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2011 Tour de France: TTT back

KléberKléber Posts: 6,842
edited February 2010 in Pro race
The race will start in the Vendee region of France and feature a road stage as the opening stage, no prologue. The riders will cross the Passage du Gois before a small hill finish in the first stage. Stage 2 will be a team time trial.

gois-passage.jpg

INS_chuteTDF_017.jpg
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  • teagarteagar Posts: 2,100
    NOOOOOOOOOOO!

    Not a TTT. :cry:
    Note: the above post is an opinion and not fact. It might be a lie.
  • a TTT accross the wet seaweed slippy crossing

    Thats a good one, it will make a good trial trying to bablance speed with getting accross, bike handling and tactic nightmare for all and could really mix things up. ACE :)



    oh just read again, but it would be great especially if it were just beofre the last two mountain stage.
  • MoomaloidMoomaloid Posts: 2,040
    Ahhhh i remember the causeway well... there was carnage!

    TTT? :(
  • calvjonescalvjones Posts: 3,850
    Stage 2 is the TTT, not over the Passage, surely?
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  • pat1cppat1cp Posts: 765
    The picture up top was from 1999, if I'm not mistaken.

    Didn't the eventual winner put some time into his rivals (Zulle) because of that crash ???

    I'm gonna get strung up for this !! :shock:
  • calvjonescalvjones Posts: 3,850
    Looks like the Gois will be in the neutralised zone maybe.

    Stage 1 finishes with a leg-breaking 232m summit....
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    Strava is not Zen.
  • Philip SPhilip S Posts: 398
    Wel, the Passage du Gois should destroy any chance Denis Menchov has next year...

    The TTT's only 23 km, so that should reduce the amount of damage it can do (unless you're Bbox and decide to go off piste :lol:). I think last year's was something like 40km long.
  • afx237viafx237vi Posts: 12,630
    A short TTT is not so bad. Works for the Giro and Vuelta.
  • pat1cp wrote:
    The picture up top was from 1999, if I'm not mistaken.

    Didn't the eventual winner put some time into his rivals (Zulle) because of that crash ???

    I'm gonna get strung up for this !! :shock:

    Zulle lost 6'03 of his final deficit of 7'37 on the Gois stage.

    The race also went over the Passage during the Indurain years I believe , but they rode piano. Surely it will be neutralised at the start for the 2011 stage?
  • zammmmozammmmo Posts: 315
    it'll be carnage...and Mechov'll be in the middle of it all :D
  • zammmmo wrote:
    it'll be carnage...and Mechov'll be in the middle of it all :D
    :lol:
  • Cav in yellow then?
    That would be cool
  • I love the TTT. It's slated for stage 2 I think.
  • TusherTusher Posts: 2,762
    Excellent! I just lurve a good TTT and this has the makings of a classic.

    Most importantly, the possibilities for Jean-René Bernaudeau to excel himself in the synchronized team diving competition are limitless. Just think what they could score for artistic impression!

    As I type, JV will be huddled over a 'pooter in the underground Garmin Intelligence Bunker, plotting the effects of airborne sea salt on the lungs and legs, how this will affect 20% Eskimos (and I'm still waiting for his explanation as to how on earth Tom D can be 20% anything, 2 parents, 4 grandparents- none of it adds up to me) and whether or not the riders should be in specially designed wet suits.

    Dave Brailsford will spend an undisclosed sum on hiring a team of chimpanzee mercenaries to burrow into the bunker and steal Garmin's intelligence. He will then aggregate the margins by making all the riders train on a specially flooded Manchester velodrome.

    Sir Chris will announce his retirement from cycling in disgust at the damage down to the wooden track, and embrace rowing, where he will win another 3 medals in London.
  • teagarteagar Posts: 2,100
    Seems the current route organisers have a penchant for worrying the GC riders long before they get to any mountains...

    2010 we have cobbles, 2011 we have Gois...
    Note: the above post is an opinion and not fact. It might be a lie.
  • SpaceJunkSpaceJunk Posts: 1,157
    Kléber wrote:
    The race will start in the Vendee region of France and feature a road stage as the opening stage, no prologue. The riders will cross the Passage du Gois before a small hill finish in the first stage. Stage 2 will be a team time trial.


    INS_chuteTDF_017.jpg

    The guy in the bottom right in the Rabobank knicks. Is he actually a rider in the TdF, or just a fisherman, dressed for the occasion, who has come back from checking his lines?
  • teagarteagar Posts: 2,100
    I can't see the point of TTTs, other to kick a man when he's already down.

    TTs are a necessary bore, there to make the whole "big vs small" dichotomy between GC riders interesting. Climbers have to make up more time because of a forthcoming TT, others need to limit their losses blah blah blah.

    But team time trials? Sheesh. If you already have a sh!t team, then you're royally stuffed! They're boring, and they serve to knock too many interesting riders out of contention too early.

    I think most people prefer the man vs man battles.

    All a TTT serves to do is make it a battle between the GC riders who are part of the biggest teams. Why not make their lives trickier with a few exciting loners who could spoil the party? Would make the races harder to control...
    Note: the above post is an opinion and not fact. It might be a lie.
  • terongiterongi Posts: 318
    teagar wrote:
    TTs are a necessary bore, there to make the whole "big vs small" dichotomy between GC riders interesting. Climbers have to make up more time because of a forthcoming TT, others need to limit their losses blah blah blah.

    I think you just argued against yourself there. TTs help to mix up the GC and make a Grand Tour into a real test of all-round skills.

