How many wear Arm / Knee pads

bannedbiker

P-Jay wrote:

Northwind wrote:

(ironically, it seems you're substantially likely to suffer a permanently damaging knee injury than head injury, but it's helmets that are seen as essential and knee pads that are seen as optional.)

True perhaps, but a knackered knee doesn't mean a lifetime of being spoon fed and ******** in a nappy.

The surgeon, or rather surgeons - there were 4-5 that first met me in hospital to check out different bits of me - see page 2 - all took the time to tell me mine saved my life or at least serious brain damage.

A mate of mine fuct up the corksckrew / tunnel thing on the FR track at Cwmcarn and hit the ground WEARING a helmet and still ended up with a fractured skull - no lid = dead for him.

I don't curse out people for not wearing them, my village is full of people riding shopper bikes around in summer at 10mph and they don't wear them, and probably don't need too. But I simply cannot understand the risk-reward ratio of not wearing one.

Yeah, I fully agree, I've had plenty of experiences of lids being bloody usefull and none of them not helping at all!

Thing is, I'm as bored of the arguments as the guys who dont wear lids are, so I just dont get involved anymore!!

Kiblams

I don't wear knee/elbow pads, but then I don't really push myself with speed. One of the reasons I don't own suspension is so that I don't need to go as fast to get the rush/satisfaction/sense of challenge that makes me ride.

I would consider wearing 'cushioning' on my knees and elbows to prevent 'impact' or 'gash' injuries from rocks as I don't like the restriction of rigid pads, but I can't seem to find anything like this (any suggestions very welcome )

bails87

Kiblams
661 Veggie Wraps.

But the Kyle Straits are pretty flexible too.

Squarepants

Almightydutch wrote:

Squarepants wrote:

I was talking to a lad a few days ago who said his moto was "go big or go home"

Any chance that is Motorbike riding god Guy Martin, big into his DH too. You'll know coz he has big as fook mutten chops sideburns and speaks at 200mph....i jest you not.

Google him for some video clips, the bloke is a personal hero....absolute GOD!!!!

I shall but no, it was a local boy from Mountain Ash I think it's a bit of corny line but it makes sense. I always try to get out of my comfort zone when I ride. Will probably hurt one day... :?

As I tend to ride on my own i'd like a yardstick to measure myself against, a "you're pretty quick/my gran rides quicker than you in her sleep" type comment would help me understand just how good I am, I could be the next Guy Martin 8)





but I doubt it

andyp79

To join in the wee aside...

Guy Martin is an absolute legend. Been a big fan of his for a long time now. He can ride a motorcycle, that's for sure!

Northwind

P-Jay wrote:

True perhaps, but a knackered knee doesn't mean a lifetime of being spoon fed and ******** in a nappy.

The surgeon, or rather surgeons - there were 4-5 that first met me in hospital to check out different bits of me - see page 2 - all took the time to tell me mine saved my life or at least serious brain damage.

Yup, totally agree, but crippled knees are no fun either. I'm certainly NOT arguing against helmets, I'm just arguing against being against not... wearing... helmets. I think.

True story, when I had my big road crash when I was young and stupid, any number of healthcare professionals told me my helmet saved my life. Wasn't wearing it at the time but apparently it still saved my life

Also, Guy Martin has good taste in bikes

ravey1981

bails87 wrote:

ravey1981 wrote:

bails87 wrote:

Ravey, I assume you ride a rigid bike with cantilever brakes, seeing as you're so opposed to progress. And no helmet, as you're against people taking some responsibility for their own safety? :roll:

Obviously not, It seems I am naturally more risk averse than some people on here.

Having said that...I need to cross the road later...now where is my full hi vis. suit and flashing beacon??

I'd say you were more risk loving, not risk averse. :?

I'm sure you're just saying stupid things to wind people up, but I'll bite.....how are knee pads when hurtling down rocky trails at 30mph the equivalent of wearing full hi vis and a safety beacon to cross the road. It's about measured precautions, if we really didn't want to get hurt then we'd stay on the sofa, and I think you'll find that crossing the road is surprisingly dangerous, you might want to give it a miss

The second bit was a joke to illustrate my point, that is that the level of risk which any person perceives for a given activity is specific to that person.

I stand by my point that in my opinion (and hence for me) pads aren't needed at trail centres. Yes there is a risk I will come off and hurt myself, its happened before, but in my mind the risk isn't high enough for me to want to wear kneepads as I don't find them particularIy comfortable on the bike.

