Drop bars and disk brakes

caw35slr

I was on a tour in the High Atlas in Morocco and the subject of brakes disk brakes came up. It seemed like a good idea to more than one of us that disk brakes would be a good idea for touring, but not at the expense of losing drop bars and ErgoPower (or similar) shifters.

We thought a that a mechanical disk caliper might do it and a quick look at this Sheldon Brown article suggests that Avid makes two road calipers: the BB7 Road or the BB5 Road.

Sadly the Avid site goes no further in the lever compatibility department than stating that these should be used with "road style" levers. What the hell is that supposed to mean?

Has anybody used these calipers with a drop bar? If so, which shifter/lever?

keef66

Road as opposed to mtb style levers I should imagine. Probably be OK with any Campag / Shimano / SRAM road lever then.

caw35slr

keef66 wrote:

Probably be OK with any Campag / Shimano / SRAM road lever then.

I'm trying to eliminate the word "probably" from that. Does anybody have experience with these or hard evidence that they are ErgoPower compatible?

I've checked the Service section of the SRAM/Avid web site and there's nothing there either.

keef66

Can't help you there, never tried this kind of thing. Hence the use of the probably.


Any phone number or 'contact us' type thing on the Avid site?

bomberesque

replace probably with definitely

BB5R and BB7R are designed specifically to work with caliper/cantilever pull brakes, which pull less cable than linear pull brake levers designed for V brakes. You need to be sure to get the "R" labelled version though, their standard ones are linear pull and so need special drop bar levers (TekTro and Dia Compe make them, aswell as others, I have the tektro ones) but then you don't get the shift-y levers (I use bar end shifters)

keef66

Actually, they seem a bit unsure themselves. They at one point suggest choosing one of their Speed Dial levers to go with your BB5 or BB7. They are mtb type levers.

Alex

If you use standard BB5/BB7 brakes with standard road levers (any), then you get a very powerful set of brakes. The BB5/BB7 Road calipers are downrated to avoid numpties grabbing a handful of discbrake whilst on the drops.

caw35slr

Thank you Alex, that is just what I was hoping to hear!

andyp

My cyclocross bike is equipped with Campag Veloce Ergo levers and Avid BB7s and offers very powerful, progressive braking in even the worst of conditions.

One word of caution, the availability of Campag compatible disc hubs is not widespread. I've got DT Swiss 340 hubs with a Campag freehub on it but that option apart it's hard to find other options.

sungod

my commute/training bike has bb5 brakes with shimano sora shifters

as long as they are set up correctly the brakes are excellent, far more power than any rim brakes, one fnger on the lever is all it needs

but if they are set up wrong then braking force suffers, the bb7 has better action, so if you are thinking of getting some go for those

you need a disk-specific front fork, at the rear you might find a road frame is too narrow to take a disk hub, and the stay needs to be able to take the forces too

if you are thinking of trying to retrofit a bike then try doing just the front - at the rear the lower traction will limit the benefit anyway

Monty Dog

I run BB7 discs and Ergos too - great combo. BIggest problem will be finding a Campagnolo compatible disc hub - apart from the aforementioned DT hubs, that's about your only choice. Otherwise, use something like an XT hub and a re-spaced cassette like I do.

caw35slr

In this case, front will do nicely. Thanks for the replies!

andyp

Monty Dog wrote:

I run BB7 discs and Ergos too - great combo. BIggest problem will be finding a Campagnolo compatible disc hub - apart from the aforementioned DT hubs, that's about your only choice. Otherwise, use something like an XT hub and a re-spaced cassette like I do.

Does that run as an 9 speed or 10 speed setup MD?

caw35slr

Funny, but this sounds like something that Hope should do! :-)

Thanks again.

andyp

They don't do a Campag compatible disc hub. I asked them just last week.

caw35slr

Oh yes, this sounds like something that Hope should do!!! :shock:

cykelhviskeren

Alex wrote:

If you use standard BB5/BB7 brakes with standard road levers (any), then you get a very powerful set of brakes. The BB5/BB7 Road calipers are downrated to avoid numpties grabbing a handful of discbrake whilst on the drops.

Sorry for reviving an age-old thread, but I'm building a Pompetamine with BB5's and a Midge bar, and the Shimano BR400 levers I've got, does not pull near enough cable to be any kind of useful with the BB5's -recent research into the matter (done by myself) seems to show that what I need is levers made for use with v-brakes, like the Cane Creek drop V's, but then you pop up in a search, stating that normal levers with the normal bb5 is very powerful. I hope I can get you to elaborate on the subject, even though it is somewhat old, I know, since it would be very nice indeed, if I could get this setup working, without shelling out for a new pair of levers!

