Cycling in Paris and Munich

Headhuunter

I was in Paris a couple of weekends ago and in Munich a few weekends before that and I particularly noticed people who cycle in both cities.

Neither Munich or Paris seemed to have as many cyclists as London. Most of the people cycling in both cities were riding BSOs, MTBs, hybrids or sit up and beg style shopping bikes etc and almost all were dressed in "civvies" rather than lycra and cycling specific gear. Of course many people were on Velib bikes in Paris. Most people's bikes seemed to be badly maintained. Barely anyone wore helmets. Average cycling speed was much slower (no evidence of SCR). Both cities have a lot more dedicated cycle lanes and often these are separated from motor traffic by a curb. I would never use them myself though as although they are mostly clear, in many places in Paris cars had parked in them, or seemed to drive across them with little regard to what might be coming along them. Also pedestrians seemed to regard them as an extension of the pavement in many cases and willy nilly walked into them, across them etc. Also the road surfaces in Paris in many places are cobbled which would be a bluddy nightmare on a road bike.

Anyway, overall my views were that cycling is less popular in these places and certainly not seen as "cool and trendy" as it seems to be in London. I suppose both cities are smaller than London, so distances to cycle may be shorter, people live more centrally and perhaps within a mile or so of work, whereas in London many people cycle 5+, 10+ miles etc each way to work every day.

Anyone else noticed stuff about cycling in other cities?

Headhuunter

Oh and I should add that in Paris, people seemed to ride onthe pavement as and when they liked and jump reds a lot too, but the difference between London and Paris is that I didn't see a single irrate motorist or pedestrian screaming at cyclists doing this, it just seemed tobe accepted

lost_in_thought

Headhuunter wrote:

Oh and I should add that in Paris, people seemed to ride onthe pavement as and when they liked and jump reds a lot too, but the difference between London and Paris is that I didn't see a single irrate motorist or pedestrian screaming at cyclists doing this, it just seemed tobe accepted

I've noticed that in Paris too, when I first went out on a Velib I saw so much pavement riding that I asked a policeman whether it was legal. His response was that no, it's not really legal, but it's not doing anyone any harm so they don't bother with it.

And when you take note of the amount of mopeds ridden on the pavement, usually only over short distances but still, you can understand why!

I didn't see people jumping reds though, I have to say. And I wouldn't there, Paris traffic is manic at best.

As for other cities, I haven't cycled in Copenhagen but it looks like a real drag in rush hour, massive queues in the segregated cycle lanes.

Barcelona is great to cycle in as a tourist, the city bikes on the scheme are good, not as plentiful as the velib, but cheaper. There are some hills though! Steep ones, especially on the way up to the Gaudi thingy.

Caen in France is excellent, good cycle lanes and nobody in them, however, the cycle map tried to take me on a motorway to get to the war memorial... :shock:

Headhuunter

lost_in_thought wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

Oh and I should add that in Paris, people seemed to ride onthe pavement as and when they liked and jump reds a lot too, but the difference between London and Paris is that I didn't see a single irrate motorist or pedestrian screaming at cyclists doing this, it just seemed tobe accepted

I've noticed that in Paris too, when I first went out on a Velib I saw so much pavement riding that I asked a policeman whether it was legal. His response was that no, it's not really legal, but it's not doing anyone any harm so they don't bother with it.

And when you take note of the amount of mopeds ridden on the pavement, usually only over short distances but still, you can understand why!

I didn't see people jumping reds though, I have to say. And I wouldn't there, Paris traffic is manic at best.

As for other cities, I haven't cycled in Copenhagen but it looks like a real drag in rush hour, massive queues in the segregated cycle lanes.

Barcelona is great to cycle in as a tourist, the city bikes on the scheme are good, not as plentiful as the velib, but cheaper. There are some hills though! Steep ones, especially on the way up to the Gaudi thingy.

