Mounting/Cleaning Carbon Tubular Wheels.

Northernsoul Man

Hi To All, Just bought a set of Planet x 50 tubular carbon wheels, mounted the tubs - think they are on ok, I used the Continental Carbon Specific cement, putting 1 coat on the rims and 2 coats on the tubular, mounting after the 2nd coat on the tyres ( the cement was tacky in no time at all).I've left them to cure for 24 hours - don't know whether I've done the right thing by changing to tubulars - only time will tell, I've took the bike for a ride around the block and all seems ok. I'm an heavy rider (15 stone), pressures are about 130 psi (7 - 9 bar on the vittoria rally tubulars) - not sure, because the track pump is not reading accurate pressure because of the valve extenders, wonder if its ok to run at this pressure - due to being a heavy rider, and waiting for my first puncture !!!!! - been reading regards removing the tubulars from the wheels - is there any chemical I can use SAFELY, due to the carbon fibre wheels, Many Thanks to all and all Advice will be very welcome.

Down the Road

Take them off and refit but use a different glue to Continental.

Conti glue is not really compatable with Vittoria tubs.

Lightly sand off the old glue, give the rims a little sand to roughen the surface and then repeat what you did before preferably with Vittoria Glue. Over the years Vittoria's have got a bad rep for Rolling off and the leading cause isd the wrong glue affecting the backing

Northernsoul Man

Nice 1 thanks for that, do I sand the cement off the tubular as well, and regarding pressure would it be safe to run at 130 psi, thanks again, kind regards.

Eddy S

To remove tubs, you don’t need any chemicals. You break the bond using your thumbs/fingers. If the glue left on the rim is in ok condition, you can leave that old layer to act as the base for the next tub.

If you do need to clean the glue off, and before the old guard ( ) trips out the usual ‘solvents will melt your rims’ lines, you can use white spirit for bulk removal of the old glue and then acetone to perform the final clean and prep. I have 7 CF track wheels which are discs and deep rim wheels and are a mix of Corima, PRO, Navigator, RTS and Planet X which are all cleaned, prep’d and treated that way and none of them have fallen apart or melted so far!

Sanding? Hmmm... only very lightly for the 1st prep when they are new and then you should clean with acetone afterwards anyway.

The problem with cleaning tubs with a solvent is that you are likely to un-glue the base tape. You can re-glue using the rim cement.But I’ve never done this as I don't repair tubs as I won't risk using them on the track.

+1 for Vittoria Mastic 1 – I’ve used it for years on CF with no problems.

Use these Park Tool instructions and you’ll be fine - http://www.parktool.com/repair/readhowto.asp?id=101

Northernsoul Man

Thanks Eddy, just a point about pressures, is it ok to run at 130 psi, and regards thoughts on mixing brands of tubular and cement, I've checked the adhesion, and it seems ok, or would it be advisable to remove, and re - attach with mastik one as advised earlier, could do with a few more replies, before ripping the skin off me thumbs !!!!

Eddy S

Northernsoul Man wrote:

Thanks Eddy, just a point about pressures, is it ok to run at 130 psi, and regards thoughts on mixing brands of tubular and cement, I've checked the adhesion, and it seems ok, or would it be advisable to remove, and re - attach with mastik one as advised earlier, could do with a few more replies, before ripping the skin off me thumbs !!!!

I'm slightlt heavier then you - I'd run at 8 bar on the road.

I also probably wouldn't bother re-gluing - keep an eye on the tub coming away from base tape and then react to that if it becomes a problem. It shouldn't suddenly all come away - you'll see it lifting in places.

Northernsoul Man

Thanks again, re - fitting the tub seems a lot of trouble, and thinking about it, placing new cement which is a different brand, on the existing conti, I think, would be the same as it is now with the "wrong type" being used as a base layer. Ive checked the contact fully inflated and it seems ok - I don't race - I do probably 25 - 50 milers, around 1 1/2 - 31/2 hours and wanted a nice set of rims, yes - I know its overkill - but I just love cycling and want a nice summer bike to use , the winter commuter takes a bit of a bashing weather wise, another question Eddy do the planet X's use a 5mm allen key for trueing?, only the rear was out of true, but took it to my LBS and they wouldn't help because I bought them off the net, but took it to the "next" LBS and they sorted it no questions asked, Thanks again Eddy take care.

markos1963

I don't have much experience with Tubs but I've got Conti Giros on my wheels using Tufo tape. It seems much less hassle than cement.

andyrr

See no issue with one manufacturers glue and another brand of tubs ?
No need to remove the old glue - when a tub is removed only a thin layer will be on the tub, rest will be on the rim still, leave that unless that are some loose bits or particularly rough areas then either sand down or use white spirit.
Not sure about the Rally tubs - I've used Conti Sprinters, Podiums (for TT'ing only) and Vittoria CXs, mix of fortune with the CXs and Sprinters, Sprinters shoudl be slightly heavier/puncture resistant but I've punctured a couple of these, the cheaper tubs are said to be more puncture prone but as they are a fair bit cheaper it's worth tryign these out I guess. Also carry a spare or look into puncture sealant which would at least get you home.

When I've replaced a tub I've just put another layer or 2 of glue on the rim and stuck the new tub onto that.

