Brailsford Bingo
I've worked for large companies all my days and in my time have attended some tedious meetings, training courses . Some colleagues would play a game called "bull***t bingo". In this we would write down a number of the latest corporate buzzwords and the first to have them all said by the manager of the meetings was the winner.
Dave Brailsford has a kinda David Brent style about hime & reminds of a ltd company manager with his power point presentations and corporate buzzwords.
To date I have counted quite a number of his sayings in interviews which would score highly if playing the game with work colleagues.
Immediate ones that come to mind are
"No stone unturned" & of course " we need to recalibrate"
Any more you can think off?
A 2 year pro-cycling contract & 2 million quid to the winner!!!
Dave Brailsford has a kinda David Brent style about hime & reminds of a ltd company manager with his power point presentations and corporate buzzwords.
To date I have counted quite a number of his sayings in interviews which would score highly if playing the game with work colleagues.
Immediate ones that come to mind are
"No stone unturned" & of course " we need to recalibrate"
Any more you can think off?
A 2 year pro-cycling contract & 2 million quid to the winner!!!
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I thought exactly the same whilst listening to the cyclingnews.com / Pro Cycling podcast. Brailsford is interviewed and apart from saying "you know" repeatedly, he speaks management gibberish. My favourite was the "carrot and the hare", where he mixed up "carrot and stick" and the "hare and the tortoise". Brent-tastic.
I wonder, is a managerial approach to track cycling good but awkward for road racing? You can chisel away at those marginal gains needed to make up the time in order to qualify for the pursuit or sprint.
But road racing is very different, you need a leader who can inspire his riders into battle, to make them race with pride. Brailsford would just send me to sleep on the team bus
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Autobahn wrote:I've worked for large companies all my days and in my time have attended some tedious meetings, training courses . Some colleagues would play a game called "bull***t bingo". In this we would write down a number of the latest corporate buzzwords and the first to have them all said by the manager of the meetings was the winner.
Dave Brailsford has a kinda David Brent style about hime & reminds of a ltd company manager with his power point presentations and corporate buzzwords.
To date I have counted quite a number of his sayings in interviews which would score highly if playing the game with work colleagues.
Immediate ones that come to mind are
"No stone unturned" & of course " we need to recalibrate"
Any more you can think off?
A 2 year pro-cycling contract & 2 million quid to the winner!!!
You're not J Mckay are you?0 -
I see Richard Moore is writing a book about Sky due for publication next year.
I'm not sure if there's any truth in the rumour it will be called "Sky : Believe in Failure"
Jus' messing fans. I think Sky have had an ok season. Bad Tour but I don't think many of us are really that surprised.Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.0 -
I can't understand Sky's tactics. They've got a team with 3 or 4 attacking riders and yet only Flecha has gone on the attack. What are the others there for?
Take today as a case in point, why didn't any of their riders go with Fedrigo et al, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that he's one to watch on a stage like today.0 -
They've done the best they can. Dave B runs it like a little corporation, all that powerpoint and talk of marginal gains and they now get results like a mediocre company run on a diet of powerpoint and management bulsh1t spouted by an MBA with no proper management experience!0
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Dave Brailsford has a kinda David Brent style about him
That's what I was thought when I saw the team bus film. With maybe a bit of patronising Young Mr Grace from Are You Being Served: "Carry on everybody, you're all doing very well."0 -
Getting back on thread rather than turning this into a slate sky off.
Can I pitch in with - "small details" and "marginal gains"0 -
I love the way that Dave B gets slagged on here.
Fair enough, I really dislike his style, but FFS, he's achieved a teensy bit more than I have in my management career....
Ultimately, what his approach can be judged by is whether it works & that can't really be determined for another year or two, for the road & he's been far more successful than most of us will ever dream of being with his track exploits.....
If every manager were that crap, we prob wouldn't be in the grip of a global economic downturn. I personally wish for a manager that shit rather than what I normally have to put up with....
Do people turn their brains off when it's:
-Sky
-British/English hype
-or bald men who get excited about folk cycling in ovals?????
If I was confident that I could have achieved British Cycling's dominance on the track within the budget he had, I might feel like I could slag him. I don't. I have little faith that many of you could.