I have some 661 kyles that I wear for snowboarding since binning it onto my knees is a much more likely scenario when I'm doing that.... I also wore them on the bike in the alps last year, again, my perceived risk was higher in that situation.

andyp79

Can I ask a stupid question?

How come pads are any more or less relevant at a trail centre? I am all for folk making their own choice - this sort of debate has been on m/c forums more times than you can imagine. In my view it's up to the rider what they wear. What I don't agree with is people calling each other stupid or whatever for having an opposing view - which ever camp they are in.

My point is meant to be this - my local trail place has some pretty fast bits and some big jumps. I reckon pads would be a good idea for me there but I haven't got any yet. To me, I'm much more likely to need pads there than doing xc stuff away from the trail centre.

?

Andy

mac_man

Protection is all well and good up to a point. Beyond a certain contact speed wearing/not wearing a helmet has no effect on whether you will/won't suffer brain damage. The brain will get bounced around the skull either way. So yes... a helmet may stop your skull from splitting open but won't stop brain damage if you hit something hard enough. As happened to the husband of someone I know.

Be great if somebody could invent a light impact-absorbing helmet that could help in the deceleration department. Does anyone do an XC helmet that isn't based on polystyrene? Or is poly the best stuff?

Daz555

Personally I do not (yet) wear pads on the trail. However if I ever get round to kitting Cwmcarn for a lift-day I'll probably get some knee and elbow protection.

Aside from all this of course there is the small downside of wearing protection - it can make you feel safer, ride harder, and therefore you can hurt yourself a lot more if you have the 'wrong' sort of off. I know for a fact that on the odd occasion I've gone out on the motorcycle clad in full 'power-rangers' clobber I have felt indestructible.

P-Jay

andyp79 wrote:

Can I ask a stupid question?

How come pads are any more or less relevant at a trail centre? I am all for folk making their own choice - this sort of debate has been on m/c forums more times than you can imagine. In my view it's up to the rider what they wear. What I don't agree with is people calling each other stupid or whatever for having an opposing view - which ever camp they are in.

My point is meant to be this - my local trail place has some pretty fast bits and some big jumps. I reckon pads would be a good idea for me there but I haven't got any yet. To me, I'm much more likely to need pads there than doing xc stuff away from the trail centre.

?

Andy

There is absoultely no relevence, just some folk like to piggy back the old "Natural's more hardcore - nooo Trail Centres are more hardcore" argument into everything.

Paulie W

I've only ever worn a helmet but I have noticed the impact that elbow and knee pads have had on friends who started to wear them - they have started riding harder and faster presumably because they feel they can get away with more now; that a stack on a rocky decsent will be much less painful and damaging. I think, however, that some of these friends are over compensating and that they are taking risks which arent offset by the protective equipment - one of them got himself into a situation which he would never have done without all that padding and in the outcome the padding didnt stop him from suffering a pretty nasty injury.

I guess this is all pretty obvious but the more padding you wear the more invincible you potentially start to feel and that can have nasty consequences.

bails87

True, but the same rider, hitting the same rock at the same speed, is more likely to walk away unscathed if they're wearing pads. I forget I'm wearing mine so I don't think they make me ride any differently. I wouldn't drive round at 100mph because I had a load of airbags in my car.

Ravey: I don't have a problem with you not wearing pads. But it's comments about people who do wear pads being 'wannabe DHers' or 'all the gear, no idea types' that annoy me. It's like people who get upset when others buy a £3k hardtail to pootle along the towpath. So what? Does it matter? Does it affect you in any way at all? No. Just like others who wear pads. Would you rather they fell off and hurt themselves? Do you think pads should be banned on anything under a 'Red'?

Paulie W

bails87 wrote:

True, but the same rider, hitting the same rock at the same speed, is more likely to walk away unscathed if they're wearing pads. I forget I'm wearing mine so I don't think they make me ride any differently. I wouldn't drive round at 100mph because I had a load of airbags in my car.

There is quite a bit of research on risk compensation and helmet use, some of which argues that the benefits of helmet use are offset by the greater risks that helmeted cyclists consequently take (since they believe that there is a reduced risk of injury should they be involved in an accident).

I dont know if anyone has done any research on risk compensation associated with padding.

The key point about risk compensation is that it isnt necessarily a product of a carefully thought through decision but is rather an unconscious process.

Soul Boy

I made this comment on a previous thread...

"You never need a helmet or pads until you fall, but getting padded up mid-crash isn't convenient at all.

