SRAM X9 rear derailleurs set up

JK in the UK

Hi,

I've just got 2 SRAM X9 rear derailleurs (2010 model) for 2 of my bikes.

These have proved an absolute bugger to set up. I've managed to set up all manner of SRAM/Shimano gears over the years but these are impossible!

The instructions say to adjust the b-screw so there's a 6mm gap between the cassette and top pulley at the top and bottom gear. This is impossible - 6mm gap at the largest gear equates to a 15mm gap at the bottom on both bikes.

The other problem is no matter what I do, the chain skips and clunks about under load when in the hardest 2 or 3 gears no matter how I much I tweak the barrel adjuster...

They seem to operate best with a slight bit of slack in the cable in the slack position - something that doesn't seem too right to me. Also setting up the limit screws in the first place wasn't too easy - they don't seem to return to their stop position with much force so seem to drift about in line with the bottom two gears....

I haven't replaced the cassette/chain/chainrings but none of them are worn (measured) so I don't think that should be a problem.

One's a HT (set up 1x9, cheap shimano cassette & sram pg951 chain), the other a F/S (set up 3x9, xt cassette & kmc x9 chain)... It's impossible! Can anyone help?!

Forgot to say these are both medium cage length and I've got a short cage X7 waiting to be fitted to my DH bike - I hope this isn't the same...

Cheers,
John

bails87

Have you got the loop of cable from the last cable stop to the mech cut to the correct length? If that's wrong it could be putting unexpected pressure on the mech.

cloudynights

had much the same problem with my x9 rear mech both a 09 and 10 model in the end my lbs took it off and replaced it with a xt, they told me they have nothing but problems with shram
my xt works perfectly

JK in the UK

cloudynights - that is not good news! I'm a SRAM fanboy but these rear mechs are a bloody nightmare. I'm sure they're on loads of bikes new, so surely someone's got lots of experience setting them up?! I wish I hadn't just bought 3 of the bloody things and converted my only Shimano fitted bike to SRAM...Doh!

bails87 - when you say correct length, please enlighten me! The new cable route means that last run of cable has to be very short (outer and inner as it happens because the inner loops behind the knuckle and back in towards the top jockey wheel).

I don't think its too long but I'll check...

It's really annoying because the B adjust screw more or less moves the mech horizontally under the cassette for most of its adjustment, so the mech hangs either fore or aft of the bottom of the cassette but too close. When you get the right gap at one end of the cassette it buggers it up at the other.

Late night at work so didn't get to fiddle tonight as planned...Any other ideas anyone?!

supersonic

Set the B tension screw in the largest rear cog - forget about the rest.

Check your cables are cut flush and are smooth - your problem sounds like excess friction.

nicklouse

or just poor set up assembly.

but yes friction sounds like the main issue.

What shifters are you using?

Never had any of the issues you mention when fitting any sram mech. Even with the B screw badly set.

bails87

I've never had any problems with my SRAM either (08 X0).

The outer length: in the manual there will be a chart showing the correct length for the final length of outer, based on (I think) the distance from the cable stop to the mech.

Check you've got it right, and make sure the ends of the outer are cut cleanly, and open them up a little bit with something round and sharp(carefully!).

Northwind

I've got X9 and X5 on mine, both fitted and work perfectly. Though I never noticed the "6mm from the cassette" thing, I'd say it probably just doesn't matter, after all not all cassettes are the same size/shape.

Anonymous

Northwind wrote:

I've got X9 and X5 on mine, both fitted and work perfectly. Though I never noticed the "6mm from the cassette" thing, I'd say it probably just doesn't matter, after all not all cassettes are the same size/shape.

same here.

all of my sram has gone together a whole lot swifter than any shimano ive set up and whats more, once set up, needs fettling a whole lot less too.

Dick Scruttock

sheepsteeth wrote:

Northwind wrote:

I've got X9 and X5 on mine, both fitted and work perfectly. Though I never noticed the "6mm from the cassette" thing, I'd say it probably just doesn't matter, after all not all cassettes are the same size/shape.

same here.

all of my sram has gone together a whole lot swifter than any shimano ive set up and whats more, once set up, needs fettling a whole lot less too.

I agree, i have X9 shifters and a X0 mech on my blur and once fitted and setup they are spot on. However on my Malt i have SLX and when bought it was all sort on, now however the rear indexing needs fettling.

JK in the UK

Guys, thanks for all your help.

Again, I couldn't agree more with your comments - as I've already said, I'm a SRAM fanboy and have had no problems with any of their kit in the past. I haven't been able to get down the shed, so will check everything you've suggested in due course. I really don't recall any mention of cable lengths but I've set up countless SRAM and Shimano set ups and never had an issue. I've always recommended SRAM because I've found they're easier to set up and require much less frequent adjustment of the indexing that Shimano set ups I've used.

These 2010 mechs are quite a different design to previous models and do seem to behave differently. They are a nightmare to set up! I always use proper cable cutters and flare the inside of the outer cables properly to reduce friction. I'm running '07 X9 trigger shifters on all of the bikes as I like the window showing what gear I'm in. For the extra 10g I think you're an idiot to go without! I also run XTR cables, which were working fine with the previous mechs. The new mech design does mean that last loop of outer cable needs shortening quite significantly from previous generation SRAM mechs to fit properly (i.e. approx 30-40mm).

Ironically, a couple of weeks ago I set up my mates XT shadow set up which seems to have a bit of a reputation for being a pain in the arse and it was an absolute doddle!

