Attempted murder/GBH arrest.

Splottboy

Saw a local rec. area with "POLICE CRIME AREA" tape round it. Coppers everywhere.

Bout 1/2 hr later I was in a small cul de sac where a CID guy was taking off one of those white overall suits. A few secs later, plain clothes copper putting young lad bout 17/18ys puit into an unmarked car, accompanied by his mother.

Apparently, a young lad was talking to a girl, and two lads "jumped" him, kicking him in the head as he lay on the floor. He's in hospital on Life Support with poss brain damage.

Arrested lad is one of 4 kids, and his step father has another 3 or so.

The youth of today, eh?!

spen666

Splottboy- you are seemingly jumping to the conclusion that arrested youth is guilty of a crime.

Of course there were never assaults in previous eras- eg Mods/ Rockers
football hooligans etc

Assaults are a modern thing of which only the youth of today are responsible

Splottboy

Yeah, agree. But we didn't lay into people, 2 against one!

The young lad being taken away may be guilty, or may not be. So, he will be given a fair trial, possibly by a jury of his peers, if compiled evidence proves there is a case to answer.
This is a bit more than the lad in hospital was afforded...

Witness statements, forensic evidence and other circumstances will all be applied to discover the Facts/Truth.

Just hope the lad in hospital is ok, as I was told he was a "likeable rogue."
Seems a bit of an over-reaction just because he was talking to a girl, don't you think?

Porgy

When I was a lad - me and a mate got attacked by a gang of losers from the local council estate - I counted at least four of them. That's 2 to 1 by my estimation, back in about 1981. We got a proper kicking though at least one of the kids was later up in court forsomething else and I got compensation.

Plymouth was a very violent place back then - especially if you went down Union Street way. Kids got beat up for anything - long hair, being dressed "weird", having a measurable IQ.

My dad used to regale me with tales of his mispent youth, even further back, in the 50s - as part of a gang of Rockers - knives and bicycle chains were the order of the day.

daviesee

Splottboy wrote:

Yeah, agree. But we didn't lay into people, 2 against one!

The young lad being taken away may be guilty, or may not be. So, he will be given a fair trial, possibly by a jury of his peers, if compiled evidence proves there is a case to answer.
This is a bit more than the lad in hospital was afforded...

Witness statements, forensic evidence and other circumstances will all be applied to discover the Facts/Truth.

Just hope the lad in hospital is ok, as I was told he was a "likeable rogue."
Seems a bit of an over-reaction just because he was talking to a girl, don't you think?

Back in '78 I personally remember gangs forming to fight each other.
Knives, chains, bottles etc.
I don't remember any head count.

Fortunately for me, the one time I was peer pressured into going, the others never showed. Phew.....

Splottboy

Think the "gang" thing is a bit different, in that mob-mentality rules, and overtakes peoples normal morals, thoughts or self preservation. It overtakes everything, and can lead to total chaos and mayhem.
Hey, I was a teenager in the 70's too, and I got caught by the bobbies more than once, so I'm no Angel!

What I'm saying is; Two guys against one, and kicking in him the head on the floor when he's defenceless is a lot different. Cowardice seems to be the case, so we'll let the Law take its due process. His brain is apparently swollen and he is in a critical condition in intensive care.

Bit worse that many a rumble-in-the-jungle I was involved with, more than once.
These were normally all bluff, noise, teenage testosterone and led to little injury.

rick_chasey

Back in 18th Century London, it was considered slightly unusual not to beat your wife if you were working class.

tlw1

Rick Chasey wrote:

Back in 18th Century London, it was considered slightly unusual not to beat your wife if you were working class.

now that applies to footballers

rick_chasey

matthew h wrote:

Rick Chasey wrote:

Back in 18th Century London, it was considered slightly unusual not to beat your wife if you were working class.

now that applies to footballers

*shrugs*

It's criminal now though.

People always make out violence is worse than it was 10, 50, 100, 500 years ago, but by any proper measure it's just not true. Sure it might fluctuate here and there, but the fundamental trend is downwards.

I remember for my history degree reading sensationlist stories in 19th Century newspapers with stories of a man killing someone by pushing him in front of a cart because he spat in his beer.

There was a comment in it suggesting that it was a real issue with young men in particular.

*sighs*

spen666

Splottboy wrote:

Yeah, agree. But we didn't lay into people, 2 against one!