If Sky are this poor, this time next year, then I'll join in. Otherwise, it just looks like keyboard warriors....0 -
With a slightly northern accent, talk about anything, with a positive and uplifting spin, while adding some of the below to "Brailsfordize" yourself. To add Brailsfordism, stand with your hands in your pockets while looking intrigued. Preferably wear sunglasses and be in a full Adidas tracksuit.
"in the mix" / "mixing it up"
"our boys" / "our lads" / "the lad"
"the project"
"our success on the track" / "the olympic programme"
"real class bike rider" / "rides his bike with real class"
"in great shape" / "in good spirits"
"all you can give" / "all we can ask for" / "give it 100%"
"on the same page"
"bodes well"
"from a logistical point of view" / "the logistics of the situation"
"potential this..." / "potential that..." / "potentially" / "he has potential"
"you can't control the opposition" / "focus on what you can control"
"young stars of the future"
"the gameplan"
"no stone unturned"0 -
Bhima, that's a great list. Given it's summer, you could also wear the official Team Sky tank top - a subject that caused a heated bust up between one member of staff who refused to wear it.
- "at the end of the day"
- "carrot and hare"
- "you know"
- "you know"
- "you know"
- "best of our ability"
The trouble here is that we can't isolate Brailsford and his Brent Business School tactics from the other factors at play. Many things come into play, such as team budgets (the GB track squad is the best funded in the world), the talent of individual riders, not to mention luck. A clever manager is usually the one who can claim credit for a host of random events and outside events as not being moments of chance but being down to his strategic visionRichrd2205 wrote:Ultimately, what his approach can be judged by is whether it works 0 -
It's good fun poking fun at the type of corporate bullocks that Brailsford employs and I wholeheartedly agree with it. However, he's no different in that respect to a thousand other senior managers in corporations all over the country who are speaking like this to each other and their staff as I type. He just happens to work in cycling where is appears to be at odds with the prevailing wisdom.
Of course Sky haven't been brilliant in the Tour which has swung the spotlight onto the team and it's organisation. All we can say for sure is that he did a good job on the track and he's got 5 years to do it on the road. This is year one, Tour one. Let's see where the *ankword bingo takes him and his team.
As Iain said above, nobody on here expected much different to what Sky have delivered this season anyway did they? Alright Wiggins has been a disappointment at the Tour but you could easily argue that results are equivalent to talent and Sky are achieving about right considering their roster.0 -
Sky signed a bunch of average riders, so are achieving about what they could have expected - average results.
One thing that concerns me is their Pro Tour team ranking. By the end of the season they are going to be pretty low, unless EBH comes into form and gets some good results. Mind you, Bradley could do with getting some post-Tour results to show that he isn't a complete waste of money.
Soon we should find out who Sky is signing for next season and who is already leaving. I think both will be very telling about how the team has been run this season and where they see weaknesses.0 -
A bit irritating to see that people slagging of Brailsford. He was instrumental in turning British track cycling from a laughing stock to a superpower, and he wants to do the same on the road with Sky. What's wrong with that? Seems that, if you're British, the moment you start to voice some ambition, the moment you start to take management seriously, a lot of people would rather laugh. It reminds me of the scepticism of Clive Woodward, ok in 2003 he had an exceptional group of players, but any New Zealand rugby fan will tell you that exceptional players do not guarantee a World Cup.
Alright, it's been a dissappointing tour for Sky, but it's not as if they've had a bad season.0 -
How about "Remind me again, how many golds have British Cycling won under my management"?Le Blaireau (1)0
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Not reallyLe Blaireau (1)0
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"We'll debrief and learn"
"Evaluate and be proactive going forward"
"We'll have a look at the numbers"
The real difference between the tried and tested methods is that track cycling has a lot more comparison to scientific methods and lab conditions with less competitor variables.
You can plan for what your 'on the day' performance is going to be like as the track conditions will be the same.
You can naturally apply science and all the marginal gains stuff to give you the best opportunity but against 170 odd other riders that can quickly evaporate.
Concentrate on the SPORT aspect of Sports science!What wheels...? Wheelsmith.co.uk!0 -
All this reference to "numbers" is tedious.
No point having the "numbers", if you don't know how to use 'em.
On reflection, only fair to give Sky a proper chance - they are halfway through their first season for X's sake.0 -
What would be interesting is to look through all of the events in track cycling that more resemble road racing and see what the record is there e.g. points, madison etc.