I'm a bit lighter and for road racing I'd go around 120psi on Vittoria CXs so 130 or so is probably a good place to start, advantage with tubs is that they will allow a lower pressure without suffering pinch-flats due to the rim design.

Tape is easier but not as secure IMHO : I punctured with velox tape fitted and, in the wet, the tub did not want to stay on the rim. With glue it would have done so.

Northernsoul Man

Hi Ya Markos and Andy, thanks very much for your input. Its my first run on tubs, as you guys seem to be using them on a regular basis, no, using them purely for road riding - no racing (Too Old and Too fat) - just using them purely for pleasure. I bought the vittoria rallys purely for the low price, they were only a tenner from Decathlon, I've always run budget tyres and been lucky regards punctures, and they seem to be fine on the Planet X rims, but gotta rain tomorrow, so, the summer bike stays in bed. I think its trial and error but nice to know that you racies can help us fatties regarding help and advice. Kind Regards to all and thanks for all the replies Paul.

moonshine

Derek from wheelsmith gave me this advice re. Tubs, tape & glue.

Rule of thumb for tape: Continental and Tufo tubs - use Tufo Extreme tape. Vittoria, Veloflex and other Italian tubs - use Velox Jantex. And if you are doing hard cornering crits mostly - use glue. Conti glue for Conti tubs....you get the picture. Also, generally Conti tubs are harsher but last longer. Italian tubs are smooth but cut easier. There is no 100% puncture proof tub but the Vittoria Pitstop sealant is excellent stuff and it takes 30secs to re-inflate a tub with them.

Northernsoul Man

You Guys are just the thing I need, been cycling for years and have "grown" with the moves, technology wise. Thanks for the input Moonshine, will be looking at the sealant for taking on long rides. Just wondering, Cheap tyres, which I've always used, seem to be ok on clinchers, but I thought tubulars are just an "all in 1" tube and tyre with better pinch flat resistance, and the casing and running rubber are the same as the clincher tyre rubber, or, are the side walls, more prone to punctures. Thanks again Guys for giving us "Fatties" a chance. Paul.

andyrr

My tubs have been Sprinters (some have lastesd ages, othres punctured after only a few uses , CXs (seem fine) and a Podium (on from TT wheel, maybe not a general use tub but also so far so good for my use)
Can't comment on any others but Conti Competitions have a good rep overall, not aware of any comments from others on Rallys - worth a shot tho and see how you get on with them.
I'd try the sealant stuff and also carry a spare tub just in case !

Northernsoul Man

Nice 1 Andy, I'll keep the recommendations in mind when buying my next set of tubs, and I've ordered some Vittoria Pit Stop from e bay so probably be here on Tuesday, and will take on my rides. Yeah I think you have gotta try all aspects and being new to tubs, I will Try all. I know you only get what you pay for these days, but just using them for my summer bike and not all year round, I might be ok, Thanks Again to all replies, and have taken it all on board, Regards to all and Be Safe Out There !!!!! Paul.

sevans1983

Eddy S wrote:

To remove tubs, you don’t need any chemicals. You break the bond using your thumbs/fingers. If the glue left on the rim is in ok condition, you can leave that old layer to act as the base for the next tub.

If you do need to clean the glue off, and before the old guard ( ) trips out the usual ‘solvents will melt your rims’ lines, you can use white spirit for bulk removal of the old glue and then acetone to perform the final clean and prep. I have 7 CF track wheels which are discs and deep rim wheels and are a mix of Corima, PRO, Navigator, RTS and Planet X which are all cleaned, prep’d and treated that way and none of them have fallen apart or melted so far!

Sanding? Hmmm... only very lightly for the 1st prep when they are new and then you should clean with acetone afterwards anyway.

The problem with cleaning tubs with a solvent is that you are likely to un-glue the base tape. You can re-glue using the rim cement.But I’ve never done this as I don't repair tubs as I won't risk using them on the track.

+1 for Vittoria Mastic 1 – I’ve used it for years on CF with no problems.

Use these Park Tool instructions and you’ll be fine - http://www.parktool.com/repair/readhowto.asp?id=101

I know this is an old thread now, but maybe you'll read it. I'd like just like to say thanks very much Eddy for the tips and info on removing old cement from carbon rims.

I have been using tubs for a couple of years, but I'm by no means an expert. With Vittoria Mastik, in the past, I have just glued on top of the old glue because removing it seemed to be nigh on impossible

I came across your post after thinking that I would like to use my carbon wheels for a TT that I've got next weekend, so I found the motivation to try and clean the rims once more, after in the past trying lots of different methods for literally hours and hours over a several days and failing to get them clean. For months I haven't used the wheels at all because they had so much glue and even part of the old tub left on them, and I haven't been able to get them clean so I could mount a new pair of tubs on them. I've pretty much been tearing my hair out over this

I have tried using solvents before but I found that whatever cloth or scourer that I used would just get torn up and stuck to by the glue on the rim, and that the solvent didn't seem to penetrate or break down the glue.

This time I followed your instructions. I got some white spirit and used that to remove the bulk of the glue, and to my surprise and sheer delight I found that scrubbing it with a cloth, then even better, a scourer broke down and completely removed all of the glue. It took less than 2 hours to completely clean both rims, finishing the cleaning prep with acetone, and get them literally spotless. I couldn't believe it

Happy days. It will be really nice to use those Boras again, I can't wait. Thanks so much.