Richmond Park Etiquette

spasypaddy

Having now been to the park twice i still dont know the rules of the park.
Is drafting allowed?
Should i be giving signals to riders that are behind me?
Overtaking cars, is it advisable?
Can i jump on the back of trains (as long as they aren't london dynamo trains)?

First three laps done though now 1.09, average of 17.4mph

Gussio

spasypaddy wrote:

Having now been to the park twice i still dont know the rules of the park.
Is drafting allowed?
Should i be giving signals to riders that are behind me?
Overtaking cars, is it advisable?
Can i jump on the back of trains (as long as they aren't london dynamo trains)?

First three laps done though now 1.09, average of 17.4mph

Nice one - trying to get under the hour mark by the end of summer would make a great target.

My view is that anything that doesn't endanger other park users is good, anything that does is bad. A good enough basis for any etiquette. If you are overtaking cars, be mindful that:

a) drivers in RP do very strange things as soon as deer are spotted by the side of the road; and

b) police are out on Saturday mornings (at the very least) with radar to catch those unwary enough to be exceeding 20mph at the bottom of the hills

Most of all, enjoy what is a really great resource.

spasypaddy

i doubt i'll get under the hour mark for one simple reason, i live too far away for it to be a reasonable target. My ride last night was 57 miles (90km) including the three laps. And i didnt go out of my way at all.

Gussio

spasypaddy wrote:

i doubt i'll get under the hour mark for one simple reason, i live too far away for it to be a reasonable target. My ride last night was 57 miles (90km) including the three laps. And i didnt go out of my way at all.

If you do that ride once a week between now and the end of summer, you will destroy the hour mark target 8)

spasypaddy

maybe we'll see. didnt have much left in the tank when i left the park last night but limped home. Average speed over the 57miles was 15.4mph. average in the park was 17.8mph. Bloody traffic and not planning a better route home so going straight through the busiest touristy places on the way home

bigmat

What time were you in there last night? I was there from 6.25 - 7.30 more or less, was a lovely night for it.

Re etiquette, I don't mind people drafting me - good motivation. If I know somebody is on my wheel I'll signal for overtaking, potholes etc. Cars can be overtaken perfectly safely in a number of spots, just have to use common sense. Keep an eye out for deer (and the police)!

spasypaddy

got there about 6.30ish left at 7.45 as had to sort my glasses/water bottles out as i left the park.

I was on a black planet x with a white gore jersey, black and white gore bib tights, and white assos overshoes. Was lapping anti-clockwise as it means less chance of having to stop at the roundabouts i reckon.

Gussio

spasypaddy wrote:

got there about 6.30ish left at 7.45 as had to sort my glasses/water bottles out as i left the park.

I was on a black planet x with a white gore jersey, black and white gore bib tights, and white assos overshoes. Was lapping anti-clockwise as it means less chance of having to stop at the roundabouts i reckon.

You must be almost invisible on zebra crossings

spasypaddy

its an awesome jacket. so so so warm

NWLondoner

spasypaddy wrote:

got there about 6.30ish left at 7.45 as had to sort my glasses/water bottles out as i left the park.

I was on a black planet x with a white gore jersey, black and white gore bib tights, and white assos overshoes. Was lapping anti-clockwise as it means less chance of having to stop at the roundabouts i reckon.

You don't have to climb Broomfield hill you mean

p.s good choice of bike 8)

spasypaddy

i have no idea what you mean by broomfield hill. ive only ever gone around it twice and gone the same way both times on the advice of a london dynamo rider.

cjcp

spasypaddy wrote:

i have no idea what you mean by broomfield hill. ive only ever gone around it twice and gone the same way both times on the advice of a london dynamo rider.

Broomfield is the steep hill you ride down just before Robin Hood Gate when riding anti-c/wise. You bend left as you go over the top, it sweeps right at the bottom, flatter bit, then bends left, then right, then left, then gently winds its way to a roundabout.

roger_merriman

spasypaddy wrote:

i have no idea what you mean by broomfield hill. ive only ever gone around it twice and gone the same way both times on the advice of a london dynamo rider.

climb up from robinhood gate is called broomfield hill, steepest hill there, might just touch 16%

spasypaddy

is that the descent where i hit 40mph two weeks ago? (yes i know twice the speed limit).

asprilla

Depends. It's a short, steep and pretty curvey decent. All the others are pretty straight.

roger_merriman

spasypaddy wrote:

is that the descent where i hit 40mph two weeks ago? (yes i know twice the speed limit).

more likely sawyers? down from richmond gate, I um might of gone a tad faster than that on the old MTB a few years back.

spasypaddy

the one where i treat it like an alpine descent if the road is clear, middle of the road and take the corners. starts with a massive tree on the right hand side of the road and has two sweeping corners which are immense when the road is empty

biondino

Has anyone here timed themselves for a lap (or three laps) of the gravel path around the circumference of the park? I used to do it all the time on my roadie (in preference to the roads) and only broke the half hour once with a 29.45.

Saturday I thought I'd give it a go on the fixed in the middle of the afternoon, with loads of peds etc, and managed 29.05!! I was very pleased.

Any comparative times?

The Rookie

Ref speed limits

Statutory Instrument 1997 No. 1639
The Royal Parks and Other Open Spaces Regulations 1997

" (28) drive or ride any vehicle on a Park road in excess of the speed specified in relation to that road in Part II of Schedule 2 to these Regulations;"

So is a 'pedal cycle' (as defined in the "Pedal Cycles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1983 ") a vehicle, that is tricky, most laws refer to motor vehicles, which a pedal cycle is not (not even if its electrically assisted within the regs), but the royal parks reg's uses 'vehicles' not 'motor vehicles'....grey area then!

