone win a race, it's considerable easier to stop them winning. Do you think this is why there's a general unwillingness to speak out? Fear that you become a marked man (see Simeoni).

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