choice of 2 confusion

richardabulmer

I am looking for a fast hybrid, that is comfortable to use for 50 mile+ rides.

I have a choice of 2 in mind
http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_10001_catalogId_10151_productId_502587_langId_-1_categoryId_165534#dtab
http://www.evanscycles.com/products/trek/valencia-2010-hybrid-bike-ec016812

Disk brakes are a must, i have found that a commute in the wet over hilly terrain with panniers demands disk brakes.

Where i am confused is the gearing.

The boardman has only 18 gears compact?? whereas the Valencia has a triple mountain bike affair.

i havent got a clue how gear ratios work.

I would like to know which would be the easiest to pedal. My knees hurt like hell when i rode my mountain bike, and it was only 14.75Kg

there is no published weight for the Valencia, but the boardman is just over 10Kg. thats almost 5 bags of sugar lighter than my bike. I want something thats easy to turn over, and still let me get on the big cogs for speed, without me needing Steve Austins legs


Appreciate your help, and if i'm missing out on any other bikes within a £500 budget let me know
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night_porter

To put your mind at rest over the gears here is a simple rule of thumb that I use.

When using a double chainring at the front it is ok to use all of the gears at the back because the chain crossover is not too great. Therefore, 18 speed Boardman equals 18 speed.

When using a triple chainring it is not wise to use the top 2 or bottom 2 gears when crossover is in effect e.g. largest ring at the front only allows the smallest "n" rings at the back and vice versa.

So using the 24 speed triple means small ring = 6 gears, middle ring = 8 gears, large ring = 6 gears. Therefore, 24 speed Trek equals 20 usable speeds. The real truth is you will hardly ever use the granny ring anyway so maybe even less gears available.

Then take into account that some gears will feel exactly the same but the levers will be in different positions you could say that the 2 bikes have the same gearing range.

If your knees are hurting when you ride a bike then I would look more closely at bike fit than anything else, it could be that your saddle is too low for you.

The only choice should be how do the bikes feel when you ride them!

Kiblams

richardabulmer wrote:

Disk brakes are a must, i have found that a commute in the wet over hilly terrain with panniers demands disk brakes.

Do you commute offroad?

richardabulmer

Kiblams wrote:

richardabulmer wrote:

Disk brakes are a must, i have found that a commute in the wet over hilly terrain with panniers demands disk brakes.

Do you commute offroad?

my commute to work is mainly on road, but some cinder trails too. I had to use the full power of my hydraulic brakes a few weeks when i was traveling home. There is a pretty steep descent on the way home, and i gunned it going down. there was a car in the middle of the road waiting for clearance to turn right. when a F#%@ing taxi over took me then turned sharp to the curb side to miss the car in the middle of the road. If i had to rely on ordinary brake in the wet i would have went through the back window of the taxi and ended up in the cab

the correct etiquette here would have been to remain behind me until i was clear of the car then over take

Aguila

richardabulmer wrote:

Kiblams wrote:

richardabulmer wrote:

Disk brakes are a must, i have found that a commute in the wet over hilly terrain with panniers demands disk brakes.

Do you commute offroad?

my commute to work is mainly on road, but some cinder trails too. I had to use the full power of my hydraulic brakes a few weeks when i was traveling home. There is a pretty steep descent on the way home, and i gunned it going down. there was a car in the middle of the road waiting for clearance to turn right. when a F#%@ing taxi over took me then turned sharp to the curb side to miss the car in the middle of the road. If i had to rely on ordinary brake in the wet i would have went through the back window of the taxi and ended up in the cab

the correct etiquette here would have been to remain behind me until i was clear of the car then over take

Unless your rims are coverred in mud I dont beleive discs are any better than rim brakes. The ultegra ones on my best bike are scary powerful!

i think this is the point kiblams was making. if you must have discs have you looked at the genesis croix de fer? Bit pricy maybe but seems well rated.

richardabulmer

my mountain bike was nicked yesterday from work, and i will be claiming it back on insurance, if i get the full £300 back i will put another £200 towards it, so no. I dont have the money for a croix de fer, and if i had a grand i would rather have something without drops

The Rookie

Back on topic, if you work out the gear ratio's there is a LOT of overlap, a third chainwheel at the front will only actually add 2 or 3 gears below the lowest achieveable with 2 chainwheels as 1:4 will be about the same ratio at 2:1 for example.

When I built my current commuter I looked at the gear ratios I was using on my old 3 ring (21 speed) MTB and found I could still match the lowest ratio I was (2:3) using with a 1x9 setup and having a higher top gear for downhills. Crunching the numbers is easy, just divide te number of teeth on the front ring by the number of teeth on the lowest rear gear you use.

