Knocked off yesterday whilst in a cycle lane - need advice

Babber Goo

hi all -

i was on an afternoon ride out yesterday on my road bike and had got about a mile away from home and i was knocked off at this junction by a woman in a vw golf

http://goo.gl/maps/iiMX

basically what happened was that i was in the left lane approaching the junction (in the direction of the arrow road markings), in the cycle lane (well marked) and was about to cross the junction on the left (the lights were on green), i was going say 15-20mph looking ahead at the traffic at the junction

the next thing i know her car appeared on my right hand side, headed slightly in front of me, and cut across my path as she turned into the junction i was crossing

the next thing i remember is trying to stop myself but i didn't have enough time so i careered into the kerb in a vain attempt to get out of her way, but i had nowhere to go and she turned into my front wheel, clipping the left side of her car and flipping me over BANG right into the side of her car

i didn't have time to stop, unclip or barely even react because she just pretty much came out of nowhere - i hit the ground badly and hurt both legs (just cuts & bruises fortunately) and banged my head on the floor - an ambulance was called and i was taken to A&E on a spinal board because they thought i'd hurt my neck and broken my right shin bone

i've got the police coming round tonight to deliver my bike, and to hopefully discuss what the situation was with whether i am to blame or what - i don't think i am, am i? i wasn't filtering through traffic, i wasn't attempting to get past her on the inside, i was just cycling normally

she insists that she was indicating - i'm sure she was, but i couldn't see her indicating because she was on my right hand side and not in front of me so i couldn't see her lights before she made the turn

can anyone offer me any advice here? i'd really appreciate it

thanks

spen666

irrespective of indicating or not she was in the wrong, she turned across your path when it was unsafe to do so- according to your description.

An indicator is simply what it says - an indicator- it is not a licence to ignore traffic she has just overtaken.

Likelihood is police will do very little, but you can and should consider instructing a firm of personal injury lawyers to make a civil compensation claim.

Note, use a firm of lawyers eg RJW or Bikeline, do NOT use a claim handling company

Babber Goo

thanks - yeah i'm planning to pursue a compensation claim primarily to replace the stuff that has been damaged - i've not seen the state of my bike yet, but the paramedics had to cut off my tights, my gloves are ripped, my garmin watch is smashed and i've had to take a day off work today to recover

thank god i was wearing my helmet - i always do anyway - my head hit the tarmac with some force, would i be right in thinking it will need to be replaced?

shm_uk

From your desctription of events it sounds like a typical "SMIDSY" incident, which of course is no excuse for not paying proper attention to other road users.

Just because she was indicating means nothing - if she was behind you as you both approached the junction then it is her responsibility to wait until it's safe to make the maneouvre, i.e. wait for you to pass the junction before turning left.

Do you have any witnesses? - if not, it could turn into a long drawn-out your word against hers...

bails87

From what you've said, she seems ot be in the wrong. The lane you were in allows you to go left or straight on, os no reason that she should have expected you to go left. She either didn't see you, thought she'd got past ("cyclist must be doing 5mph") or she expected you to get out of her way.

If she's repeated her comments to the police/witnesses then that could help, if she's essentially said "I saw him, I started to overtake, then I drove into him".

It might have been wise to have taken 'primary position' i.e. middle of the lane, through the junction though, just to be sure no-one could try to get past.

Get well soon!

kelsen

Babber Goo wrote:

thank god i was wearing my helmet - i always do anyway - my head hit the tarmac with some force, would i be right in thinking it will need to be replaced?

Not sure if medical advancement has reached that stage yet so I'd stick with the one you've got currently! As for the helmet, I would say yes. Any impact may have compromised the structural integrity of it but remain invisible to the eye.

All too common scenario I'm afraid. Driver goes to turn left, is probably aware of cyclist nearing junction, but assumes right of way. Cyclist t-bones car. Driver cites 'I was indicating!' as an excuse for their action.

Definitely pursue this matter further as per the advice from the others.

The Rookie

New Helmet - 100% yes

AS has been said, I assume sh 'overtook you' as a cyclsit she then assumed she was in front and turned into you, as she was crossing a white line (between lane and cycle lane) she had to give way.

Personally I would try a sensible conversation with he first BEFORE getting an ambulance chaser involved, bumps up everyone's premium and the only wnners are the chasers, of course if she won't 'talk turkey' you have no choice.

Simon

The Rookie

Duplicate deleted

Babber Goo

thanks guys - i appreciate your sage advice

i don't know about witnesses, and i don't have her details - can't even remember the registration number of her car - i was pretty much laid out on the ground with my head being held in a neck brace, covered in a pile of coats being asked a barrage of questions, unable to move

a bunch of people came over to help me, and a plain clothes policeman was on the scene within about 15 minutes - i believe this is the bloke who is bringing my bike back tonight - i'll just have to wait and see what he says/advises before i take things further i suppose

hstiles

Indicating is just that, indication of your intention to turn left/turn right/pull out, ou are still expected to exercise due care and attention and be aware of other road users. If she'd been on her driving test and had turned left, cutting you up (althoug without hitting you), the examiner would have failed her on the spot.

