UCI's Fat Pat

wicked

Oh dear
http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/6707/ ... uelta.aspx

The GIro reduced in length to make room for duff races like ToC and TDU. Is anyone else disturbed by this? The man is hell bent on making cycling global and to hell with any consequences. Must be some "incentive" for the buffoon?

sonny73

wicked wrote:

Oh dear
http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/6707/ ... uelta.aspx

The GIro reduced in length to make room for duff races like ToC and TDU. Is anyone else disturbed by this? The man is hell bent on making cycling global and to hell with any consequences. Must be some "incentive" for the buffoon?

With you on this, McQuaid needs to jog on, he loves an inflammatory comment eh.
I for one would be gutted to see the Giro or the Vuelta reduced in length.

Gazzetta67

Mc Quaid will have to ask for Armstrong's permission first before he changes any race seeing as he`s so far up armstrong`s shyter this weather .

mroli

Just to chuck a dissenting voice in here though. I think it is good for cycling to explore new territories - look at the football going to Russia and Oman. If you take out 3 weeks each for the Giro/Vuelta and Tour, it doesn't leave you with a whole lot of other time (given the classics etc) for other major races. Whilst I don't necessarily agree with Pat's comments, I do think that the racing timetable could do with some rejigging to ensure that races get the proper time to allow the sport to grow and for new nations to be brought in.

Tour of California is important - a lot of cash there. Oman/Qatar, pretty boring yes, but a foothold into asia? I think a road race in S America would be ace - I've been out in Belize and cycling is a passion there. A good race in Africa? TdU - look at how many Aussie cyclists there are in the pro ranks. You could have an AMAZING stage race in NZ.....

afx237vi

Yeah but why do you need to reduce the Giro in order to promote the Tour of California? If you reduce the Giro to two weeks, there's still going to be an insurmountable overlap between the two races and the peloton is still going to be entirely different. Why not concentrate on getting more races in North America, so the North American domestic teams have got a solid block of races they can compete in? You can have races in NA as well as in Europe, not instead of.

The idea of a World Tour is total nonsense. You're never going to make it work because you can't get the riders to race all year on every continent. They should focus on making sustainable, long lasting continental tours that stand on their own merit. The inflation and over-valuing of new, bland stage races like Qatar and the TDU in favour of historic races only damages the image of the sport.

rick_chasey

Agreed.

Football clubs don't compete around the world. They all compete in their local leagues and competitions.

Now, cycling can be a little more fluid then that, but you can still have more than one thriving calendar series around the world.

The problem cycling has is that the ONLY big names are competing in Europe, and people will nowadays only turn out for those.

But with a bit of patience and proper investment, not just throwing a handful of zeros at current stars and you might have a more sustainable model for cycling intercontinentally.

blazing_saddles

The sport needs a Grand Tour that isn't infested by all these foreign speaking blokes who take drugs and have their national police forces breaking down their front doors.
Much better to make a few bucks, chopping up these tired old events and giving an extra week or two to the shiny California carnival.
Make it compulsory that all the teams and riders speak English as a first language and we can even save money by doing away with dope testing. It will no longer be necessary!
Heck, we will probably find that more drug companies want to sponsor cycle races. :roll: :roll: :roll:

Of course, while the Giro is dispensable, the Tour is untouchable, because it makes loads of money.
I suppose you could sum it up as: money is the route of all evil.

mroli

Rick Chasey wrote:

Football clubs don't compete around the world. They all compete in their local leagues and competitions.

No, but football PLAYERS do. So, should all Aussie riders just ride in Australasia/European riders in Europe, Americans in N America etc? Sorry, I just concentrated on one statement there (and money means league football in Spain/England dominates), but I do agree that an intercontinental system would be great.

Again, I didn't say that the Giro should be cut to 2 weeks - it was my fav tour this year, but I think that there needs to be a lot of thought given to the structure of a racing season. When top riders say they can't do the Giro and the TdF then it means your best riders aren't necessarily riding in your top races. If you made the Giro 2 weeks, would people ride it and the tour? I don't know. If they did ride them both, would it devalue both races? Possibly.

I think that due to the nature of cycling, it is very hard to put a structured race season in place and all options should be looked at. I like the highlights of the 3 grand tour season - it structures my bike riding/viewing really well, but I understand why the UCI would be looking at how they can encourage (alright, exploit) new markets. I just hope they do so without trashing existing heritage.

If you look at golf - it struggles to co-ordinate. Tennis - less so. Athletics - even less so. But cycling is such a unique sport, can it really compare?

Blazing Saddles - I read the article and I don't think Pat wants everything in Anglo-Saxon countries, he specifically mentions S.America AND Asia.

rc856

Gutted if that happened to the Giro. In recent years it's been vastly improved IMO and I really look forward to it each year.

OffTheBackAdam

mroli wrote:

-
1) look at the football going to Russia and Oman.
2)Tour of California is important - a lot of cash there. Oman/Qatar, pretty boring yes, but a foothold into asia?
3)I think a road race in S America would be ace - I've been out in Belize and cycling is a passion there.
4) A good race in Africa? TdU - look at how many Aussie cyclists there are in the pro ranks.
5)You could have an AMAZING stage race in NZ.....

Now, point 1), oh yes, take a good look, how much money changed hands there? Already there's talk of rescheduling the shindig in Oman to the winter, to avoid the potential deaths from heatstroke.
2)Yep, cash, got it in one! Also check your geography!
3) Winter race possibly, assuming they can avoid being kidnapped by communist extremists & drug gangs!
4) Again, winter racing, avoiding kidnapping, random murder, Islamic extremist gangs, ending up under the wheels of a truck etc.
5) Now that is a good idea, logistics are the major obstruction, one would think.

