Cycling and Depression

15peter20

For reasons I won't bore you with, have had a bit of a rough period and Dr recommending a course of anti-depressants and/or beta blockers to deal with stress.

Just wondering if anyone's prepared to be open and discuss whether they've kept up their cycling while taking such medication and/or whether it has affected their performance in any way.

I want to very much keep cycling as much as poss as a way of beating the blues, but I'm unsure what effects, say - prozac - would have? I'd be gutted if I had to cut down on my riding.

Thanks

Captain Fagor

Can't help you with any pointers about medication and cycling, but I would recommend this book:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Healing-without ... 551&sr=8-1

Good luck with beating the blues, with medicated assistance or (preferably) without.

whyamihere

I spent a little over a year taking citalopram for depression. I didn't notice any side-effects to my cycling performance, if anything it coincided with my strongest riding, which I attribute to having the motivation to go out riding instead of just sitting at the computer or staying in bed as I had before starting to use it.
When starting on the pills, I felt pretty lousy physically really, quite a lot of nausea. However, once I was over this, I was fine until I stopped and got some withdrawal symptoms. I'm debating going back onto them at the moment (I don't think the black dog ever really leaves), and cycling performance is something which I haven't even thought about, even though it is important to me.

15peter20

thanks both for the replies.

I should say that I am going to investigate all options before deciding to take medication, but I really think it would have been counter productive to find I'd have to curtail my cycling because I was feeling lousy because of side-effects, or worse, exercising whilst on them was dangerous.

My depression has been on and off for years also, but currently is taking the form of excessive anxiety and I'm finding that the initial rush from a ride really helps, but once that wears off, I feel even more jittery than if I'd have had a relaxing drive to work instead of riding in - I mean rapid heart beat and generally feeling hyper to the point of being manic. Not pleasant. It's making me feel like stopping cycling to work. Maybe anti depressants might help take the edge off and still allow me to cycle to work.

I guess these are Q's for the doctor, but I do appreciate your willingness to discuss.

Stu T

I suffer a lot mate, but fought ADs to be counter productive for anything more than a few weeks.

Your GP will prob just throw you some tablets but if he can get referred to a specialist for proper treatment.

There's also a book on Cognative Behaviourial Therapy by a Paul Gilbert which I use and it seems to help. Some doc's even prescribe it now.

Good Luck anyhow

Captain Fagor

If it's anxiety that the problem, I can also recommend this book:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Self-Help-Your- ... 746&sr=1-1

It describes the "fear - adrenaline - fear" cycle which leads to anxiety attacks and depression, and recommends breaking the cycle by the following actions:

Face your fears
Accept your fears
Float past your fears
Let time pass.

My overly-simplistic description obviously doesn't do the book content justice. But it might be a start.

shouldbeinbed

Reactive depression for ~18 months 'managed' with Paroxetine (20 then 40mg) I didn't notice any particular physical side effects for cycling. it was often what got me out of bed in the mornings and able to get onto my bike, it also took away the anxiety chest pains.

one physical side efect however was a viagra like stamina

deptfordmarmoset

From my own experience- and of course it's very specific to me - but avoid the beta blockers. I had a pretty high-stress occupation and extremely high blood pressure. I took beta blockers at one dosage but my job demanded more adrenaline, so as I got more and more tired and my body learned to fight the adrenalin deprivation, the dosage was increased. The final effect was that I could really only face work stress one or two days a week - what was happening was that the BBs were diminishing my way of dealing with the stress, so that after an adrenaline-using session whilst taking an adrenalin-reducing medication left me feeling totally fücked - in a bad way, I mean. Absolutely nothing left.

I wouldn't want to cycle on the kind of empty that beta blockers left me on - you need reserves to deal with demanding challenges.

I've been taking a generic version of ''Prozac'' for a couple of months - Fluoxetine - no physical side-effects so far, no diminution as far as I can tell of the ability to deal reflexively to the ''react or die'' moments you get on a bike in traffic.

plowmar

I took fluoxetine for stress/depression but after awhile (6/7 months) just got fed up with relying on the drugs. So with doctors help I gradually came off them.

I found that the riding actually temporarily countered the feelings of depression for a day or so, so that may be a way to handle your situation, however i still have to fight with myself to get kitted up and go out, but once out great.

Which ever way you and your doctor decide good luck and take my best wishes for the future.