So, I would pursue a civil claim against her for injury, loss of earnings, damage tyo you bike and whatever else your lawyer reckons he can squeeze out of her.

Headhuunter

I don't understand this "I was indicating" excuse! I had a van driver almost mow me down a week or 2 ago, I got through but he hit the moped rider behind me. I stopped and all he could say was "I was indicating" as if it gave him some god given right to turn without looking...

This woman is clearly to blame. When I had my crash a year or so ago, the police gave me the phone number of the driver. I had no witnesses or anything because I was laid out on the tarmac, but the police took statements etc and the driver admitted fault and was made to go on a driving course...

Headhuunter

hstiles wrote:

Indicating is just that, indication of your intention to turn left/turn right/pull out, ou are still expected to exercise due care and attention and be aware of other road users. If she'd been on her driving test and had turned left, cutting you up (althoug without hitting you), the examiner would have failed her on the spot.

So, I would pursue a civil claim against her for injury, loss of earnings, damage tyo you bike and whatever else your lawyer reckons he can squeeze out of her.

Oh and definitely pursue a civil case. I initially asked the driver to pay for my bike but he refused so I got a sol involved and thank god I did as I had physio and had to pay for medication as well as for a new bike and public transport to and from work for a few weeks.

hstiles

Headhuunter wrote:

Oh and definitely pursue a civil case. I initially asked the driver to pay for my bike but he refused so I got a sol involved and thank god I did as I had physio and had to pay for medication as well as for a new bike and public transport to and from work for a few weeks.

That's a very good point. Injuries sustained as a result of an accident have a habit of not fully mainfesting themselves immediately, so it pays to go down the official route and, if neccesary, get a medical examination to support any compensation claims.

Headhuunter

hstiles wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

Oh and definitely pursue a civil case. I initially asked the driver to pay for my bike but he refused so I got a sol involved and thank god I did as I had physio and had to pay for medication as well as for a new bike and public transport to and from work for a few weeks.

That's a very good point. Injuries sustained as a result of an accident have a habit of not fully mainfesting themselves immediately, so it pays to go down the official route and, if neccesary, get a medical examination to support any compensation claims.

I still get aches and pains in my left hip from time to time and the accident happened in Nov 09...

pastryboy

Definitely her fault as others have said - I very much doubt there's a regular cyclist who hasn't had something similar happen to them albeit without the same consequences. Happened to me a couple of times but I've just about avoided a collission The problem is drivers assume you're pootling at 5mph just indicate and turn at the same time not thinking it through that, to turn, they'll have to decelerate.

Any time I'm coming to a junction I look for a space between cars and try and plant myself in the middle of the lane - it 'should' stop any overtaking and gives a better view. Obviously you can still get caught out though.

Babber Goo

the police dropped off my bike tonight - unfortunately it wasn't the same PC who was at the scene, but they're apparently going to get him to call me to discuss things

they did tell me that from reading the "report" there was pretty much no doubt that it wasn't my fault, and rather than being "nobody's fault" it was edging towards being her fault - apparently she'd overtaken me and then believing that she'd passed me, turned in to the left - so it sounds like another one of the same incidents that many of you kind folk describe in this thread

my mudguards are ruined, my (beautiful white, lovely sexy) saddle is torn and ruined, the wheels are out of true and my bar ends are knackered (it's a flat bar road bike), there's a bunch of deep scratches - at first glance - i'm going to take it to my LBS to get checked over tomorrow to see if there is any more damage

i'm totally gutted - getting the bike back tonight really hammered it home that stuff is "broken" now i need to get a compensation claim going to get some money to cover fixing everything - to be honest i'd like a whole new bike in an vain attempt to forget about the whole event

thanks all for your help/suggestions!

The Rookie

Sounds like you are into a new bike, how old was the one trashed, if it's less than a year old you'd have a case for new value, otherwise it would be at the market value.

I'd still advocate getting an agreed settlement for losses direct from the driver if they will play ball, no need to add to solicitors profits unless you have to!

Simon

Headhuunter

The Beginner wrote:

Sounds like you are into a new bike, how old was the one trashed, if it's less than a year old you'd have a case for new value, otherwise it would be at the market value.

I'd still advocate getting an agreed settlement for losses direct from the driver if they will play ball, no need to add to solicitors profits unless you have to!

Simon

Yeah, if the police will give you her number, give her a ring. My bike was trashed after my crash in Nov 09 and would have cost about £500-550 to replace. I spoke to the driver but he refused to pay, saying he would only give me £200.... Kept harping on about his smashed windscreen too where my body had hammered into his car. I was thinking "oh sorry mate, did my ass damage you sh!tty Ford Escort?"... Anyway, got RJ&W onto him and got thousands out of his insurance company.

In future, coming up to a left turn like that, it's worth "taking the lane", ie, pulling into the middle of the lane itself to make it impossible or very awkward for a car to turn left round you. Ignore them if they honk their horns at you. Do what's safest for you.

