Give Cyclists Space Facebook group...Please support :)

Bassjunkieuk

DaveHudson wrote:

Just updated my status to

"If you do any cycling, Even a couple of miles to the shops, Please join this group. I have covered over 350 miles in the last month and the way drivers treat cyclists is disgusting. I too pay road tax (2 cars, both fully legal) so why do I feel at risk for every bloody mile!

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=119499004746860"

Be interesting to see how many of my friends join after reading that, I know a fair few have joined already.

Sorry to be a pedant on this but road tax doesn't exist anymore, it's VED now.

Have a look on www.ipayroadtax.com for more information as quite a lot of anger is usually projected at cyclist in the mistaken belief that we don't pay "road tax" when in reality neither does the car driver technically as roads are paid for out of general taxation which everyone pays into - even those without a car!

carrotcruncher

joined

DaveHudson

I know that but how many of my mates will. Does average joe on the street know that, I used that term as it's the most commonly known phrase.

AndyManc

dodgy wrote:

I applaud the efforts of the OP to try to do something, but seriously, what do these Facebook groups actually achieve? They'll eventually attract the attention of the idiots who will use it as a way to wind cyclists up.

+ 1

I won't be adding my name, facebook is a joke to start with, if the rest of those that use it are like the cretins I know at work then it will only be detrimental to the cause.

A change in the law, enforcement of those laws and a monumental change in attitudes in those that govern is the only way to get respect, that , or social revolution.

There's a few main roads where I live where the council has erected massive road side notices "PLEASE GIVE CYCLISTS ROOM" , it hasn't made a blind bit of difference.

Can I draw your attention to the quote below ... because it very true.


“The car’s high speed, particularly relative to walking, creates an aggressiveness that must be constrained. Certainly it has not been possible to rely on the self-restraint of the individual motorist, whose motoring decision-making is usually singularly self-centered.

“For a while it was thought that simply providing more and more street space was the solution. But this has rarely proved effective, and one of the major advances in recent times has been the use of a restricted street system to forcibly civilize the car.”



.

Aidy

DaveHudson wrote:

I know that but how many of my mates will. Does average joe on the street know that, I used that term as it's the most commonly known phrase.

Propagating the problem.

People think "Well, it's okay because he's paying road tax[sic], but what about those other cyclists?"

DaveHudson

Cool, Glad I'm making the country a worse place. :roll:

I'll shut up now.

AndyManc

Aidy wrote:

DaveHudson wrote:

I know that but how many of my mates will. Does average joe on the street know that, I used that term as it's the most commonly known phrase.

Propagating the problem.

People think "Well, it's okay because he's paying road tax[sic], but what about those other cyclists?"

Correct ... don't even mention road tax, when you do explain simplicity of VED then they still don't give a **** .

It's used against cyclist by bigoted half wits who will use anything they can irrespective of any reasoned argument or explanation of why they are talking c rap.


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deptfordmarmoset

I was thinking about the space problem and it seemed to me that cyclists should be able to use the space argument positively. Though I have no figures to back me, it seems pretty clear that cyclists, because smaller, use less of the road and therefore leave more room for drivers. There's a popular misconception that cyclists hold traffic up - and for maybe 5 seconds they might hold drivers up at the lights before they can accelerate off to the next row of queuing cars - but all in all, bikes relieve traffic congestion. But we're losing the PR battle on this one.

I can imagine a campaign where the message could be along these lines:

Every time I leave the car at home I leave more room on the road for you. Return the favour

(ok, I'm certainly no copywriter, but the idea is to promote the idea of give and take.)

White Horse

You got to love this country haven't you? On another forum I am a member of someone pointed out the Facebook group to get the Wurzels to number 1 after the rise in Cider Duty.

Someone pointed out that in France they would be burning sheep, blockading ports and beheading their politicians - in this country we get a load of people to sign up for a campaign to sell more copies of a song by some drunks from the west country!!

In terms of social revolution - Facebook is nothing more than your mates down the pub having a moan: there's just more of you. For acheiving something trivial like getting RATM to Xmas number 1 then fair enough, but for something so serious that requires a change in the law and penalties for dangerous driving, then I think efforts are best directed to our new coalition government.

Specialized Needs

DaveHudson wrote:

I know that but how many of my mates will. Does average joe on the street know that, I used that term as it's the most commonly known phrase.

Car tax (still not 100% accurate) might be a better layperson's term to use. At least it gets away from associating paying it with 'ownership' of the road :roll:

andrewc3142

Correct ... don't even mention road tax, when you do explain simplicity of VED then they still don't give a ****

The point to explain is not whether bikes pay it, but how it is calculated.

And that cars like the Prius don't pay any VED.

Bassjunkieuk

andrewc3142 wrote:

Correct ... don't even mention road tax, when you do explain simplicity of VED then they still don't give a ****

The point to explain is not whether bikes pay it, but how it is calculated.

And that cars like the Prius don't pay any VED.

The Prius actually does incur VED, as it's a petrol/electric hybrid it still has emissions, but it's only £16 a year :-) A better example would be the G-Whizz

White Horse

andrewc3142 wrote:

Correct ... don't even mention road tax, when you do explain simplicity of VED then they still don't give a ****

The point to explain is not whether bikes pay it, but how it is calculated.