Anonymous

I was put on seroxat for 12 months, initial nausea but no physical side effects except what was said above, lots of mojo but took a long time to complete

Good luck mate.

StillGoing

I had severe depression between 1999 and 2003 due to a malicious complaint at work that saw me in the dock at Crown Court facing two years inside, the break-up of my first marriage and a lifetime of emotions that I'd simply bottled up the culmination of which was talking a 16 year old girl down off a roof for three hours in the pouring rain with a bunch of student onlookers shouting for her to jump. You never really get over it and just learn to recognise when things are building up and to find a release. Blokes don't cry we're all told but if you imagine your emotions being put into a barrell every time, eventually the barrell becomes full. In order to be able to put more emotions in the barrell you've got to let some of the emotions out otherwise it will burst and with it goes your sanity.

I was fortunate that my inner defence mechanism kicked in. I used to regularly be in the bar with the rest of my shift after work, but when all this started happening, I stopped drinking completely as if recognising the danger depression and alcohol can cause. It's a vicious circle with alcohol being a depressant. I was prescribed drugs to help me cope but flushed them all down the toilet because I didn't want temptation.

With the help of the people around me, a good counsellor, a willingness to cry and something to distract the mind I managed to find a way of coping. .I still have the odd day where I just want my own company and the people who know me recognise those days. I have to sit with my back to the wall and facing the door whenever we go out and I'm uncomfortable going to new places. I won't go into a city centre off duty. Since all this managed to find various ways of releasing the pressures and my suggestion is for you to find things that can occupy your mind. We're all different, but it's worth a try.

Good luck to you.

DevonClimber

Edited this out as no longer applies

keef66

Recurrent depression; been on and off 3 or 4 different SSRI type antidepressants, now on venlafaxine. Best results when combined with some kind of talking therapy. Weird side effects at first, but the only lasting ones are constipation and night sweats. Those I can cope with, it's better than shouting at people or contemplating driving into a tree.

No adverse effects on cycling, in fact the pills probably make it easier for me to galvanise myself and get out on the bike. And the exercise and being outdoors definitely elevates my mood. I'd probably not need the medication if I could give up work and cycle every day.

Withdrawal symptoms when coming off them are pretty unpleasant, especially with what I'm taking now.

Milkmaid

Hi Peter,

Like many of the others that have replied, I too suffer from the curse of the black dog. I spent 6 months on citalopram last year and suffered a few initial side effects (slight dizziness, nausea, night sweats) but these only last a week or two. I also had some withdrawal symptoms (brain buzz) but was glad that I'd used the pills - they worked wonders. Unfortunately I've had a recent relapse which is now getting better thanks to taking sertrazine (Spelling?). Again, I've had a few mild side effects (tired/nausea) but overall the pills are working well for me.

My advice would be... don't delay... start taking the pills as soon as possible. They haven't had any ill effects with regards to my cycling which in itself is a brilliant way of keeping the bloody dog away from the door. In fact, I'm sure exercising in itself is one of the best cures.

I'd also recommend this book: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Depressive-illn ... 210&sr=8-1

I heard the author on Radio 2 before Christmas and what he was saying made a lot of sense to me and helped me to understand what I'm going through. Best of all, the book is cheap, easy to read and relatively short so its easy to digest. i keep going back to it whenever I get confused about my state of mind.

Hope you get better soon!

gethmetal

Chapeau to the OP for starting this discussion.

For me, depression has been a feature of much of my adult life. I'd guess that it's hereditary to a certain extent, as my late father and my older sister were/are sufferers.

I have tried SSRI's (Prozac, Lustral, and others I can't remember) in the past, but I have never reached the point where the side effects decreased enough to make any therapeutic effects noticeable. My digestion reacted badly to all the drugs we tried, my sleep was badly affected by most of them, and my tinnitus went into overdrive (which for me was the worst thing, it's bad at the best of times so anything that makes it worse gets a massive thumbs-down.)

So for me, to quote Richard Ashcroft, the 'drugs don't work', and I will NEVER try to treat depression with drugs again. My 'solution' is to try the hardest I can to get through the dark days when the Black Dog is on my case, and enjoy the days when he's busy elsewhere to the full. As time goes by, I find the latter are more common than the former, and as my experience of depression grows it's effects on me are much shorter acting.

In short, Life is Grand. Just not all the time.

bagpusscp

When suffering from cinical depression bear the following in mind.
If taking anti depressants. Do not stop taking the medication just because you feel better.{ie without seeing your GP} Talking from first hand here.

