Bugatti V's M3

BigStu2
BigStu2 Posts: 794
edited August 2010 in The Crudcatcher
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEL5ABddZ0k&feature=fvw

Still blows my mind how much power those Bugattis put down, Kind of like Lance Armstrongs legs versus mine :lol:
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Comments

  • And that's not even the new "super" Veyron is it.
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    414bhp Vs 1001 bhp.

    The M3 did surprisingly well I reckon! :lol:
  • 414bhp Vs 1001 bhp.

    The M3 did surprisingly well I reckon! :lol:

    SurfMatt would have beaten it in his 335d I reckon!
  • mrfmilo
    mrfmilo Posts: 2,250
    Even gave him a head start :lol:
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    Head start was probably turbo lag, and the engine getting bogged down by excess traction.
  • Head start was probably turbo lag, and the engine getting bogged down by excess traction.

    I really hope that was supposed to be a comical statement!
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    I do too, but you never know :lol:
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    i wonder how much of a better start the veyron would have had in the hands of the bmw driver in that video.
  • rubins4
    rubins4 Posts: 563
    I dont think its especially difficult to get a veyron off the line tbh, 4 wheel drive, weights a boat load and is full of electronic gubbins.
    http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtop ... t=12613038
    Anyway, fk dis, I iz off 4 a ride innit. l8rz peepz
  • *AL*
    *AL* Posts: 1,185
    i wonder how much of a better start the veyron would have had in the hands of the bmw driver in that video.

    Done for dramatic effect ?
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    rubins4 wrote:
    I dont think its especially difficult to get a veyron off the line tbh, 4 wheel drive, weights a boat load and is full of electronic gubbins.
    A 4 wheel drive car though, can be bogged down quite easily when trying to do a drag-start, unless the driver knows exactly what he's doing. You can't just dump the clutch and be away, or the extra traction will reduce the engine speed far below it's optimum.
    Also, you can't just rev like a nutter and dump it, as you'll burn the clutch out.

    On top of that, the turbo needs to be at a certain RPM in order to produce any power increase. Up to that optimum RPM, it can actually make things worse.

    Couple those things together, and it's far far easier to get an M3 (no turbo) off to a belter of a start.

    Stick an expert race driver in the Buggati though, who knows how to get the most out of it, and it would stomp all over the M3.
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    well the text with the vid says the m3 was being driven by a dutch race driver but doesnt say who was driving the bugatti. thats what made me ask about how different the outcomes could be.

    top gear demoed the difference between drivers the other week when the audi and a porsche were being compared, two different results with the drivers swapped .
  • rubins4
    rubins4 Posts: 563
    rubins4 wrote:
    I dont think its especially difficult to get a veyron off the line tbh, 4 wheel drive, weights a boat load and is full of electronic gubbins.
    A 4 wheel drive car though, can be bogged down quite easily when trying to do a drag-start, unless the driver knows exactly what he's doing. You can't just dump the clutch and be away, or the extra traction will reduce the engine speed far below it's optimum.
    Also, you can't just rev like a nutter and dump it, as you'll burn the clutch out.

    On top of that, the turbo needs to be at a certain RPM in order to produce any power increase. Up to that optimum RPM, it can actually make things worse.

    Couple those things together, and it's far far easier to get an M3 (no turbo) off to a belter of a start.

    Stick an expert race driver in the Buggati though, who knows how to get the most out of it, and it would stomp all over the M3.

    I dont agree with all of that to be honest. As with any car, you need to get the revs right before you release the clutch, so i dont think thats specific to a 4wd. As for the Bugatti, its got the power to get off the line from virtually idle, and in that vid, it doesnlt look like it gets the best start. I reckon it would be childs play to recreate 'that start' again and again.

    As for dumping the clutch, I dont think either of those cars that comment is applicable as, as they think they both have paddle shift 'boxes. Ok, you can get it in first, and give it a bootful, but its not going to be a massively quick start, particularly in the rwd M3.

    I reckon the M3 is harder to get off the line, as its rwd, nothing to do with the fact its naturally aspirated. The Bug will destroy almost everything off the line, through sheer grunt alone, regardless of driver.
    http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtop ... t=12613038
    Anyway, fk dis, I iz off 4 a ride innit. l8rz peepz
  • stu8975
    stu8975 Posts: 1,334
    Either a useless Bugatti driver or a clear case of....' Go on then, I'll give you a ickle headstart'...considering the Bugatti can hit 100 around the same time the M3 can hit 60....

    Nuff said!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ADY2Ka_0f3o
  • .blitz
    .blitz Posts: 6,197
    335d estate would have it
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    rubins4, it really is a fact that a 4wd car is harder to get a good start off the line. For those reasons I mentioned.
    You should try it sometime and see how it's affected.

    IF you can make best use of it, a 4wd car will absolutely rocket off the line, but it's a very rare skill.

