Breaking the Chain - the book

BikingBernie

Pross wrote:

many riders don't mature into good stage racers until they are in their late 20's.

On the other hand, prior to the EPO era, most Tour winners, and especially multiple Tour winners, showed their talent practically from the off, such as Anquetil (won his first Tour) Merckx (won his first five Tours) Hinault (won his first 4 Tours) Fignon (won his first 2 Tours) Lemond (3rd in his first Tour) and so on. Even Joop Zoetemelk who did not win the Tour until his 10th ride was 2nd in his first two Tours.

How many pre-epo era multiple Tour winners can you name who were as rubbish as Armstrong was (as a Tour rider that is) before he teamed up with Ferrari?

ms_tree

rockmount wrote:

Ms Tree wrote:

ColinJ wrote:

brakelever wrote:

sounds a good read ! is it avaible in english

Yes, it's called Breaking the Chain and is written by Willy Voet!

(It's translated from the original French by William Fotheringham.)

You can get it at Amazon.co.uk for under a fiver - link.

Why buy it when you can borrow it from the library! We stock it - I know 'cos I requested it so they had to buy it!! (The power!!!)

How did you guess?????

RichN95.

BikingBernie wrote:

Pross wrote:

many riders don't mature into good stage racers until they are in their late 20's.

On the other hand, prior to the EPO era, most Tour winners, and especially multiple Tour winners, showed their talent practically from the off, such as Anquetil (won his first Tour) Merckx (won his first five Tours) Hinault (won his first 4 Tours) Fignon (won his first 2 Tours) Lemond (3rd in his first Tour) and so on. Even Joop Zoetemelk who did not win the Tour until his 10th ride was 2nd in his first two Tours.

How many pre-epo era multiple Tour winners can you name who were as rubbish as Armstrong was (as a Tour rider that is) before he teamed up with Ferrari?

But that logic doesn't make any sense. Pre-Ferrari, he was racing relatively clean* and was up against riders juiced up to 60%. It's a bit of a tall order to ask a 21-23 year old to get on the podium under those circumstances - the greats you listed wouldn't have done.

And he wasn't riding for GC in the Tour, just stages (similar story with Indurain). He had some great results in one day races pre-Ferrari and some decent ones in short stage races (kind of like EBH now). If EPO had never existed, then I think he still would have been a serious contender.

It's a complete myth that he was a carthorse before the good doctor came along.


*(if he wasn't there wouldn't have been the great improvement that you say, probably correctly, points to doping)

BikingBernie

RichN95 wrote:

Pre-Ferrari, he was racing relatively clean* and was up against riders juiced up to 60%. It's a bit of a tall order to ask a 21-23 year old to get on the podium under those circumstances

It's a tall order to expect any rider to compete against others who are Epo'd and blood doped to the max. These practices didn't go away whilst Armstrong was racing, and the only reason he became so dominant is that he 'got on a program', just like the others.

RichN95 wrote:

he wasn't riding for GC in the Tour, just stages

But he openly declared that he was targeting the flat time trials, and said that he was looking to improve by a minute a year in them. However, he continued to lose 6-7 minutes in these very stages that he was supposedly focusing his training on. Then he teamed up with Ferrari and rode these time trials faster than anyone else had ever done....

RichN95 wrote:

It's a complete myth that he was a carthorse before the good doctor came along.

A 'myth' no one has argued for. He was undoubtedly a talented one-day rider, but when it comes to being a Tour rider he was a complete also-ran until he met up with Ferrari.

And he wasn't 'relatively clean' in his pre-Ferrari days. However, dabbling in Epo, testosterone and so on is one thing, the real improvements come with a properly medically managed Epo/ blood doping program - the type that allows you to boost your haemocrit to 58% or more (the figure given by Prentice Steffan, the ex USP team doctor) whilst at the same time ensuring that you don't die in your sleep of a heart attack.

dave_1

RichN95 wrote:

BikingBernie wrote:

Pross wrote:

many riders don't mature into good stage racers until they are in their late 20's.

On the other hand, prior to the EPO era, most Tour winners, and especially multiple Tour winners, showed their talent practically from the off, such as Anquetil (won his first Tour) Merckx (won his first five Tours) Hinault (won his first 4 Tours) Fignon (won his first 2 Tours) Lemond (3rd in his first Tour) and so on. Even Joop Zoetemelk who did not win the Tour until his 10th ride was 2nd in his first two Tours.

How many pre-epo era multiple Tour winners can you name who were as rubbish as Armstrong was (as a Tour rider that is) before he teamed up with Ferrari?

But that logic doesn't make any sense. Pre-Ferrari, he was racing relatively clean* and was up against riders juiced up to 60%. It's a bit of a tall order to ask a 21-23 year old to get on the podium under those circumstances - the greats you listed wouldn't have done.

And he wasn't riding for GC in the Tour, just stages (similar story with Indurain). He had some great results in one day races pre-Ferrari and some decent ones in short stage races (kind of like EBH now). If EPO had never existed, then I think he still would have been a serious contender.

It's a complete myth that he was a carthorse before the good doctor came along.


*(if he wasn't there wouldn't have been the great improvement that you say, probably correctly, points to doping)

...he was near to best triathlete in the world at 16 years old and then wins the TDF. Who would have thunk it??

sherer

yes up to cancer Armstrong was always seen as a one day racer. Cofidis signed him to win the world cup that used to run rather than as a tour winner

BikingBernie

Dave_1 wrote:

...he was near to best triathlete in the world at 16 years old and then wins the TDF. Who would have thunk it??

Certainly no one who saw him get his arse kicked all over France year after year in the days before he became a 'client' of Ferrari.

dave milne

Just read this. Enjoyed it except for the extreme brevity, it took me about 40-50 minutes to read it which is a pisstake for a book costing a fiver or whatever it was.