No, it never ever happened in the past did it. There was never more than one on one before.Jumper for goalposts, long hot summers etc
Wake up and realise the idillic memories you have never existed

The young lad being taken away may be guilty, or may not be. So, he will be given a fair trial, possibly by a jury of his peers, if compiled evidence proves there is a case to answer.
This is a bit more than the lad in hospital was afforded...

Witness statements, forensic evidence and other circumstances will all be applied to discover the Facts/Truth.

Just hope the lad in hospital is ok, as I was told he was a "likeable rogue."
Seems a bit of an over-reaction just because he was talking to a girl, don't you think?

Fair trial?you are once again jumping to conclusions tht injured party was: -
a) attacked rather than being aggressor or anything elseb) attacked because he was talking to a girl


You have already pre judged the issue without any facts. Some one is injured therefore he is an innocent victim?

Splottboy

Innocent, in as much as he was talking! Not a criminal offence, as far as I know.
Told to me by someone in the know...not able/willing to give out any more details.

Even if he was the "aggressor", seems a bit harsh to me.

Could maybe have been done for "Affray, threatening behaviour " or similar Public Order offence under PACE. Police and Criminal Justice Act...But brain damaged???

verylonglegs

Spen, youth's fighting has been going on since there er, um...have been youths in existence, no-one is denying that but what does seem to have changed is the bloodlust finale where the head is repeatedly kicked as someone lies unconscious. People of many different ages have remarked upon this when street violence comes up in conversation, something has changed it seems.

Squillinossett

Porgy wrote:

When I was a lad - me and a mate got attacked by a gang of losers from the local council estate - I counted at least four of them. That's 2 to 1 by my estimation, back in about 1981. We got a proper kicking though at least one of the kids was later up in court forsomething else and I got compensation.

Plymouth was a very violent place back then - especially if you went down Union Street way. Kids got beat up for anything - long hair, being dressed "weird", having a measurable IQ.

My dad used to regale me with tales of his mispent youth, even further back, in the 50s - as part of a gang of Rockers - knives and bicycle chains were the order of the day.

Well what would you expect...

daviesee

Splottboy wrote:

Think the "gang" thing is a bit different, in that mob-mentality rules, and overtakes peoples normal morals, thoughts or self preservation. It overtakes everything, and can lead to total chaos and mayhem.
Hey, I was a teenager in the 70's too, and I got caught by the bobbies more than once, so I'm no Angel!

What I'm saying is; Two guys against one, and kicking in him the head on the floor when he's defenceless is a lot different. Cowardice seems to be the case, so we'll let the Law take its due process. His brain is apparently swollen and he is in a critical condition in intensive care.

Bit worse that many a rumble-in-the-jungle I was involved with, more than once.
These were normally all bluff, noise, teenage testosterone and led to little injury.

How about a group of 4-6 tied one guy to a tree and cut his throat?
That happened too in '78.

I can look back to fond memories through rose tinted glasses as much as the next man but there was always a dark side.
The difference now is the seeming lack of respect, responsibility and possibly more worrying, lack of fear of being caught

spen666

verylonglegs wrote:

Spen, youth's fighting has been going on since there er, um...have been youths in existence, no-one is denying that but what does seem to have changed is the bloodlust finale where the head is repeatedly kicked as someone lies unconscious. People of many different ages have remarked upon this when street violence comes up in conversation, something has changed it seems.

Really?
I think you are looking at the past with rose tinted spectacles.


The mods and rockers, football hooligans etc did exactly what you say.

I personally saw 30+ years ago unconcious people being kicked and stamped on. Its nothing new at all

spen666

Splottboy wrote:

Innocent, in as much as he was talking! Not a criminal offence, as far as I know.
Told to me by someone in the know...not able/willing to give out any more details.

Even if he was the "aggressor", seems a bit harsh to me.

Could maybe have been done for "Affray, threatening behaviour " or similar Public Order offence under PACE. Police and Criminal Justice Act...But brain damaged???

You are pre judging the matter


You have heard a version from one mysterious individual and are deciding that is the only correct version. You have not heard any explanatyion by those arrested or by all those other witnesses.

You have decided victim is innocent


That is pre judging the issue

Splottboy

No smoke without fire...