Simon

roger_merriman

The trek has lower gearing a fair bit lower, not MTB level but low for a road bike, even a hybrid one!

on the whole it's best to keep the chain line straight ie on the trek lowest front to highest rear will be a fair angle and stress the chain.

re the brakes they are mech so not as lovely as hydraulic, but they should still offer same braking once wet, and not wear out the rims.

biondino

50+ miles deserves/requires a road bike really.

richardabulmer

i don't know if i would be comfortable on a road bike for that long. I used to do 60+ mile trips on my 2001 Ridgeback Velocity, which i modified with better wheels and GP1 grips and it was quite comfy.

I like the idea of a cross bike for the type of riding & distances i like to do. but the only one i can get for under £500 is the Revolution Cross Sport '10 http://www.edinburghbicycle.com/ebwPNLq ... 372c012370

if i were to look at a decent kitted out road bike (which would not be able to carry a rack) my choice would be this http://www2.merida-bikes.com/en_GB/Bikes.Detail.193

I suppose i could take the Revolution for a test ride to see if i can cope with drop bars. I am 35 now, and i haven't ridden a road bike since i was 12, but i was as skinny as a rake back then. Now i have a bit of a gut.

most of these bikes here come in at the 12K mark with the exception of the boardman, which is under 11k with disk brakes. Which is the one i am leaning more towards

desweller

Most people find that the additional hand positions offered by drop bars to be more comfortable over high distances than flat bars, but of course you may be different. I certainly cannot ride my hybrid more than about 30 miles without losing feeling in my thumbs, but my roadie is good for 100 miles+ without numb limbs. I too am blessed with Gravitation Descent Assistance around my waist and have no problems with the riding position.

If you do go flat bar, make sure you get some bar ends!

desweller

Double post

biondino

richardabulmer wrote:

i don't know if i would be comfortable on a road bike for that long. I used to do 60+ mile trips on my 2001 Ridgeback Velocity, which i modified with better wheels and GP1 grips and it was quite comfy.

I like the idea of a cross bike for the type of riding & distances i like to do. but the only one i can get for under £500 is the Revolution Cross Sport '10 http://www.edinburghbicycle.com/ebwPNLq ... 372c012370

if i were to look at a decent kitted out road bike (which would not be able to carry a rack) my choice would be this http://www2.merida-bikes.com/en_GB/Bikes.Detail.193

I suppose i could take the Revolution for a test ride to see if i can cope with drop bars. I am 35 now, and i haven't ridden a road bike since i was 12, but i was as skinny as a rake back then. Now i have a bit of a gut.

most of these bikes here come in at the 12K mark with the exception of the boardman, which is under 11k with disk brakes. Which is the one i am leaning more towards

I understand your concerns, but it's a myth that road bikes are uncomfortable. Indeed, for long distances on tarmac - their raison d'etre - it's hard to see how any other type of bike can compete.

A hardcore race bike, set up for speed and nothing else, may indeed be uncomfortable for a leisure rider, but in recent years this issue has been dealt with with the advance of the "sportive"-style road bike - a more relaxed geometry allowing a less hunched, more upright position, with racing stiffness replaced by forgiving frame design.

The other issue, of course, is that no other bikes are optimised for long distance road riding. A CX bike will give you a similar frame, weight and riding position, but the tyres will be designed for off road and will slow you down frustratingly (and provide less grip) on the road. Of course if you like to combine your long road rides with some trails, then it's likely the best compromise.

Hybrids and MTBs are a no-no for long rides. MTBs are unnecessarily heavy, and with their knobbly tyres they'll be even more slow and exhausting (replacing with slicks is all well and good but why have a MTB at all in that case). And hybrids will almost always be heavier, with slower-rolling tyres and a less aero position which will really become unwelcome on a longer ride.

I also noticed, the other day, that my 2005 Trek 1200 has rack mounts on the seat stays, and it's a proper racing bike. As for disk brakes, I think it's already been said, but if regular calipers can throw you over the handlebars when applied with too much force (and they can!), there's no reason to think disks would be better - they'd be more expensive and heavier, especially at the lower end.

That Merida looks like a perfectly decent bike (with caliper brakes), and in your price range there's plenty to choose from, some with better spec, and of course 2nd hand you'd get bargains too. Indeed, if you're 6' to 6'3", near London and the idea of a used Trek 1200 appeals (it was £700 new in 2005, 105/Tiagra groupset, Fulcrum 5 wheels - full spec here, though mine's a double, not a triple), let me know

richardabulmer

thanks biondino that does actually make more sense when you put it that way, so now i am leaning more towards the Revolution Cross i think i would rather have that, than a full on road bike, because i like to ride some of the national cycleways i have near me. There are loads near me in coalville, and i like to do the number 52-6-63 round trip, with a few variations mixed in to keep it interesting. its a 45-55 mile round trip, and is a mixture of path, road, cinder & pebble/chips type paths. they would be no good for a roadie.

And my 700c tires of choice are the specialized armadillo elites, good for road & cinder trails