Stem length and the difference it makes

ExTrEmE BiKeR
ExTrEmE BiKeR Posts: 149
edited July 2010 in MTB general
I am curious as to what the benefits are of running a shorter or longer stem on my bike. I've noticed that most xc bikes have longer stems and as you get more and more towards downhill and freeride bikes you start to see some really short stem lengths. does a longer stem create a more ideal rding position for long tiring rides? does a shorter stem provide the greater stablity needed for doing DH or FR? what length is ideal for some AM type riding as thats what im mostly into?

Comments

  • vanamees
    vanamees Posts: 75
    Yes. Long stems are for xc, marathon. AM - shorter stem, wider bars , much
    upright riding position. Stem length - you have to try and find what best for you.
  • ExTrEmE BiKeR
    ExTrEmE BiKeR Posts: 149
    so what would be the pros ans cons of using a long xc stem to ride AM? i ask this because i have an xc bike i do lots of AM riding with and im trying to make it suit its purpose a bit better than it does right now
  • The Northern Monkey
    The Northern Monkey Posts: 19,174
    bigbenj_08 wrote:
    schweiz
    Huge generalization here.. but..

    Short stem = quicker steering but can be twitchy, better for decending.
    Long stem = slower steering but more stable, better for climbing.

    Thin bars = quicker steering but more twitchy, easier climbing + less control on descents.
    Wide bars = slower steering but more stable, harder cliimbing + more control on descents.

    So I've opted for a short stem with wide bars...
    The twitchyness of the short stem is counteracted by the stability of the wider bar. Giving better decending at the expense of harder climbing.

    Long stem + thin bars..
    Slower but stable steering is counteracted by the quicker steering of thin bars.
    Giving more economical climbing at the expense of less controll descending.

    Short Stem + Thin Bars...
    Very twitchy.

    Long Stem Wide Bars...
    Super slow steering.

    So...
    For XC the longer stem/thin bars is beneficial because it helps with climbing.
    DH/FR/AM a shorter stem + wide bars offer downhill stability and better riding position.


    Thats all theory btw... I've just written is from what I believe the differences are between bar/stem combos.
    Santa Cruz Butcher
  • ExTrEmE BiKeR
    ExTrEmE BiKeR Posts: 149
    right now i have a ritchey low rizer (19mm rise, 31.8mm) and a ritchey stem (100mm, 31.8mm). im assuming i have a very thin bar? so to get a more AM setup i would have to get a wider bar and a shorter stem?
  • rudedog
    rudedog Posts: 523
    ExTrEmE BiKeR wrote:
    right now i have a ritchey low rizer (19mm rise, 31.8mm) and a ritchey stem (100mm, 31.8mm). im assuming i have a very thin bar? so to get a more AM setup i would have to get a wider bar and a shorter stem?

    It should actually read 'narrow bars' as opposed to 'thin bars' - I think the standard is 660mm so anything above that would be considered wide bars.
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    i agree with the short stem and wide bars option, on my enduro i have a 45mm stem and 710mm bars. it feels fine, it was sporting a 70mm stem and 660 bars previously and by changing both it feels better.

    however,

    i have 90mm and 680 on my stumpy with a low rise which is different but just as comfortable.

    its all about feel, 2 different set-ups feel fine as the bikes feel different to each other, what suits one wouldnt suit the other.

    its an expensive experiment but the only way to know what suits is to give everything a try. it took me a long time to find out what i liked best but im very happy now.
  • ExTrEmE BiKeR
    ExTrEmE BiKeR Posts: 149
    i just measured that i have a 100mm stem and a 625mm bar. thats a pretty xc oriented setup right?
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    ExTrEmE BiKeR wrote:
    i just measured that i have a 100mm stem and a 625mm bar. thats a pretty xc oriented setup right?

    very much so although it wasnt really that long ago that 625 was considered a wide bar.

    thing is that the numbers dont matter, it only matters how it feels. if the longer stem and narrower bars feel good then your bike is setup perfectly.
  • Splottboy
    Splottboy Posts: 3,695
    I daren't ask the Mrs.
    Females not very good at judging "Length and Width."
    Parking cars, I mean...

    I used to run 120 stems at O degrees, and flat 680 ish bars for XC racing.
    Now it's more like 110 stem at 5-10 degrees, with a 710 riser bar.