Caen in France is excellent, good cycle lanes and nobody in them, however, the cycle map tried to take me on a motorway to get to the war memorial... :shock:

I definitely saw RLJers, often crossing or turning when the pedestrian lights were green however no one batted an eyelid. Simply reinforces in my mind that the whole hysterical reaction against RLJ-ing in London is very London specific. When I lived in Osaka, Japan, the majority of cyclists rode on the pavement, I mean 90% or more and it was perfectly acceptable (if not legal).

dilemna

I cycled im Munich for a summer about 12 year ago as german gf. It was brilliant. Lots of dedicated paths and you were integrated into the traffic system, own traffic lights etc. Yeah a really good city to ride a bike in.

I've ridden in Paris as well, several times, the last in 2005, was not so bad, a lot easier than London. Drivers were a lot more considerate than their London counterfarts. The cobbles were no prob for my Brompton. I like the ride from the Louvre across the Place de la Concorde and up the Champs Elysee to L'Arc de Triomphe, cycle round that, then down to the Eiffel Tower. One of the best city rides one can do IMHO. The Champs Elysee is quite steep and lonnnnng. But one of, if not, the greatest boulevard in the world.

lost_in_thought

Headhuunter wrote:

lost_in_thought wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

Oh and I should add that in Paris, people seemed to ride onthe pavement as and when they liked and jump reds a lot too, but the difference between London and Paris is that I didn't see a single irrate motorist or pedestrian screaming at cyclists doing this, it just seemed tobe accepted

I've noticed that in Paris too, when I first went out on a Velib I saw so much pavement riding that I asked a policeman whether it was legal. His response was that no, it's not really legal, but it's not doing anyone any harm so they don't bother with it.

And when you take note of the amount of mopeds ridden on the pavement, usually only over short distances but still, you can understand why!

I didn't see people jumping reds though, I have to say. And I wouldn't there, Paris traffic is manic at best.

As for other cities, I haven't cycled in Copenhagen but it looks like a real drag in rush hour, massive queues in the segregated cycle lanes.

Barcelona is great to cycle in as a tourist, the city bikes on the scheme are good, not as plentiful as the velib, but cheaper. There are some hills though! Steep ones, especially on the way up to the Gaudi thingy.

Caen in France is excellent, good cycle lanes and nobody in them, however, the cycle map tried to take me on a motorway to get to the war memorial... :shock:

I definitely saw RLJers, often crossing or turning when the pedestrian lights were green however no one batted an eyelid. Simply reinforces in my mind that the whole hysterical reaction against RLJ-ing in London is very London specific. When I lived in Osaka, Japan, the majority of cyclists rode on the pavement, I mean 90% or more and it was perfectly acceptable (if not legal).

There you go again with the blah blah RLJing is fine... do you have a background in marketing? Were you fired for subliminal messaging? Hmmmmmmm? :P

Headhuunter

lost_in_thought wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

lost_in_thought wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

Oh and I should add that in Paris, people seemed to ride onthe pavement as and when they liked and jump reds a lot too, but the difference between London and Paris is that I didn't see a single irrate motorist or pedestrian screaming at cyclists doing this, it just seemed tobe accepted

I've noticed that in Paris too, when I first went out on a Velib I saw so much pavement riding that I asked a policeman whether it was legal. His response was that no, it's not really legal, but it's not doing anyone any harm so they don't bother with it.

And when you take note of the amount of mopeds ridden on the pavement, usually only over short distances but still, you can understand why!

I didn't see people jumping reds though, I have to say. And I wouldn't there, Paris traffic is manic at best.

As for other cities, I haven't cycled in Copenhagen but it looks like a real drag in rush hour, massive queues in the segregated cycle lanes.

Barcelona is great to cycle in as a tourist, the city bikes on the scheme are good, not as plentiful as the velib, but cheaper. There are some hills though! Steep ones, especially on the way up to the Gaudi thingy.

Caen in France is excellent, good cycle lanes and nobody in them, however, the cycle map tried to take me on a motorway to get to the war memorial... :shock:

I definitely saw RLJers, often crossing or turning when the pedestrian lights were green however no one batted an eyelid. Simply reinforces in my mind that the whole hysterical reaction against RLJ-ing in London is very London specific. When I lived in Osaka, Japan, the majority of cyclists rode on the pavement, I mean 90% or more and it was perfectly acceptable (if not legal).