To be fair to DB the one thing he is good at is getting money out of people, I suspect the guys that hold the purse strings are impressed by his management bull sh*t.0 -
pedro118118 wrote:
On reflection, only fair to give Sky a proper chance - they are halfway through their first season for X's sake.
Yes, but then, what is a "new team". Most of the riders have been pro's for years, most of them have switched teams. A lot of the management have been around for a while etc etc.
If we compare to Cervelo last year - Similar situation but they achieved a lot more. Which is probably to do with the quality of the riders at their disposal.Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.0 -
simonaspinall wrote:The real difference between the tried and tested methods is that track cycling has a lot more comparison to scientific methods and lab conditions with less competitor variables.
Yes, like the sprint. And the keirin. And the points race. And the Madison. Er.Le Blaireau (1)0 -
Two things they should have taken into consideration;-
The Giro was very hard route again this year, plenty of 20% climbs, not ideal 'preparation' for TDF 10% climbs, completely different speed and gear ratios required.
This years TDF route is not anything like the 2009 one, no TTT, one less solo tt, more mountains,. Also seems to be more competitive for 3rd-15th place this year.
Two of the above would have been known in December.
I'm sure they will do better next year, ride the Tour of Switzerland or Dauphine instead of Giro being he obvious one.
I see Brad as top 10 potential.0 -
DaveyL wrote:simonaspinall wrote:The real difference between the tried and tested methods is that track cycling has a lot more comparison to scientific methods and lab conditions with less competitor variables.
Yes, like the sprint. And the keirin. And the points race. And the Madison. Er.
Well, Wiggins obviously specialized in the pursuit which is much more subjectable to the 'lab conditions'.
Point taken there are other competitors, but these are the events which are much less predictable (or less predictable than pursuit riding) Unless you want to see Hoy riding the Tdf...? Cav who was world madison champion openly criticised the science method employed by Simon Jones (albeit with the clash of personalities) as what matters is not as much the science but the 'passion' apparently.
So what we need is a team managed and ridden by a different sort of corporate jargon - Perhaps Alfa Romeo?What wheels...? Wheelsmith.co.uk!0 -
iainf72 wrote:pedro118118 wrote:
On reflection, only fair to give Sky a proper chance - they are halfway through their first season for X's sake.
Yes, but then, what is a "new team". Most of the riders have been pro's for years, most of them have switched teams. A lot of the management have been around for a while etc etc.
If we compare to Cervelo last year - Similar situation but they achieved a lot more. Which is probably to do with the quality of the riders at their disposal.
All true of course, but Cervelo have made much less of an impact this year - that's just the way it goes. I don't think Sky methods/ethos is necessarily wrong - they just don't have the riders.0 -
pedro118118 wrote:All true of course, but Cervelo have made much less of an impact this year - that's just the way it goes. I don't think Sky methods/ethos is necessarily wrong - they just don't have the riders.
And that's the long and the short of it.
But with the right riders, would the methods make any difference.
We'll need to see how it pans out. They're definately a team in search of a GC guy.Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.0 -
iainf72 wrote:pedro118118 wrote:All true of course, but Cervelo have made much less of an impact this year - that's just the way it goes. I don't think Sky methods/ethos is necessarily wrong - they just don't have the riders.
And that's the long and the short of it.
But with the right riders, would the methods make any difference.
We'll need to see how it pans out. They're definitely a team in search of a GC guy.
I don't quite understand why a team so new should automatically demand a GC rider.
What about building up a bit of a rep by winning some smaller races/stages (still top tier, just not necessarily THE TOUR, or a monument), getting some respect, show potential riders that you can win and support them and go from there?0 -
Rick Chasey wrote:iainf72 wrote:pedro118118 wrote:All true of course, but Cervelo have made much less of an impact this year - that's just the way it goes. I don't think Sky methods/ethos is necessarily wrong - they just don't have the riders.
And that's the long and the short of it.
But with the right riders, would the methods make any difference.
We'll need to see how it pans out. They're definitely a team in search of a GC guy.
I don't quite understand why a team so new should automatically demand a GC rider.
What about building up a bit of a rep by winning some smaller races/stages (still top tier, just not necessarily THE TOUR, or a monument), getting some respect, show potential riders that you can win and support them and go from there?
Cos that's not what the sponsor wants!0 -