When you are depressed try do not over do it on your bike .{From acorns come Oak trees.}....Cinical deprssion real does drain to body..Steady gentle exercise .. There is nothing better for body and mind.Take the dog out and loose it!!

Be kind to yourself.

As with all who post on this topic it is a big step foward.It is like talking over the garden fence...by the end of the week you will be along way towards the answer.

15peter20

Thanks for all the replies. I really wanted to just gather some people's experiences of medication affecting performance, but it's also interesting to read how people are trying to deal with this in different ways.

It would be heartbreaking and darkly ironic for me to have to curtail / give up my cycling because of medication that is supposed to be improving my quality of life! So I think what I have read is very encouraging.

I wholly buy into what many people have said in respect of dealing with the underlying problem and not just trying to mask it. But hey, I have to get on with my life in the meantime and keep spinning those plates. One day I maybe able to let them come crashing down and not give a damn.

tebbit

I suffered from stress when I was setting up my business, I was suffering physical symptoms and my doctor suggested I was suffering from stress, I cannot remember the medication he prescribed but I ended up not taking it. Luckily in my case it was over work and I was able to adjust my working practices.

All the best for the future.

Flasheart

As many of the regulars on here know, I suffer from Clinical Depression and have for many years. I've been on Venlafaxine since 1998 (Prozac made me happy to feel suicidal & apparently that's bad ...now I just feel suicidal with none of the happy effects :P ), and I can't say if I'll ever be off them. I have tried & according to my ex-wife I was unbearable to live with or be around.
At my age and disposition I can't really comment on performance tbh. All I know is that when I'm out on my bike(s) I'm smiling. Except ofc when I come across a t*sspot driver or pedestrial with no fekkin road sense.

Riding really does lift my mood & it's a therapy for me and there are none of the nasty side effects

crankycrank

I have been using 10mg Paroxetine (brand name Paxil) for over 15 yrs and used Prozac for about 5 yrs before that. Having depression all my life I have tried so many different treatments including reading books, individual therapy, group therapy, removing my silver dental fillings, almost every type of depression specific medication, illegal stimulants (not good for depression) and even MTFU (Manning The F*ck Up). Some helped a little, others were less than useless. Paroxetine has been the most effective treatment for me. Each of these mentioned has been of help to someone so it never hurts to try different methods, except the illegal stimulants of course. Trying to find the best medication can really be difficult for some people as the adjustment period can last as long as 4 weeks for some of them and during that time can cause some difficult emotional reactions such as hyperactivity, short temper, etc. Stick with it if you can until the adjustment period is over as the eventual result may work very well for you. If not, try something else. You could be lucky though and start feeling better immediately so hopefully that will be your experience. Another thing to note is that having had my own experience and having many friends go through the same I find that many doctors tend to start out with too high of a dose for some people. If you find that using a particular drug is unbearable try cutting back on the dose and notify your doctor. I only mention this because I have found that it's such a common problem that people should be made aware as you may run into some resistance from some doctors who don't consider your opinion valid. As far as affecting cycling my own experience is that Prozac and Paroxetine have no effect but some of the other medications could make me feel groggy or slow down my reactions slightly so I kept the bike and tried different meds. Cycling is really a big help in keeping the spirits up as well but it's usually a real effort to get on the bike. I almost always feel better after a ride. I hope you find some relief and that this is just a temporary thing for you. Good Luck!!!

DevonClimber

crankycrank wrote:

and even MTFU (Manning The F*ck Up)

This reminded me of a thread i saw on another Forum. Not aimed at you Peter or any others for that matter< just a bit of simple minded relief

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=unkIVvjZc9Y

LazyBoycp

Milkmaid wrote:

Hi Peter,

Like many of the others that have replied, I too suffer from the curse of the black dog. I spent 6 months on citalopram last year and suffered a few initial side effects (slight dizziness, nausea, night sweats) but these only last a week or two. I also had some withdrawal symptoms (brain buzz) but was glad that I'd used the pills - they worked wonders. Unfortunately I've had a recent relapse which is now getting better thanks to taking sertrazine (Spelling?). Again, I've had a few mild side effects (tired/nausea) but overall the pills are working well for me.