Simon

rjsterry

Just shows how starved of proper hills Londoners are that they consider Broomfield Hill so highly. Fun but pretty tiddly..

Agent57

Of course a bike is a vehicle!

jonginge

rjsterry wrote:

Just shows how starved of proper hills Londoners are that they consider Broomfield Hill so highly. Fun but pretty tiddly..

Meh. Hills are as hard as you want to make them

That said, Broomfield is a big ring climb

bigmat

JonGinge wrote:

rjsterry wrote:

Just shows how starved of proper hills Londoners are that they consider Broomfield Hill so highly. Fun but pretty tiddly..

Meh. Hills are as hard as you want to make them

That said, Broomfield is a big ring climb

I agree, Broomfield is doable on the big ring (on a compact for me though) but I find it quicker on the small ring (unless you've got a really nice tailwind). Isn't Dark Hill steeper? I would always do that one on the small ring - would be a serious grind on the big ring...

jonginge

MatHammond wrote:

JonGinge wrote:

rjsterry wrote:

Just shows how starved of proper hills Londoners are that they consider Broomfield Hill so highly. Fun but pretty tiddly..

Meh. Hills are as hard as you want to make them

That said, Broomfield is a big ring climb

I agree, Broomfield is doable on the big ring (on a compact for me though) but I find it quicker on the small ring (unless you've got a really nice tailwind). Isn't Dark Hill steeper? I would always do that one on the small ring - would be a serious grind on the big ring...

Compact for me, too, most of the time. I prefer Dark Hill, the flatter section in the middle acts as a launch pad for the steep bit to the crest. There was a great tailwind yesterday, which meant 18+mph over the top The headwind up sawyers wasn't so funny, though.

cjcp

MatHammond wrote:

JonGinge wrote:

rjsterry wrote:

Just shows how starved of proper hills Londoners are that they consider Broomfield Hill so highly. Fun but pretty tiddly..

Meh. Hills are as hard as you want to make them

That said, Broomfield is a big ring climb

I agree, Broomfield is doable on the big ring (on a compact for me though) but I find it quicker on the small ring (unless you've got a really nice tailwind). Isn't Dark Hill steeper? I would always do that one on the small ring - would be a serious grind on the big ring...

Varies for me up both. Depends on the legs.

rjsterry

Both are reasonably steep; there's just not much of either.

Seated or OOTS by the way?

cjcp

rjsterry wrote:

Both are reasonably steep; there's just not much of either.

Seated or OOTS by the way?

Varies for me on both .

Depends on how much I have in the backpack and whether how close we are to Friday...

I'm hardly, ahem, what you might call a pure climber, so I'm generally seated.

What can sap you before Broomfield is the drag leading up to it.

roger_merriman

cjcp wrote:

rjsterry wrote:

Both are reasonably steep; there's just not much of either.

Seated or OOTS by the way?

Varies for me on both .

Depends on how much I have in the backpack and whether how close we are to Friday...

I'm hardly, ahem, what you might call a pure climber, so I'm generally seated.

What can sap you before Broomfield is the drag leading up to it.

i'm about the same as you 6ft ish and weight wise. but I tend to get out of the saddle but I think thats my MTB background showing.

rml380z

The Beginner wrote:

Ref speed limits

Statutory Instrument 1997 No. 1639
The Royal Parks and Other Open Spaces Regulations 1997

" (28) drive or ride any vehicle on a Park road in excess of the speed specified in relation to that road in Part II of Schedule 2 to these Regulations;"

So is a 'pedal cycle' (as defined in the "Pedal Cycles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1983 ") a vehicle, that is tricky, most laws refer to motor vehicles, which a pedal cycle is not (not even if its electrically assisted within the regs), but the royal parks reg's uses 'vehicles' not 'motor vehicles'....grey area then!

Are there similar speed limits for the cycle/pedestrian track?
I visited the park last week for the first time in years and noticed the 10mph signs on the steep/narrow sections, but wondered if there is a general limit similar to the road.

jonginge

rml380z wrote:

The Beginner wrote:

Ref speed limits

Statutory Instrument 1997 No. 1639
The Royal Parks and Other Open Spaces Regulations 1997

" (28) drive or ride any vehicle on a Park road in excess of the speed specified in relation to that road in Part II of Schedule 2 to these Regulations;"

So is a 'pedal cycle' (as defined in the "Pedal Cycles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1983 ") a vehicle, that is tricky, most laws refer to motor vehicles, which a pedal cycle is not (not even if its electrically assisted within the regs), but the royal parks reg's uses 'vehicles' not 'motor vehicles'....grey area then!

Are there similar speed limits for the cycle/pedestrian track?
I visited the park last week for the first time in years and noticed the 10mph signs on the steep/narrow sections, but wondered if there is a general limit similar to the road.

I stopped going round the path (quite) a few years back when they got too busy with cyclists and peds. There had been quite a few complaints of inconsiderate cycling on the paths and the parks police were out 'suggesting', IIRC, a 15mph limit. Not sure that was enforceable at the time and may have changed since...

@biondino 24mins something for the path on an MTB, but that was at a time with virtually no pedestrians. I used to love the climb parallel to Dark hill...

rjsterry

Just found this little diagram on the Richmond Park website



Broomfield looks to be about 150ft, while Dark Hill looks about 100ft.