Buckled_Rims

I grew up in the North east in the 1960's/70's in a very rough area. There was gangs kicking heads in then. The big difference was in those days we were terrified of going to Borstal, nowadays it's just an ASBO and a warning - who's afraid of that?

nolf

We once had a rather rough fellow in our school. He came from a "working" class family.

Porgy

Squillinossett wrote:

Porgy wrote:

When I was a lad - me and a mate got attacked by a gang of losers from the local council estate - I counted at least four of them. That's 2 to 1 by my estimation, back in about 1981. We got a proper kicking though at least one of the kids was later up in court forsomething else and I got compensation.

Plymouth was a very violent place back then - especially if you went down Union Street way. Kids got beat up for anything - long hair, being dressed "weird", having a measurable IQ.

My dad used to regale me with tales of his mispent youth, even further back, in the 50s - as part of a gang of Rockers - knives and bicycle chains were the order of the day.

Well what would you expect...

Many people in my family lived on council estates including me and I still have friends who do - so I expect better.

Porgy

nolf wrote:

We once had a rather rough fellow in our school. He came from a "working" class family.

If that was in Plymouth - then it may have been me. I was the most working class kid at Primary school by my own estimation.

Porgy

spen666 wrote:

verylonglegs wrote:

Spen, youth's fighting has been going on since there er, um...have been youths in existence, no-one is denying that but what does seem to have changed is the bloodlust finale where the head is repeatedly kicked as someone lies unconscious. People of many different ages have remarked upon this when street violence comes up in conversation, something has changed it seems.

Really?
I think you are looking at the past with rose tinted spectacles.


The mods and rockers, football hooligans etc did exactly what you say.

I personally saw 30+ years ago unconcious people being kicked and stamped on. Its nothing new at all

You don;t have to look far to find examples in print of just how vicious street violence was in the 50s, 60s and 70s. and of course I was around in the 70s and personally remember a bloke lying in the gutter in Plymouth getting his head repeatedly kicked - blood everywhere.

fungus_the_muffin_man

It's not a life support machine, it's called a ventilator :roll:

awallace

As time moves on and communication changes such as the coming of the internet, 24 hour news, the more we are exposed to what is happening in the world. It probably feels worse than yesteryear because its either easier to hear about it or its fashionable for the media to be sensationalist about it like anti social behaviour at the moment.

verylonglegs

Porgy wrote:

spen666 wrote:

verylonglegs wrote:

Spen, youth's fighting has been going on since there er, um...have been youths in existence, no-one is denying that but what does seem to have changed is the bloodlust finale where the head is repeatedly kicked as someone lies unconscious. People of many different ages have remarked upon this when street violence comes up in conversation, something has changed it seems.

Really?
I think you are looking at the past with rose tinted spectacles.


The mods and rockers, football hooligans etc did exactly what you say.

I personally saw 30+ years ago unconcious people being kicked and stamped on. Its nothing new at all

You don;t have to look far to find examples in print of just how vicious street violence was in the 50s, 60s and 70s. and of course I was around in the 70s and personally remember a bloke lying in the gutter in Plymouth getting his head repeatedly kicked - blood everywhere.

I can only go on my own personal experiences and they don't stretch back that far! I'm 34 so I'm referring to late 80's early 90's in comparison to today. I look at it in a very simplistic way I guess but when I first started going out on the town for a few beers only the nightclubs had bouncers and overall trouble was rare but now every bar or pub has them as well and they always see some action it seems. That is a the fact, its how it's happened, not something I've read in a newspaper, so...meh.

rick_chasey

nolf wrote:

We once had a rather rough fellow in our school. He came from a "working" class family.

Cameron once met a black man apparantly, according to his TV debate.

Funny, he never mentioned the ethnicity of his other examples, but that's for another thread.

Splottboy

This is better, I think:
Prince Philip, on meeting "Diversity" at the Royal Variety Show...

"Are you all one family?" then...
"Are you all travelling back home after the show?" ie, back to Africa he meant.

---

UPDATE: Guy in hospital in original thread is 29yr old male.
Two males, aged 17 and 19yrs have been arrested.
Attack took place on Sunday evening, victim taken to hospital on Monday
after being taken seriously ill.

rick_chasey

Splottboy wrote:

This is better, I think:
Prince Philip, on meeting "Diversity" at the Royal Variety Show...

"Are you all one family?" then...
"Are you all travelling back home after the show?" ie, back to Africa he meant.

People don't vote for him....