    Also TTs are not always boring to watch. Lesaving aside questions of how the 2007 TdF GC was sculpted in the first place (chicken and all that), the final TT was gripping. So was the 1989 final TT for obvious reasons. Of course, not every TT is exciting, but the same goes for flat RR stages and mountain stages.
    teagar wrote:
    But team time trials? Sheesh. If you already have a sh!t team, then you're royally stuffed! They're boring, and they serve to knock too many interesting riders out of contention too early.

    I think most people prefer the man vs man battles.

    All a TTT serves to do is make it a battle between the GC riders who are part of the biggest teams. Why not make their lives trickier with a few exciting loners who could spoil the party? Would make the races harder to control...

    I am more inclined to agree with you about TTTs. Anyone out there prepared to defend them?
  • teagarteagar Posts: 2,100
    terongi wrote:
    teagar wrote:
    TTs are a necessary bore, there to make the whole "big vs small" dichotomy between GC riders interesting. Climbers have to make up more time because of a forthcoming TT, others need to limit their losses blah blah blah.

    I think you just argued against yourself there. TTs help to mix up the GC and make a Grand Tour into a real test of all-round skills.

    Did I?
    :?:
    Note: the above post is an opinion and not fact. It might be a lie.
  • TTT's look really nice, for a while.
  • FJSFJS Posts: 4,820
    I am torn about TTTs. I do believe they are one of the most beautiful and toughest events in cycling, and it would be very sad to see them go. I for one find them much more exciting to watch than individual TTs. Conserving TTTs outside Grand Tours, like the Eindhoven event are bound to fail, so part of me is happy the GTs remain a forum for them.

    On the other hand, I agree their effects on the general classement can be perverse, and putting in a TTT that does not count for the overall classement does not make sense.

    I actually think the TTT planned for 2011 is great - it's only 23 km, much shorther than last year and the ones during LAs Tour wins, and time differences will not be that significant.

    If only the TTT would be brought back to the Olympics, and introduced in the World Championships...
  • edhornbyedhornby Posts: 1,780
    why not have the TTT with the big cash prize and points for the team comp but not carry the times over to the individual GC? that way a strong rider on a cack team won't be stuffed

    I know that it's great to watch and the teams/sponsors push them because it's great advertising, I'd have them if the above were the case
    "I get paid to make other people suffer on my wheel, how good is that"
    --Jens Voight
  • BhimaBhima Posts: 2,145
    Maybe they should do 3-man TTs instead. Much more interesting. That way, the GC contenders could just pick the two strongest TTers to help them and if the team is pretty censored at TTTs, the GC contenders in those teams wont suffer as much.

    It would mean 3 groups of 3 riders, assuming nobody had dropped out.
  • TusherTusher Posts: 2,762
    I adore TTTs. They can be beautiful. And it brings out the team in 'cycling is a team sport', and so I feel it's good for them to have a team stage. Yes, some teams are going to be absolutely carp, but hey, that adds to the enjoyment. Others will invest a lot of time and money in being excellent at them. Swings and roundabouts.

    A shorter stage should limit the damage for those GC contenders with a weaker team though.


    I confess I rather like the idea of a three or four man team though technically they only need five out of nine to actually cross the line.

    Does anyone know if a team has reached the TTT with only four men left in the race? (I mean if the other five have had to leave int eh previous days)
  • top_bhoytop_bhoy Posts: 1,421
    teagar wrote:
    All a TTT serves to do is make it a battle between the GC riders who are part of the biggest teams.
    Concur with this 100%..TT I understand the point of, at least its a test of an all rounders ability but in TTT, a good all rounder with a poor team is stuffed right from the start and in general, its the big budget teams who will always win through.
  • KléberKléber Posts: 6,842
    It's true that it suits the big teams but small teams can benefit from practising. Evans lost out in the last time trial but he had some good rouleurs in his squad. Lotto's problem was a total lack of organisation, riders were blowing up, getting dropped and the team hesitated when they dropped one important rider, I imagine they lost 45 seconds from this. It's not a question of money, it's planning too.
  • teagarteagar Posts: 2,100
    Kléber wrote:
    It's true that it suits the big teams but small teams can benefit from practising. Evans lost out in the last time trial but he had some good rouleurs in his squad. Lotto's problem was a total lack of organisation, riders were blowing up, getting dropped and the team hesitated when they dropped one important rider, I imagine they lost 45 seconds from this. It's not a question of money, it's planning too.

    It'll be enough for Bertie to think twice about QS. Their only good TTers are Chavanel and Devolder and he looks to be skipping the tour in the next couple years.
    Note: the above post is an opinion and not fact. It might be a lie.
  • RichN95.RichN95. Posts: 24,904
    Bhima wrote:
    Maybe they should do 3-man TTs instead. Much more interesting. That way, the GC contenders could just pick the two strongest TTers to help them and if the team is pretty censored at TTTs, the GC contenders in those teams wont suffer as much.

    It would mean 3 groups of 3 riders, assuming nobody had dropped out.

    It's a nice idea, but sadly unworkable.

    For a start, who's a GC contender? Plenty of unexpected riders have popped up in top ten over the years, loads in the top 20. In 2006, Pereiro wasn't CdE's GC guy - Valverde was until he crashed, and then Oscar accidently fell into Yellow.

    Also, some teams have more than one GC contender. Last year Astana had four at least.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • dougzzdougzz Posts: 1,833
    It's nice to watch but ridiculous in that the times contribute to GC. Why don't they introduce a sprint and have green jersey points for the team that does a signed 200 metre section the quickest, or time them on the biggest hill and award KOM points, that would be equally dumb.

    If you must have it for sponsors and it's value as a very watchable TV show, then award the times for team competition but not the GC.
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