Best regards,
Jakob

ugo.santalucia

cykelhviskeren wrote:

Alex wrote:

If you use standard BB5/BB7 brakes with standard road levers (any), then you get a very powerful set of brakes. The BB5/BB7 Road calipers are downrated to avoid numpties grabbing a handful of discbrake whilst on the drops.

Sorry for reviving an age-old thread, but I'm building a Pompetamine with BB5's and a Midge bar, and the Shimano BR400 levers I've got, does not pull near enough cable to be any kind of useful with the BB5's -recent research into the matter (done by myself) seems to show that what I need is levers made for use with v-brakes, like the Cane Creek drop V's, but then you pop up in a search, stating that normal levers with the normal bb5 is very powerful. I hope I can get you to elaborate on the subject, even though it is somewhat old, I know, since it would be very nice indeed, if I could get this setup working, without shelling out for a new pair of levers!

Best regards,
Jakob

I use the BB7 MTB, not even the Road ones, combined with Campagnolo Ergos and they work fine. The pads need be extremely close to the disc, half a millimeter or even less on the right side and the disc has to be straight as a die. The setup has been good for nearly one year now... occasional adjustments required, which are easily done on the BB7

Monty Dog

Fwiw the latest Shimano STIs have different cable pull to SRAM and Campagnolo and do not work as well by all accounts. The Shimano CX disc calipers are optimised for their levers.

cykelhviskeren

ugo.santalucia wrote:

cykelhviskeren wrote:

Alex wrote:

If you use standard BB5/BB7 brakes with standard road levers (any), then you get a very powerful set of brakes. The BB5/BB7 Road calipers are downrated to avoid numpties grabbing a handful of discbrake whilst on the drops.

Sorry for reviving an age-old thread, but I'm building a Pompetamine with BB5's and a Midge bar, and the Shimano BR400 levers I've got, does not pull near enough cable to be any kind of useful with the BB5's -recent research into the matter (done by myself) seems to show that what I need is levers made for use with v-brakes, like the Cane Creek drop V's, but then you pop up in a search, stating that normal levers with the normal bb5 is very powerful. I hope I can get you to elaborate on the subject, even though it is somewhat old, I know, since it would be very nice indeed, if I could get this setup working, without shelling out for a new pair of levers!

Best regards,
Jakob

I use the BB7 MTB, not even the Road ones, combined with Campagnolo Ergos and they work fine. The pads need be extremely close to the disc, half a millimeter or even less on the right side and the disc has to be straight as a die. The setup has been good for nearly one year now... occasional adjustments required, which are easily done on the BB7

Thanks! My discs are not totally straight, and even when I adjust the pads to be really close to the disc, I can't make it brake properly. Guess I'll have to find me some of them Cane Creek drop V levers or the likes.

cykelhviskeren

Monty Dog wrote:

Fwiw the latest Shimano STIs have different cable pull to SRAM and Campagnolo and do not work as well by all accounts. The Shimano CX disc calipers are optimised for their levers.

I'm building a singlespeed bike, so no STI's for me

dg74

I quite possibly have a bike that is changing from flat to drops and needs a complete change of levers, etc.

The bike is a Boardman Comp with BB5 discs. Changing to drop bars so Sora 3500 shifters 9 speed have been purchased (2013 model shifters). Along with this bars, shorter stem, new rear mech to accommodate.

I know Specialized are using these shifters on their new secteur along with BB5 discs so I'm hoping it'll all work out smoothly.

I'm switching the lot this weekend possibly so it should be interesting to see how it works out.

Ouija

cykelhviskeren wrote:

Alex wrote:

If you use standard BB5/BB7 brakes with standard road levers (any), then you get a very powerful set of brakes. The BB5/BB7 Road calipers are downrated to avoid numpties grabbing a handful of discbrake whilst on the drops.

Sorry for reviving an age-old thread, but I'm building a Pompetamine with BB5's and a Midge bar, and the Shimano BR400 levers I've got, does not pull near enough cable to be any kind of useful with the BB5's -recent research into the matter (done by myself) seems to show that what I need is levers made for use with v-brakes, like the Cane Creek drop V's, but then you pop up in a search, stating that normal levers with the normal bb5 is very powerful. I hope I can get you to elaborate on the subject, even though it is somewhat old, I know, since it would be very nice indeed, if I could get this setup working, without shelling out for a new pair of levers!