    As for the buggati beig able to leave the line at idle, yes. It can. BUT, it will be suffering severely from turbo lag. It is going to take some considerable time for it to reach the power band and then it really hits off.

    Same thing is true in a Lancer evo, or an Imprezza turbo. If you don't keep the revs high, they can actually be beaten to about 30mph or so by something as mundane as a generic hot hatch!
    The larger the turbo, the more it impedes power when it's not spinning.

    They get past this in world rally cars (up to this year at least) by injecting petrol into the turbo. The petrol explodes, causing the turbo to spin up at any engine RPM, giving them full power immediately - but even THEN, they still use launch control to get off the line quickly.
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 61,322
    Same thing is true in a Lancer evo, or an Imprezza turbo. If you don't keep the revs high, they can actually be beaten to about 30mph or so by something as mundane as a generic hot hatch!
    The larger the turbo, the more it impedes power when it's not spinning.

    They get past this in world rally cars (up to this year at least) by injecting petrol into the turbo. The petrol explodes, causing the turbo to spin up at any engine RPM, giving them full power immediately - but even THEN, they still use launch control to get off the line quickly.
    Fits in with my Lancer Evo experience. You had to keep the revs up in order to keep it in the power band but then if you had a normal type clutch the sort of revs you needed for a decent launch usually resulted in nasty clutch burning smells and a lot of slippage - usually followed by a big bill for a new clutch. A paddle clutch made for some great standing starts but still needed some decent technique for a clean launch and were a pig to drive in normal traffic.

    Get caught napping off boost and you could get embarrassed...even worse for the big power cars with turbos the size of small dustbins.

    Anti lag (dumping petrol into the engine on the over-run that ignited going through the turbo) made for nice snappy throttle response and some chav-impressing flames/pops 'n' bangs coming from the exhaust :) . Often followed by a big bill for a new turbo....
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    Anti lag in WRC cars is absolutely insane, produces peak power at virtually any engine RPM.
    BUT, their turbos (and anti lag system) are incredibly expensive, and illegal for road use, which is why it has to be turned off for public roads.
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 61,322
    Proper anti-lag and turbos built to take it cost a fortune, yes. You could buy programmable ECU's for road cars that included a 'poor mans anti-lag' which was fun if used sparingly - such as when overtaking a chavved up hot hatch, or if someone got too close to your rear bumper at the traffic lights :D
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • What I want to know, is who spends £1m on a car, then rags it round a track?

    Yeah, sure, that's the whole purpose of the car, but I'd have it locked up in an air tight garage if I'd spent that kind of money. There'd be special viewing suits in the airlock for when I show it off to my mates. Once a year I'd maybe take it out onto the drive, start it up and listen to it purr for 5 mins.

    You can tune a car for a fraction of the price to get that performance on the track.
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    If you owned a Veyron, and had it locked up in a garage, never to be driven, then you should, really, be hung drawn and quartered with a rusty bread knife.
  • top gear demoed the difference between drivers the other week when the audi and a porsche were being compared, two different results with the drivers swapped .

    just in case anyone missed it :)
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 61,322
    What I want to know, is who spends £1m on a car, then rags it round a track?
    If you've got the cash to have a toy like that you should drive it the way it's designed to be driven. Be a crime not to :) The track is the only place you can really do that without ending up in the slammer.
    You can tune a car for a fraction of the price to get that performance on the track.
    True, or just buy a track specific car like a Radical or a Caterham.
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    New Veyron is faster than virtually any production car round a track though.
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 61,322
    New Veyron is faster than virtually any production car round a track though.
    Faster than this?
    http://www.caparo-t1.com/
    Its a production car, road legal :twisted: Costs peanuts compared to a Veyron....
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • Stevo 666 wrote:
    New Veyron is faster than virtually any production car round a track though.
    Faster than this?
    http://www.caparo-t1.com/
    Its a production car, road legal :twisted: Costs peanuts compared to a Veyron....
    yes... the caparo doesn't count because it can't go over speed bumps!
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    New Veyron is faster than virtually any production car round a track though.
    Faster than this?
    http://www.caparo-t1.com/
    Its a production car, road legal :twisted: Costs peanuts compared to a Veyron....
  • bails87
    bails87 Posts: 12,998
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    New Veyron is faster than virtually any production car round a track though.
    Faster than this?
    http://www.caparo-t1.com/
    Its a production car, road legal :twisted: Costs peanuts compared to a Veyron....
    BMW_335d_Touring_980.jpg
    MTB/CX

    "As I said last time, it won't happen again."
  • Ha.
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    bails87 wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    New Veyron is faster than virtually any production car round a track though.
    Faster than this?
    http://www.caparo-t1.com/
    Its a production car, road legal :twisted: Costs peanuts compared to a Veyron....
    BMW_335d_Touring_980.jpg

    we never seem to chat about those cars anymore, its a shame.