My advice would be... don't delay... start taking the pills as soon as possible. They haven't had any ill effects with regards to my cycling which in itself is a brilliant way of keeping the bloody dog away from the door. In fact, I'm sure exercising in itself is one of the best cures.

I'd also recommend this book: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Depressive-illn ... 210&sr=8-1

I heard the author on Radio 2 before Christmas and what he was saying made a lot of sense to me and helped me to understand what I'm going through. Best of all, the book is cheap, easy to read and relatively short so its easy to digest. i keep going back to it whenever I get confused about my state of mind.

Hope you get better soon!

I'm on citalopram at the moment, after being diagnosed with (mild) depression last Nov when I got up one day and just couldn't face going in to work. I took the pill before going to bed initially, but ended up with horrendous insomnia and would shake uncontrollably for a minute or so after waking. I switched to taking it in the morning and that seems to have sorted out the side effects.

My cycling doesn't appear to have been affected; indeed, I'm out on my bike a lot more than I was in the month or so before starting taking the citalopram. Mind you, I haven't been on rides of more than about 20 miles (partly due to the weather, partly due to not having time), so I don't know if my stamina has been affected.

I too have the Cantopher book, on the recommendation of my GP. Haven't read it yet though...

bristolpete

Another one here.

Been suffering from depression since I was in my 0-10's. Got worse in my teens and gradually, by the time I hit 30 had a massive breakdown. Lost my marriage, house, job and my mind. Tried to commit suicide twice in 2005 and have contemplated it ever since being found and saved. Dark days, I really wanted to die. Never goes away. The difficultly comes from people finding that you suffer from depression - its as if they see a different person. A stigma is applied I feel. The irony is that I think I am a decent person. I ask for nothing and give a lot which suits me. What I do ask for is my own space and I suppose the one thing I would dearly love to have back is my ex wife who I lost over my illness. She was the love of my life - an amazing cyclist and woman but people move on and I am in a better place now. In fact I rode past her just the other day and gave her some of Nap's patented Quad power via my legs. We don't talk, I am a ghost to her. Ho hum. I also have an amazing GF called Jo who in turn has become my best friend et al.

Of late, baring the personal issues with my niece I have not felt bad at all and enjoy my cycling incredibly. If anything, I have been using cognitive thinking and saying that destiny brought me to road cycling given it was the only means of transport I could afford when I was renting a room in a house. It were as if someone flicked a switch. Of course, the real paradox of cycling is that it can consume you and ruin relationships (see pokerfaces blog) but overall I think it does the world of good. It has also brought true friendship my way as well. Cyclists are kindred, of that there's no doubt.

Never say never and all that. I bid everyone good ongoing luck with the battle. Fight the good fight as they say.

Pete.

AndyRubio

I took some once, they made me feel worse and so stopped. But I felt better on the other side, so maybe they worked. But while I was on them sheesh I felt weird and unable to ride.

Karl2010

Can't comment about the OP on the way AD's affect performance, but i can give a little input on the topic.
Some people might find this usefull.

http://wellbecoming.blogspot.com/
Well Becoming
a blog about being well, becoming well, staying well - and flourishing.
Written by a professor and family doctor living in Liverpool, UK

I could write my own mini book about my experiences with depression but i havnt the time.

Some usefull tips.

Relax, Exercise, Dont do too much, Make time for yourself, Try to eat healthy, Dont drink alcohol, Socialise, Talk to people, Find out if there are any Mental Health charities in your area, Ask your GP to get you some counciling, Try doing something that makes you feal good, treat yourself to something like getting a hair cut, or buying some new cloths.

I belive there are more natural ways to change my mood.
Most doctors are too quick to prescribe anti depresants.

When i realy start to struggle i take St John's Wart to give me a boost & it does work and is "underated" as an anti depressant. I have taken this off and on for about 5 years.
It does increase you sesitivity to sunlight and makes you get a sun tan quicker.
I havnt noticed any negitive side effects from taking it.

I have also recently bought a Sun Lamp/S.A.D Lamp. They're supposed to give off the same light frequency's as the sun.
It DOES help me to wake up in the morning.
I set it to come on 1 hour before im due to get out of bed, and when i wake up i am instantly awake, without any feelings of lathargy. These definitly work.
Also Vitimin D is good in the winter.