There you go again with the blah blah RLJing is fine... do you have a background in marketing? Were you fired for subliminal messaging? Hmmmmmmm? :P

Yes, I'm a one man marketing team for RLJers. I think we need an image change, people are not seeing us in the right light, we're very misunderstood. I can twist any thread on here to RLJ-ing...

lost_in_thought

Headhuunter wrote:

lost_in_thought wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

lost_in_thought wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

Oh and I should add that in Paris, people seemed to ride onthe pavement as and when they liked and jump reds a lot too, but the difference between London and Paris is that I didn't see a single irrate motorist or pedestrian screaming at cyclists doing this, it just seemed tobe accepted

I've noticed that in Paris too, when I first went out on a Velib I saw so much pavement riding that I asked a policeman whether it was legal. His response was that no, it's not really legal, but it's not doing anyone any harm so they don't bother with it.

And when you take note of the amount of mopeds ridden on the pavement, usually only over short distances but still, you can understand why!

I didn't see people jumping reds though, I have to say. And I wouldn't there, Paris traffic is manic at best.

As for other cities, I haven't cycled in Copenhagen but it looks like a real drag in rush hour, massive queues in the segregated cycle lanes.

Barcelona is great to cycle in as a tourist, the city bikes on the scheme are good, not as plentiful as the velib, but cheaper. There are some hills though! Steep ones, especially on the way up to the Gaudi thingy.

Caen in France is excellent, good cycle lanes and nobody in them, however, the cycle map tried to take me on a motorway to get to the war memorial... :shock:

I definitely saw RLJers, often crossing or turning when the pedestrian lights were green however no one batted an eyelid. Simply reinforces in my mind that the whole hysterical reaction against RLJ-ing in London is very London specific. When I lived in Osaka, Japan, the majority of cyclists rode on the pavement, I mean 90% or more and it was perfectly acceptable (if not legal).

There you go again with the blah blah RLJing is fine... do you have a background in marketing? Were you fired for subliminal messaging? Hmmmmmmm? :P

Yes, I'm a one man marketing team for RLJers. I think we need an image change, people are not seeing us in the right light, we're very misunderstood. I can twist any thread on here to RLJ-ing...

Maybe if you were seen more in a green light... Aaaaahahahaha see what I did there?

Headhuunter

lost_in_thought wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

lost_in_thought wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

lost_in_thought wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

Oh and I should add that in Paris, people seemed to ride onthe pavement as and when they liked and jump reds a lot too, but the difference between London and Paris is that I didn't see a single irrate motorist or pedestrian screaming at cyclists doing this, it just seemed tobe accepted

I've noticed that in Paris too, when I first went out on a Velib I saw so much pavement riding that I asked a policeman whether it was legal. His response was that no, it's not really legal, but it's not doing anyone any harm so they don't bother with it.

And when you take note of the amount of mopeds ridden on the pavement, usually only over short distances but still, you can understand why!

I didn't see people jumping reds though, I have to say. And I wouldn't there, Paris traffic is manic at best.

As for other cities, I haven't cycled in Copenhagen but it looks like a real drag in rush hour, massive queues in the segregated cycle lanes.

Barcelona is great to cycle in as a tourist, the city bikes on the scheme are good, not as plentiful as the velib, but cheaper. There are some hills though! Steep ones, especially on the way up to the Gaudi thingy.

Caen in France is excellent, good cycle lanes and nobody in them, however, the cycle map tried to take me on a motorway to get to the war memorial... :shock:

I definitely saw RLJers, often crossing or turning when the pedestrian lights were green however no one batted an eyelid. Simply reinforces in my mind that the whole hysterical reaction against RLJ-ing in London is very London specific. When I lived in Osaka, Japan, the majority of cyclists rode on the pavement, I mean 90% or more and it was perfectly acceptable (if not legal).

There you go again with the blah blah RLJing is fine... do you have a background in marketing? Were you fired for subliminal messaging? Hmmmmmmm? :P

Yes, I'm a one man marketing team for RLJers. I think we need an image change, people are not seeing us in the right light, we're very misunderstood. I can twist any thread on here to RLJ-ing...

Maybe if you were seen more in a green light... Aaaaahahahaha see what I did there?

Very good. I feel a marketing strapline coming on "Give the green light to the RLJ".... "RLJers - getting there faster"....