And that cars like the Prius don't pay any VED.

Surely, there are 2 bigger points. 1) it doesn't give the payer a right to use the road. It is a tax you have to pay if you wish to use a certain type of vehicle on public roads. Non-payment means you may not use the roads in that vehicle, but payment in itself does not mean you have carte-blanche to do so. You need a licence, insurance, MoT and your vehicle needs to be in a roadworthy condition.
2) It doesn't pay for the building and maintenance of the road network.

UndercoverElephant

deptfordmarmoset wrote:

I was thinking about the space problem and it seemed to me that cyclists should be able to use the space argument positively. Though I have no figures to back me, it seems pretty clear that cyclists, because smaller, use less of the road and therefore leave more room for drivers. There's a popular misconception that cyclists hold traffic up - and for maybe 5 seconds they might hold drivers up at the lights before they can accelerate off to the next row of queuing cars - but all in all, bikes relieve traffic congestion. But we're losing the PR battle on this one.

I can imagine a campaign where the message could be along these lines:

Every time I leave the car at home I leave more room on the road for you. Return the favour

(ok, I'm certainly no copywriter, but the idea is to promote the idea of give and take.)

I had an idea for a cycle related advert:

Driver in gridlock, not moving, bored, fiddling with buttons and switches.

Suddenly, a couple of cars around him disappear, morphing into cyclists and nipping down side-streets.

Then some more go, and some more. Suddenly the car is moving again. Car comes up behind a cyclist moving at a decent pace, but slower than traffic. Has to wait for a couple of on-coming cars to pass before overtaking (safely).

Then comes the line, "Don't you hate getting stuck behind a cyclist"

What do you think?

deptfordmarmoset

UndercoverElephant wrote:

deptfordmarmoset wrote:

I was thinking about the space problem and it seemed to me that cyclists should be able to use the space argument positively. Though I have no figures to back me, it seems pretty clear that cyclists, because smaller, use less of the road and therefore leave more room for drivers. There's a popular misconception that cyclists hold traffic up - and for maybe 5 seconds they might hold drivers up at the lights before they can accelerate off to the next row of queuing cars - but all in all, bikes relieve traffic congestion. But we're losing the PR battle on this one.

I can imagine a campaign where the message could be along these lines:

Every time I leave the car at home I leave more room on the road for you. Return the favour

(ok, I'm certainly no copywriter, but the idea is to promote the idea of give and take.)

I had an idea for a cycle related advert:

Driver in gridlock, not moving, bored, fiddling with buttons and switches.

Suddenly, a couple of cars around him disappear, morphing into cyclists and nipping down side-streets.

Then some more go, and some more. Suddenly the car is moving again. Car comes up behind a cyclist moving at a decent pace, but slower than traffic. Has to wait for a couple of on-coming cars to pass before overtaking (safely).

Then comes the line, "Don't you hate getting stuck behind a cyclist"

What do you think?

UE, that's almost exactly along the same lines as I was thinking, complete with morphing bikes - but you've supplied better scenarios. I think I like this kind of approach to publicity because it underlines the benefit to all traffic of having bikes on the road. It must be possible to mount an effective campaign with similar ideas. (That said, I don't think there is any one answer, or any one campaign to end all campaigns. There's just lots of chipping away at the issues from varying points of view.)

litwardle

Sob. I love you guys!

Thank you for the joins and the status updates promoting the group! Thank you for all the amazing suggestions too!

I love this forum, lots of gentlemanly debates and helpfull suggestions!

I'm in the local paper tomorrow! (I'll post a link) so with some Media (ahem) involvement I'll hopefuly be able to get a bit more press. So far all the press releases I have sent out havnt actually generated a reply let alone some coverage! Ah well, I'll bring out the " oh, don't you care about road safety then????"

would be good to get a cycling celebrity on board ( once we had a proper web site to stop all the facebook haters!) that would get us noticed!!!

Lee

Matt the Tester

litwardle wrote:

Sob. I love you guys!

Thank you for the joins and the status updates promoting the group! Thank you for all the amazing suggestions too!

I love this forum, lots of gentlemanly debates and helpfull suggestions!

I'm in the local paper tomorrow! (I'll post a link) so with some Media (ahem) involvement I'll hopefuly be able to get a bit more press. So far all the press releases I have sent out havnt actually generated a reply let alone some coverage! Ah well, I'll bring out the " oh, don't you care about road safety then????"

would be good to get a cycling celebrity on board ( once we had a proper web site to stop all the facebook haters!) that would get us noticed!!!

Lee

good job mate!

deptfordmarmoset

Best of luck with your media meetings later on today, Lee.

litwardle

Hi All!

The group is still going strong with nearly 2000 members! If you haven't looked or joined up yet please do!

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=119499004746860

See you soon!

Lee

Drysuitdiver

just joined

tptvmbircn

i'm in

evil_breakfast

In as well
*thumbs up*

Bowden2017

Also signed up. Getting into Exeter each morning is more that just a challenge!!!!

howie3472

me too