I had a big off on Goodwood (Whites Level) last year. Root sticking out from the side of the trail, after a small rock step down on a corner. I was pretty sketchy through there (chasing down a mate), going fast, a bit off balance, saw the root and got fixated. Front wheel stuck inbetween the root and trail wall, me over the bars and someway down the trail (that part was a blur). I was wearing my 661 arm pads and Kyle Strait Patriots. I got up, momentarily dusted myself down and was back on my mates back wheel by the end of the section. Who knows what 'might' have happended had I not been padded up, but at 38 (with years of MTB under my belt), I'd rather not find out.

Was funny to walk back up the trail to find my bike parked upright, neatly on the trail side thanks to the 'bike rack' style root, but then its easy to laugh when no damage is done".

I wear my pads for pretty much all my riding, but it's a personal choice.

Northwind

Paulie W wrote:

I dont know if anyone has done any research on risk compensation associated with padding.

The same will apply, it's pretty much a given, risk compensation seems to affect everything from car drivers (drivers in cars with large front pillars are more likely to be involved in 2-vehicle accidents), bicyclists and motorbicicylists, soldiers, climbers... The safer you feel the more dangerous you are, on average, it seems to be just human nature.

bails87

Northwind wrote:

Paulie W wrote:

I dont know if anyone has done any research on risk compensation associated with padding.

The same will apply, it's pretty much a given, risk compensation seems to affect everything from car drivers (drivers in cars with large front pillars are more likely to be involved in 2-vehicle accidents), bicyclists and motorbicicylists, soldiers, climbers... The safer you feel the more dangerous you are, on average, it seems to be just human nature.

Large front pilllar? fnaar fnaar!


Anyway, I'm sure it was mentioned on here before that modern cars don't have the large pillars in order to be safe, just to make the driver feel safe. When in actual fact they reduce visibility, as well as potentially making people take risks they wouldn't otherwise take. At least the pads and helmets are serving a purpose, if wider pillars are purely cosmetic then it's pretty pointless.

andyp79

I know it's off topic but I hate the A pillars in my car, they get right in the view at times. I was saying that very thing to Mrs. P at the weekend.

(It's a Honda Civic but my Focus before that was just as bad)

The Killah

i usually wear my shin/knee combo and my ff lid when out for anything other than a getting from a to b ride. i ride as fast as i can and i know for a fact that i will go faster if i dont have to worry about losing a knee cap if i crash


i dont care what anybody else does or thinks, theyre my knees so my responsibility. if you dont wear pads, great. good for you. if you do, great. good for you.

ive had a few people in the past pass me on the way out or the way home saying 'youre a bit over dressed for the towpath/cycle track' yeah, dumbo, youre right. tell you what, come with me and we'll see who's overdressed and who's underdressed.

if you feel safer and choose to wear full body armour then thats your business. all you morons who laugh and make fun of the play safes, concentrate on your own riding a little more and maybe you wont suck so bad.

Squarepants

Soul Boy wrote:

saw the root and got fixated

I hate missile lock. It's wierd how you just cannot avoid stuff sometimes. Not that it ever really happens to me...






more than a few times every ride

antfly

I used to wear pads on a skateboard but wouldn`t dream of it on a bike.

ravey1981

bails87 wrote:

Ravey: I don't have a problem with you not wearing pads. But it's comments about people who do wear pads being 'wannabe DHers' or 'all the gear, no idea types' that annoy me. It's like people who get upset when others buy a £3k hardtail to pootle along the towpath. So what? Does it matter? Does it affect you in any way at all? No. Just like others who wear pads. Would you rather they fell off and hurt themselves? Do you think pads should be banned on anything under a 'Red'?

Fair point, I accept some of my comments were ott and misdirected and for that I apologise.

Northwind

Squarepants wrote:

I hate missile lock. It's wierd how you just cannot avoid stuff sometimes. Not that it ever really happens to me...

Harness target fixation for good! Just make sure you fixate on the right stuff. I got taught this at a motorbike race school, and 20 minutes after they suggested it, I fired into a corner 20mph too fast, sure I was going to crash and just at the last minute managed to grab an object on the horizon and fixed myself on it and it took me straight through the bend. It's a good trick if you can make it work for you.

(on the downside, both laps of the red at Kirroughtree I tried this approach on an S bend and ended up taking a bit of a direct route to the exit and riding straight across the inside of the corner :oops: )

Squarepants

Trial and error and all that

It goes along the same lines (or is exactly the same) as looking at your exit point going into a corner, I've found this has helped my switchbacks a lot. Look at where you want to go and you'll go there.. the majority of the time

And coupling this with knee pads I find is even better given the extra confidence I have..