MIT's Copenhagen Wheel but with Disc Brakes?
xxcc
Posts: 13
Say you would like to install something like MIT's Copenhagen wheel but you don't have coaster brakes (it seems the Copenhagen Wheel only works with coaster brakes as they mention you have to pedal backwards
http://senseable.mit.edu/copenhagenwhee ... elease.pdf) - you've got disc brakes http://www.parktool.com/images_inc/repa ... _disc7.jpg .
Would it be possible to use a similar concept where you have the motor/generator and the batteries (provided you find some reasonably small and lightweight ones) integrated in the hub of the backwheel but that the motor is able to harvest the energy you put in when you apply your non-hydraulic disc brake ("regenerative breaking")? Say when the rotor stops (as opposed to backpedalling as in MIT's concept) this indicates to the motor to start generating? I'm thinking cogs but not sure how it could be made to work. Perhaps a small cog/rotor that starts spinning backward when the disc brake is applied which in turn is connected to the generator with another cog? Or is there another way to signal to the motor/generator to start harvesting the energy?
The idea is that the motor is able to harvest energy from downhill riding and freewheeling (with the help of cogs) but if it's got regenerative breaking as well that's even better.
IMO the whole Copenhagen Wheel concept is very flawed (you need a smart phone? WTF?) and of no interest to a keen cyclist like myself but I'm doing a project at the university so would be interested in hearing other people's opinion.
How would you suggest a hub motor to be integrated with disc brakes? I suppose calliper or V brakes would be even more difficult than disc brakes but do correct me if I'm wrong.
http://web.mit.edu/press/2009/copenhagen-wheel.html
http://senseable.mit.edu/copenhagenwhee ... elease.pdf) - you've got disc brakes http://www.parktool.com/images_inc/repa ... _disc7.jpg .
Would it be possible to use a similar concept where you have the motor/generator and the batteries (provided you find some reasonably small and lightweight ones) integrated in the hub of the backwheel but that the motor is able to harvest the energy you put in when you apply your non-hydraulic disc brake ("regenerative breaking")? Say when the rotor stops (as opposed to backpedalling as in MIT's concept) this indicates to the motor to start generating? I'm thinking cogs but not sure how it could be made to work. Perhaps a small cog/rotor that starts spinning backward when the disc brake is applied which in turn is connected to the generator with another cog? Or is there another way to signal to the motor/generator to start harvesting the energy?
The idea is that the motor is able to harvest energy from downhill riding and freewheeling (with the help of cogs) but if it's got regenerative breaking as well that's even better.
IMO the whole Copenhagen Wheel concept is very flawed (you need a smart phone? WTF?) and of no interest to a keen cyclist like myself but I'm doing a project at the university so would be interested in hearing other people's opinion.
How would you suggest a hub motor to be integrated with disc brakes? I suppose calliper or V brakes would be even more difficult than disc brakes but do correct me if I'm wrong.
http://web.mit.edu/press/2009/copenhagen-wheel.html
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Comments
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I guess some sort of clutch system which engages the dynsmo when the brake is applied would work.
I wouldn't want it when freewheeling though lol.0 -
i love this bit"The wheel uses a technology similar to the KERS (Kinetic Energy Recovery
System), which has radically changed Formula One racing over the past couple of years.
it was only used for one year and then dumped.
but it, the wheel, would fit very well into the average Danish commuters life."Do not follow where the path may lead, Go instead where there is no path, and Leave a Trail."
Parktools :?:SheldonBrown0 -
regenerative breaking is mentioned in the piece on the lexus concept bike on the BR front page no reason it couldn't work. weight and cost always being the issue I suspect
and afaik, they dumped KERS because Eddie Ervine threatened to drone on about it FOREVER if they didn't
Everything in moderation ... except beer
Beer in moderation ... is a waste of beer
If riding an XC race bike is like touching the trail,
then riding a rigid singlespeed is like licking it
... or being punched by it, depending on the day0 -
bomberesque wrote:regenerative breaking is mentioned in the piece on the lexus concept bike on the BR front page no reason it couldn't work. weight and cost always being the issue I suspect
and afaik, they dumped KERS because Eddie Ervine threatened to drone on about it FOREVER if they didn't
I'm not saying it doesn't work but as they mention you have to backpedal it seems the system is designed for coaster brakes only. I've been riding with hand brakes since I was about 7... as far as I know most adult bikes don't have them, except for granny bikes of course:-).
The Lexus concept does seem way more interesting than MIT's concept. At least you don't need an iPhone to change gears:-)0 -
supersonic wrote:I guess some sort of clutch system which engages the dynsmo when the brake is applied would work.
I wouldn't want it when freewheeling though lol.
Were you thinking a clutch that connects to the rotor and the generator? Not sure how a clutch works but how would you get the clutch to move when the rotor stops (i.e. when the disc brakes are applied)?0 -
xxcc wrote:I'm not saying it doesn't work but as they mention you have to backpedal it seems the system is designed for coaster brakes only. I've been riding with hand brakes since I was about 7... as far as I know most adult bikes don't have them, except for granny bikes of course:-).
you will find that about 75% of all bikes sold on mainland Europe have hub brakes. and most commuting bikes have back pedal brakes. Some ,ay also have a full set of V´s as well. Yes three brakes.
And as few may just have a pedal brake."Do not follow where the path may lead, Go instead where there is no path, and Leave a Trail."
Parktools :?:SheldonBrown0 -
nicklouse wrote:xxcc wrote:I'm not saying it doesn't work but as they mention you have to backpedal it seems the system is designed for coaster brakes only. I've been riding with hand brakes since I was about 7... as far as I know most adult bikes don't have them, except for granny bikes of course:-).
you will find that about 75% of all bikes sold on mainland Europe have hub brakes. and most commuting bikes have back pedal brakes. Some ,ay also have a full set of V´s as well. Yes three brakes.
And as few may just have a pedal brake.
Off topic. This is the MTB forum, not the commuting forum, remember? What I wanted to discuss was whether it would be possible to integrate a similar system with disc brakes... BTW, do you have any stats to back you up?0 -
I don't think the admin need reminding about the forum topics - often they will digress, and the wheels on the commuters are certainly not off topic.xxcc wrote:supersonic wrote:I guess some sort of clutch system which engages the dynsmo when the brake is applied would work.
I wouldn't want it when freewheeling though lol.
Were you thinking a clutch that connects to the rotor and the generator? Not sure how a clutch works but how would you get the clutch to move when the rotor stops (i.e. when the disc brakes are applied)?
This is something I need to look at more closely. But the rotor does not stop unless the brake and wheel locks up.0