    The level of control seems better, and suits my riding which is more Trail orinetated.

    Trial-and-error is the way to go, and switching/flipping the stem makes a deal of difference.

    Placement of steerer tube spacers/bar height is also factor to take account of etc.
  • rudedog
    rudedog Posts: 523
    Getting the right feel for bar width also has a lot to do with your own shoulder width - I remember having a go of a mates bike that had really narrow bars and it felt like it was constricting my chest a little (I'm fairly broad shouldered).

    Also (don't think its been mentioned) with a shorteer stem it makes it easier to lift the front end for doing bunny hops, manuals, wheelies etc.
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    rudedog wrote:

    Also (don't think its been mentioned) with a shorteer stem it makes it easier to lift the front end for doing bunny hops, manuals, wheelies etc.

    it easier to get you weight back for these things, i agree, however the caveat to that is tht it also makes the front end a whole lot lighter when climbing which can result in vague steering and a tendency to wheelie up gradients, not ideal even if it does look cool.
  • Northwind
    Northwind Posts: 14,675
    Depends on the bike and rider too, some bikes are designed for shorter stems than others, people are different sizes and shapes. Don't assume you should follow the fashion, it's not for everyone.
    Uncompromising extremist
  • tri-sexual
    tri-sexual Posts: 672
    everyone is an individual and what suits one will not fit another, a person's proportions has to be taken into account as well as the bikes geometry- if it has a long top tube then it would require a shorter stem to get the same reach.
    a xc bike would generally have a longer stem to put the rider in a "faster" position when riding on fairly level ground- this distributes the riders weight fairly evenly over the two wheels.
    a AM bike would have a medium stem length
    a downhill bike would have a very short stem, this puts the rider in a more upright position on level groung but when going downhill his weight is biased over the back wheel, this makes the bike and rider more stable, a long stem on a DH bike would put too much weight over the front wheel and can feel very unstable.
    but all the above are simply a guideline and are not a definitive rule, what suits one person on a particular bike, riding the the same trails and doing the same type of riding will not be the same for another very similar person (age, weight build etc) doing the same thing. every body is an individual so if two people agree that their favourite food is pizza their idea of their favourite topping can be very different.
  • ExTrEmE BiKeR
    ExTrEmE BiKeR Posts: 149
    so with the bar and the frame (norco storm) i have right now, would i be better off staying with the current stem length, or going with a shorter one from all mountain perspective? i like to do it all, some mild DH, XC, a bit of urban and everything in between. i just dont want my bike too suited towards one type of riding because that just makes it worse at everything else y'know?
  • rudedog
    rudedog Posts: 523
    why not keep an eye out in the classifieds for a cheap set of widish bars and shorter stem?

    trying different things out is the only way you'll ever know for sure.
  • ExTrEmE BiKeR
    ExTrEmE BiKeR Posts: 149
    good point, very true. i just dont have the money to experiment being a 16yr old who has a part time job working 5-10hours a week. so in your opinions, should i stick with what i have or try something shorter? or will shorter make the bike worse overall? im not too concerned about climbing, just the flat tech stuff and a bit of DH
  • ExTrEmE BiKeR
    ExTrEmE BiKeR Posts: 149
    another thing ive been thinking of, would i be better off changing the bar instead of the stem?? ive been looking at bars and noticed alot of differences on the rise of each of them. what pros/cons are there to running more or less rise? what kind of combinations of stem and bar rise compliment eachother ie long stem lowrise, long stem higher rise, short stem lowrise etc? so i guess the question is, what type of rise would go with the longer stem i have right now to make it a better AM bike?
  • Dick Scruttock
    Dick Scruttock Posts: 2,533
    sheepsteeth wrote:
    rudedog wrote:

    Also (don't think its been mentioned) with a shorteer stem it makes it easier to lift the front end for doing bunny hops, manuals, wheelies etc.

    it easier to get you weight back for these things, i agree, however the caveat to that is tht it also makes the front end a whole lot lighter when climbing which can result in vague steering and a tendency to wheelie up gradients, not ideal even if it does look cool.

    I own a bike that i ran a 90mm stem (not short) and had the saddle pretty far back on. Going up hills all it wanted to do was go light on the front. My mates all used to piss themselves at my trying to ride up hill. At that point i realized i should have gone for a larger frame!

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