Best regards,
Jakob

Are you using the regular MTB BB5's or the road specific versions. The road specific versions move the pads further for less cable pull allowing for the moving pad to be placed further away from the disk. The static pad, however, should always be as close as possible no matter what version of BB5/7 your using.

cykelhviskeren

Ouija wrote:

Are you using the regular MTB BB5's or the road specific versions. The road specific versions move the pads further for less cable pull allowing for the moving pad to be placed further away from the disk. The static pad, however, should always be as close as possible no matter what version of BB5/7 your using.

It's the standard (MTB) version, unfortunately. I'm aware of the difference between them now -but that's a little late, since I've already purchased them AND screwed them on the bike #facepalm
I'm also aware that the static pad needs to be as close to the disc as possible, but thanks for pointing it out anyway
Looks like I'll just have to buy me some v-compatible road levers. They seem to be hard to come by, though. Any suggestions besides the Cane Creek drop V's?

nicklouse

cykelhviskeren wrote:

Ouija wrote:

Are you using the regular MTB BB5's or the road specific versions. The road specific versions move the pads further for less cable pull allowing for the moving pad to be placed further away from the disk. The static pad, however, should always be as close as possible no matter what version of BB5/7 your using.

It's the standard (MTB) version, unfortunately. I'm aware of the difference between them now -but that's a little late, since I've already purchased them AND screwed them on the bike #facepalm
I'm also aware that the static pad needs to be as close to the disc as possible, but thanks for pointing it out anyway
Looks like I'll just have to buy me some v-compatible road levers. They seem to be hard to come by, though. Any suggestions besides the Cane Creek drop V's?

I would sell the calipers and buy the road version. that will be the cheapest option.

ugo.santalucia

As previously mentioned, I use the BB7 MTB version no problem.
While the travel of the piston is less, that also means that the action is significantly more powerful... if correctly setup, they are excellent, better than the road ones in my opinion

cykelhviskeren

ugo.santalucia wrote:

As previously mentioned, I use the BB7 MTB version no problem.
While the travel of the piston is less, that also means that the action is significantly more powerful... if correctly setup, they are excellent, better than the road ones in my opinion

Maybe the Ergo's are different, then, because even when I adjust the pads so they actually touch both sides of the disc, and pull the cable tight as possible, I can still pull the lever all the way to the handlebar, before anything happens.

ugo.santalucia

cykelhviskeren wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

As previously mentioned, I use the BB7 MTB version no problem.
While the travel of the piston is less, that also means that the action is significantly more powerful... if correctly setup, they are excellent, better than the road ones in my opinion

Maybe the Ergo's are different, then, because even when I adjust the pads so they actually touch both sides of the disc, and pull the cable tight as possible, I can still pull the lever all the way to the handlebar, before anything happens.

They must be... I can get some quite good modulation as well. My Ergos are Mach 2, kind of 2000-2003

cykelhviskeren

ugo.santalucia wrote:

cykelhviskeren wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

As previously mentioned, I use the BB7 MTB version no problem.
While the travel of the piston is less, that also means that the action is significantly more powerful... if correctly setup, they are excellent, better than the road ones in my opinion

Maybe the Ergo's are different, then, because even when I adjust the pads so they actually touch both sides of the disc, and pull the cable tight as possible, I can still pull the lever all the way to the handlebar, before anything happens.

They must be... I can get some quite good modulation as well. My Ergos are Mach 2, kind of 2000-2003

Hrmf.. well, I'm not about to start riding geared, just because my drop levers won't work with my disc brakes :? Back to the drawing board, then (and find some cheap road brakes or levers instead)

ugo.santalucia

cykelhviskeren wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

cykelhviskeren wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

As previously mentioned, I use the BB7 MTB version no problem.
While the travel of the piston is less, that also means that the action is significantly more powerful... if correctly setup, they are excellent, better than the road ones in my opinion

Maybe the Ergo's are different, then, because even when I adjust the pads so they actually touch both sides of the disc, and pull the cable tight as possible, I can still pull the lever all the way to the handlebar, before anything happens.

They must be... I can get some quite good modulation as well. My Ergos are Mach 2, kind of 2000-2003

Hrmf.. well, I'm not about to start riding geared, just because my drop levers won't work with my disc brakes :? Back to the drawing board, then (and find some cheap road brakes or levers instead)

Older brake levers had more pull... maybe some bargain on ebay?

andrew_s

With BB7 MTB and road levers you'll get powerful braking, but you'll have to keep the pads adjusted very close or you'll run out of lever travel.
BB7 MTB and V-levers such as Tektro RL520 or Dia Compe 287V will probably work a little better than standard road levers and BB7 Road calipers.
V-levers and BB7 road calipers will not give much power at all.