Obviously everybody has differant needs & requres differant treatment, but keep an open mind about the other treatment options that are avalible, the cure for depression does not necessarily come in "pill" form.

unixnerd

I know someone who uses beta blockers and she found that at the gym they stopped her heart rate going over 105 no matter what she did. Fluoxitine / Prozac takes about six weeks to be effective I think, also be very careful as different brand names of the same prescription drug can have slightly different effects. My friend had problems when she was supplied with what was supposed to be the same drug from a different manufacturer. That said Fluoxitine is doing her a lot of good.

I think the big issue with this sort of thing is do you take it as a temporary thing or for life? How and when do you come off the drugs, if at all?

If you live alone think about getting a pet, our cats never fail to cheer me up if I'm down. I take sedating anti-histamines due to a skin condition, they stop me scratching at night. One side affect is that I ALWAYS get a good nights sleep with no other side affects. I think if you're depressed and can't sleep, just worrying all night then something like that would be a big help and a good alternative to anything stronger. A proper sleep makes the rest of the day much easier.

UpTheWall

There is study after study, not to mention a stack of logic, to say the drugs don't work. They only cover up the problem, whereas talking therapy can actually fix it.

(In fact many of them are still not fully understood, which is not surprising given how little we understand the workings of the brain. That said we understand the mind a little bit better...)

The stats indicate that people that use drugs are significantly more likely to drop back into "severe" depression than those that use some form of therapy.

Here's one of those articles from the mighty Jonah Lehrer:
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/28/magaz ... ion-t.html

It's a long one that looks at the positives / reasons behind aspects of a depressive state of mind (yes, there are good evolutionary reasons for it!), but about half way in it refers to the drugs issue.

I could go on all day but work calls...

Anyway, good luck to all those currently working through issues - I've helped a number of people through depression and seen them use it as a tool to work through issues or early life trauma and come out as less fearful and more whole people at the other side.

Si

alfablue

You may be interested in reading this NICE Guidance on treating depression in primary care, this is based on current best evidence, and should be what your GP is guided by. There is a Patient's advice version too.

davelakers

About 10 years ago I suffered what can be described as a mini breakdown. It came after a long period of 70 odd hour weeks and an ongoing unhappy relationship. I suffered panic attacks, sweats, nausea etc etc and I didnt have a clue what was happening to me. Finally I took myself off to the quacks to be told to pull myself together and calm down. Yeah OK, its that easy.

I booked to see another doctor and he immediately diagnosed me with depression. In all the low points I never really felt "depressed" just very anxious and scared. I was prescribed some anti-ds but they made me feel worse, I had strong violent urges which is so out of character for me. The fact that I was told I had depression made me worry even more, I was scared I was going to commit suicide even though it never entered my head. (if that makes sense). I binned the drugs and went to see a counsellor and cried for an hour every Monday night for 8 weeks. That helped me tremendously and I felt well and strong again.

4 years later in the build up to my marriage it all returned with a bang and I began to doubt my love for my wife. So I worried about that and it snowballed into something horrendous. After searching the internet I came across this link http://www.panicfree.co.nz/ and registered my interest. 3 hours later I got a call from David in Auckland and he spent 2 hours talking to me and explaining how the treatment works. It is the best £30 I have ever spent. Within days I was practising the techniques to heal myself. It basically is understanding of your inner voice and to accept you feel this emotions and to let them take over, but to not react to them.

If anybody is suffering from anxiety/depression it is well worth clicking on the link, it has made a massive difference to my life.

UpTheWall

Sounds like a version of this: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Focusing-Bantam ... 0553278339

Bunneh

I've been on Citalopram and Seroxat on and off for around 10 years. I don't suffer depression, I'm OCD and paranoid delusional but those drugs were meant to help. The citalopram has worked well dragging me out of the paranoid thought processes and into somewhat of a normal life; yet the problems still hang around.

I would avoid Seroxat as it can, in some cases, cause you to become more aggressive than normal, also some of the side effects are quite unpleasant.

Cycling does help, it really does. I don't go too far if my head's in a bad place because I know that I will hit a panic stage and have to get home asap - but a belt around the local countryside is easily done and can make you feel a lot better. Just as a side note however, when you go on Citalopram it takes a month to get into your system so don't expect immediate results you won't get any. Once it is in your system you will notice a marked improvement in your mood and you won't stress as much. If you miss a day you won't notice the withdrawl but if you miss a few days you will and that's where I would recommend not driving/riding. You become dizzy and it would be unwise to go anywhere - just take your pills as soon as you can and the dizziness will subside.