Babber Goo

The Beginner wrote:

Sounds like you are into a new bike, how old was the one trashed, if it's less than a year old you'd have a case for new value, otherwise it would be at the market value.

I'd still advocate getting an agreed settlement for losses direct from the driver if they will play ball, no need to add to solicitors profits unless you have to!

Simon

the bike was probably only about 6 months old and i've still got the receipts

unfortunately the police won't give me the woman's contact number (apparently they're not "allowed") so i can't contact her directly - time to start putting together my claim whilst my wounds are still fresh

i've taken photographs of my injuries, the site of the accident - is it also advisable to take photos of all the stuff that's been damaged? (my helmet, bike, clothes, etc)?

i'm thinking of going with Bikeline for my claim, after reading a few recommendations on here - does anyone have any experience of their claims handling process?

Headhuunter

Babber Goo wrote:

The Beginner wrote:

Sounds like you are into a new bike, how old was the one trashed, if it's less than a year old you'd have a case for new value, otherwise it would be at the market value.

I'd still advocate getting an agreed settlement for losses direct from the driver if they will play ball, no need to add to solicitors profits unless you have to!

Simon

the bike was probably only about 6 months old and i've still got the receipts

unfortunately the police won't give me the woman's contact number (apparently they're not "allowed") so i can't contact her directly - time to start putting together my claim whilst my wounds are still fresh

i've taken photographs of my injuries, the site of the accident - is it also advisable to take photos of all the stuff that's been damaged? (my helmet, bike, clothes, etc)?

i'm thinking of going with Bikeline for my claim, after reading a few recommendations on here - does anyone have any experience of their claims handling process?

There doesn't seem to be a firm policy on the police handing over contact details, the police came to hospital to take a statement and gave me the drivers details "in case I wanted to make a civil claim...".... They basically encouraged me to do it... If you haven't got the contact details and the police won't hand them over then you may have to go down the legal route and employ a solicitor... I used Russell, Jones & Walker and they were very good...

charlie_lcc

Definitely get solicitors on your side, ones with real experience like RJW, cycle-claims, Levenes, Leigh Day etc. Getting witnesses is crucial and the sooner the better. Are there any local blog sites or cyclists lists, lots of people will have seen something. If they know you are asking for help they often come forward.
This type of crash is very common, you are lucky it wasn't a lorry or van. People judge (or mis-judge) an overtaking move without realising that starting to turn reduces their forward speed dramatically, they think they have gone past a cyclist while in fact they are cutting across they cyclist's path at the same time as slowing down dramatically. Or maybe they just don't think at all. Very often we hear the claim that the cyclist was overtaking on the left when the reality is very different. Helmet cams and cctv are beginning to show how these crashes really happen.

dilemna

spen666 wrote:

irrespective of indicating or not she was in the wrong, she turned across your path when it was unsafe to do so- according to your description.

An indicator is simply what it says - an indicator- it is not a licence to ignore traffic she has just overtaken.

Likelihood is police will do very little, but you can and should consider instructing a firm of personal injury lawyers to make a civil compensation claim.

Note, use a firm of lawyers eg RJW or Bikeline, do NOT use a claim handling company

+1. All I can add is GWS.

dilemna

Headhuunter wrote:

Babber Goo wrote:

The Beginner wrote:

Sounds like you are into a new bike, how old was the one trashed, if it's less than a year old you'd have a case for new value, otherwise it would be at the market value.

I'd still advocate getting an agreed settlement for losses direct from the driver if they will play ball, no need to add to solicitors profits unless you have to!

Simon

the bike was probably only about 6 months old and i've still got the receipts

unfortunately the police won't give me the woman's contact number (apparently they're not "allowed") so i can't contact her directly - time to start putting together my claim whilst my wounds are still fresh

i've taken photographs of my injuries, the site of the accident - is it also advisable to take photos of all the stuff that's been damaged? (my helmet, bike, clothes, etc)?

i'm thinking of going with Bikeline for my claim, after reading a few recommendations on here - does anyone have any experience of their claims handling process?

There doesn't seem to be a firm policy on the police handing over contact details, the police came to hospital to take a statement and gave me the drivers details "in case I wanted to make a civil claim...".... They basically encouraged me to do it... If you haven't got the contact details and the police won't hand them over then you may have to go down the legal route and employ a solicitor... I used Russell, Jones & Walker and they were very good...

When I was knocked down the plod were most unco-operative even by their own miserable standards refusing to tell me who the other party's insurers were. I got in touch with plod a few days after me being taken down, as on the evening I was taken to A&E where I stayed 2 nights. When I got home I called them but the b4stards refused to give me the driver's insurance details because of Data Protection they said. WTF! And what about my legal right to know the insurance details of the other party under the Road Traffic Act? Nope the feckers still wouldn't give me the insurance details telling me they couldn't be sure who I was. I could be ....... anyone. Useless f3ckers.

The Rookie

What a load of rubbish, the other driver is required to by law to provide you with her details, as she couldn't reasonably do so, then the Police should pass them on.

I had a hit and run and my local police passed on the other (Polish) drivers full details as soon as they got them.

Simon