Why are some frames £100 and some £1000

jeremyrundle

Ok I am not THAT daft, but, having bought a Sanderson LIFE frame and had my bike built, I started looking and, for the life of me whilst I can see that there is an obvious difference between a frame on a £200 bike and a £1000 bike, I see little between say £500 and £900 etc, !.

http://most-expensive.net/bicycle

cyclingpast

Do you mean very few frames between 500 and 900, or very few bikes between 500 and 900?

tptvmbircn

if i'm correct and understand the question its mainly down to material, im looking into a 572 (i think off the top of my head) steel on-one frame for fun costing £99, or a new salsa ala carte costing roughly £599 i think, the difference is the salsa is an 853 tubing which is lighter.

wgwarburton

Hi,
Diminishing returns.

You can build a frame for peanuts but it'll be heavy and may have weak points.

Good quality tubing needs particular characteristics to be light, strong and ride well. The cost of the material and effort to work it increases.
There's less volume in expensive frames, so each one has to have a bigger mark-up to sustain a decent margin.

You generally can't see the differences but you can feel them when you pick up the bike, or ride it.

It's not easy to make a good frame... quality costs.

Cheers,
W.

jeremyrundle

WGWarburton wrote:

Hi,
Diminishing returns.

You can build a frame for peanuts but it'll be heavy and may have weak points.

Good quality tubing needs particular characteristics to be light, strong and ride well. The cost of the material and effort to work it increases.
There's less volume in expensive frames, so each one has to have a bigger mark-up to sustain a decent margin.

You generally can't see the differences but you can feel them when you pick up the bike, or ride it.

It's not easy to make a good frame... quality costs.

Ah, yes, so whilst a £300 frame may look similar to a £700 frame there are differences unseen.

Cheers,
W.

ndru

It's the type (quality) of steel or type of material they use, it's the joining technique (welding lugging) it's the finish (galvanizing, zinc primers so on

HadronCyclist

perceived value but you aren't looking for an economics answer are you?

jeremyrundle

HadronCyclist wrote:

perceived value but you aren't looking for an economics answer are you?

Not really, I have been doing a lot of "looking" and most frames "look" much of a muchness in the shops, and it is hard to see why one MTB frame with the same parts as another MTB frame is many hundreds different, (or any frame) only I use MTB for commuting

iPete

The law of diminishing returns.

Stuey01

If you're only using your MTB for commuting then it is pointless spending lots on it.

But in answer to your question: materials, design, marketing, sales volume, brand snobbery - all of these are reasons there is a difference in price between seemingly similar frames.

Hoopdriver

You left out craftsmanship - and if you are buying a hand-made (and thus costly) frame, that is what you are paying for.

Stuey01

Hoopdriver wrote:

You left out craftsmanship - and if you are buying a hand-made (and thus costly) frame, that is what you are paying for.

Fair enough.
My list was not intended to be exhaustive.

jeremyrundle

Hoopdriver wrote:

You left out craftsmanship - and if you are buying a hand-made (and thus costly) frame, that is what you are paying for.

Ok, so like a quality car, it still has engine, wheels etc but better quality

thanks

davmaggs

The assumption that price is based on materials or workmanship is not true (known as cost+). The whole point of a marketing department and good customer analysis is that you price according to value.

Example being that Apple buys off the shelf parts worth X, but by spending say 10% more on design and usability they can charge 30% more than a competitor.

jeremyrundle

I accept that, I was fourteen years in Contracts at Heathrow and many as a buyer, however, what I am/ was asking as a COMPLETE novice (at least I think so) where it comes to cycling is.

I did my research and bought the Sanderson Life frame

http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/t ... erson-life

However when it comes to Alloy, take Dartmoor Cycles, they have many alloy frames on the walls, from a couple of hundred to many thousands, now whilst I can see differences between say the £100 one and the £3000 one, there appears nothing between say one make of £300 one and another make at £500 and another make at £800 if you see what I mean.

The Rookie

When you say nothing, have you looked at material (not just aluminium alloy, but alloying and treatment such as 6061 or 7005), Butting (more butting means a lighter frame and with designed flexability or purpotedly designed anyway!), hydroforming (forming a tube to a complex shape using fluid pressure, this is very exepensive on capital spending so if it costs £1M to set up, divide that between 100 and 10,000 and you get a very different cost, and different sized flames may need a different former), there is also where its made, most volume is in Taiwan (dirt cheap labour) more handbuilt stuff not only requires more hours of labour, but each hour costs a lot more. Full sus frames also some with links/pivots/bearings as well as more assembly and an expensive rear shock which means it will always cost a lot more.

Simon

jeremyrundle

The Beginner wrote:

Full sus frames also some with links/pivots/bearings as well as more assembly and an expensive rear shock which means it will always cost a lot more.

Simon

Ah but I was quoting like for like, sus or hardtrail, not comparing sus against a different type.

I now understand better.