Tusher

Presume that Pat's not planning on spending any of his holidays in Italy next year.

mroli

OffTheBackAdam wrote:

Now, point 1), oh yes, take a good look, how much money changed hands there? Already there's talk of rescheduling the shindig in Oman to the winter, to avoid the potential deaths from heatstroke.
2)Yep, cash, got it in one! Also check your geography!
3) Winter race possibly, assuming they can avoid being kidnapped by communist extremists & drug gangs!
4) Again, winter racing, avoiding kidnapping, random murder, Islamic extremist gangs, ending up under the wheels of a truck etc.
5) Now that is a good idea, logistics are the major obstruction, one would think.

1) Irrelevant. Pat was talking about opening up cycling to new geographies. And you don't have to have cycle races in the middle of the summer - there is a much more flexible timetable.
2) Check my geography how? Qatar and Oman are Middle Eastern Countries. They are also deemed to be "West Asian" countries. Oman is virtually "under" Pakistan.
3) That's right, the whole of S America is run by drugs cartels and communist extremists.
4) There are more trucks in Europe I would hazard (if you include lorries) than in Africa - there is a nascent racing scene there and again - are you claiming that the whole of Africa is subject to Islamic extremist gangs?
5) Logistics and lack of proper sponsorship opportunity.

blazing_saddles

Pat's bro seems to have it figured.
http://www.shadetreesports.com/index8.html

No conflict of, there. :roll:

Ron Stuart

Pat's roll model......... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sepp_Blatter

Money, money, money it's a rich man's world..... you could make a song out of that!

and place in history just like this one...... http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... ds-newsxml

second chorus.... Money, money, money it's a rich man's world..... now were swinging or maybe somebody else should? maybe from the nearest lamppost what do you think?

:roll: :?:

sherer

think Pat needs to look at who is paying for these teams to race. Currently cycling doesn't really have global sponsors so forcing them to race in North America or Asia etc isn't really what the people putting the money in want.

mroli

Eh? surely racing in N America is exactly what Trek/Radioshack/Garmin etc etc would want?

sherer

mroli wrote:

Eh? surely racing in N America is exactly what Trek/Radioshack/Garmin etc etc would want?

What about the rest of the Pro Tour and Continental Teams ? Not sure if Cofidis or Lotto do much in North America ?

LangerDan

sherer wrote:

mroli wrote:

Eh? surely racing in N America is exactly what Trek/Radioshack/Garmin etc etc would want?

What about the rest of the Pro Tour and Continental Teams ? Not sure if Cofidis or Lotto do much in North America ?

In itself, not much of an issue. Many of the main sponsors don't have commercial activiites outside of their home countries. I can't play the Belgian lottery, you can't apply for on-line credit in France. some guy in Paris can't sign up to have Liquigas as his energy provider.

I'd guess that the greatest commercial impediment to racing in N America (or Australia, or Japan) is the time-shifting of live TV coverage in a (European) sponsors home market.

deejay

LangerDan wrote:

sherer wrote:

mroli wrote:

Eh? surely racing in N America is exactly what Trek/Radioshack/Garmin etc etc would want?

What about the rest of the Pro Tour and Continental Teams ? Not sure if Cofidis or Lotto do much in North America ?

In itself, not much of an issue. Many of the main sponsors don't have commercial activiites outside of their home countries. I can't play the Belgian lottery, you can't apply for on-line credit in France. some guy in Paris can't sign up to have Liquigas as his energy provider.

I'd guess that the greatest commercial impediment to racing in N America (or Australia, or Japan) is the time-shifting of live TV coverage in a (European) sponsors home market.

At that point I drop out and I loose interest if all we are going to have is a procession of Global Races that are trying to imitate the long standing races with "History". (Just throw all the record books out of the window and then publish New ones full of future speculations)
I was interested in the TOC in early season and would have come over but sorry the May date clashes with the Real European Races, so No contest.

Who the Hell am I ?
Nobody but just one of the millions with very long associations in the Sport of Cycle Racing.
One that is, that dosn't stand in the road in front of oncoming racing cyclists. :roll:

dennisn

deejay wrote:

LangerDan wrote:

sherer wrote:

mroli wrote:

Eh? surely racing in N America is exactly what Trek/Radioshack/Garmin etc etc would want?

What about the rest of the Pro Tour and Continental Teams ? Not sure if Cofidis or Lotto do much in North America ?

In itself, not much of an issue. Many of the main sponsors don't have commercial activiites outside of their home countries. I can't play the Belgian lottery, you can't apply for on-line credit in France. some guy in Paris can't sign up to have Liquigas as his energy provider.

I'd guess that the greatest commercial impediment to racing in N America (or Australia, or Japan) is the time-shifting of live TV coverage in a (European) sponsors home market.

At that point I drop out and I loose interest if all we are going to have is a procession of Global Races that are trying to imitate the long standing races with "History". (Just throw all the record books out of the window and then publish New ones full of future speculations)

I'm not so sure that sporting events must have "history" behind them to be exciting. Cycling, like any sport, or business for that matter, can't simply do the same things over and over and over year after year. With thinking like that you would see nothing but lugged steel framed bikes on the road. Not that there is anything wrong with a lugged bike, lots of "history" there, but they don't sell nearly as well as carbon. Things change in this world. Things come and they go. It's the way it must be. Every time someone swings a leg over a bike, whether it's to just go for a short ride or the start of a Grand Tour they still have all that history behind them. Nothing can chage that. When you go for a ride you stand on ALL of the peoples shoulders who have gone before you. That's got to mean something and whether a race is one day or three weeks, or in the U.S. or somewhere else, is a very, very, small part of the whole.

Ron Stuart

There's a old saying I believe involving a horse and water.

Money on it the penny don't drop