Has anyone fitted/using the latest 2010 model rear mechs?! I appreciate peoples comments but I know all about the ease of the previous models - I've been using them with no issues!!!!

Thanks again all,
John.

nicklouse

cant say that i noticed any difference.

Looking at the srams site they do look different but I can say that i have noticed it when fitting them.

Will have to have a closer look, No new manuals saying the fitting and set up is any different.

We look closer tomorrow.

ddraver

well bugger me if my cable length isnt totally up the spout - I ve never noticed that in years!!!

skywdbd

Just tried to install 2010 x-9 with an 09 Lx shifter. For some reason the ratio is not right. Stuck an old LX shifter and the device shifed perfect. Weird huh. Never really seen this problem. I've crossed older Sram stuff with Shimano all the time. Any thoughts?

nicklouse

skywdbd wrote:

Just tried to install 2010 x-9 with an 09 Lx shifter. For some reason the ratio is not right. Stuck an old LX shifter and the device shifed perfect. Weird huh. Never really seen this problem. I've crossed older Sram stuff with Shimano all the time. Any thoughts?

sorry not possible, the Sram ratio are the same and will not work.

the ONLY sram shifters that work with the Shimano ones are the NAMED versions (plus some very old 2.1 ratio versions).

front mechs are fine though.

cavegiant

I only read the instructions if something is seriously wrong, it's a guy thing.

I just set up my x9 the same way as my XT/SLX no issues at all, actually prefer it as I find setup easier.

ewizzy1977

Ive been having trouble setting up my new X9 2010 with brand new X9 2010 front shifter too... I'm running a full length outer as I alway have done so the cable length isnt too much of a problem, there is no discernable friction when moving the cable through the outer.

I've always used SRAM as I find them a lot easier to setup than shimano and less fettling needed too. I'm having similar problems as the OP too, using new chain and new cassette, new front rings. The X9 stuff just doesnt seem to have the same spring tension as the older X7 stuff I had before.

Having said that, it seeems to work OKish for a bit then suddenly it will start getting noisier and then I'll get the occasional slip until I adjust the gears again.

I dont know, I think i'll wait a couple of months and then tell the missus that I need more new stuff :-D

richg1979

does the rear mech drop straight down to bottom cog with the outer cable removed?

Fit the chain on middle front ring and small back ring with cables removed from rear mech.

loosen H stop screw on mech until you can hear/feel the chain starting to catch.
then adjust this screw back in counting how many turns until it starts to catch again then back off half the turns that you counted so the upper guide/jockey wheel on the mech should be running dead center with the bottom cog and should be turning very smoothly.

now wind in the barrel adjuster on the shifter all the way then back out 2 turns and is in the highest gear.

refit the cable keeping the inner pulled taut while you nip up the pinch bolt.

it should be running bang on, you may just have to undo the barrel adjuster half a turn.

then adjust your top L screw stop so the chain does not run off cassette.

The tension/b screw should be adjusted so the upper guide/jockey wheel runs as close to the casette as poss with out fouling.

d3matt

I'm glad to discover this thread. I too am having problems with my SRAM X9 rear derailleur. My bike (Boardman FS team) is now only 12 weeks old and I've had rear shifting problems since new, but they have got worse.
It changes gear or just slips/jumps when under load, which makes it very difficult on hills. And more recently the derailleur isn't moving down from the large cog to the smaller ones very easily.
It went in for it's six week service and I was told there was nothing wrong with it. Then a week later I took it to a local bike shop and they replaced the cable as it was obviously stiff at the last outer cable section near the rear wheel. It was fine for about 1 hour, but then started playing up again.
I'm now doing all the work myself and learning at the same time. To me, the derailleur not moving down must be caused by either a stiff cable or weak derailleur spring (can these me replaced?). I've used Rock N Roll Cablemagic on the cable and it doesn't seem too stiff. If I remove the cable from the derailleur, it does drop down to the smallest gears ok. But with the cable attached it rarely moves to the smallest cog without a bit of a push, even when the stops are set correctly. I therefore think the problems are a mix of cable stiffness and a weak derailleur, but I suspect it is the last section of outer cable or maybe the wrong length.
Would this be the cause why it jumps & shifts when under load? I've also replaced the rear hanger as I suspected it wasn't in align, which there was a very slight difference between the new and old.
The next thing I'm going to do is replace the outer cable on the rear section. The X9 derailleur is currently £47.96 at CRC so I was wondering if I should just by a new one, even though my bike is under warranty.

And I also have the same problems with the B-tension screw adjustment. I can't make the gap anywhere near the recommended 6mm. Adjusting the screw doesn't seem to move the derailleur in the right direction. It moves in more of a horizontal direction, rather than a vertical direction, and therefore the gap doesn't change much.

PS. I have 2010 SRAM X9 rear derailleur, X7 shifters, SRAM PC991 cross step chain (recently upgraded from original to see if that helps problems), SRAM PG950 11-32T cassette.
I've also purchased some new X9 shifters of eBay, so I'll put these on shortly and hence have a new cable inner again.

Northwind

"But with the cable attached it rarely moves to the smallest cog without a bit of a push, even when the stops are set correctly."

This seems to be a bit of an X9 feature, all of mine have done it at some point. Easy fix though, leave it in the smallest (highest) gear whenever you park up the bike and it'll stop doing it. Pretty sure it's a spring tension thing, the X9s are quite lightly sprung which makes them nicer to use. But, not likely to be causing your other issues.

d3matt

Nice tip Northwind. Thank you.
I'll do that in future.

d3matt

I'm just taking mine apart to clean and see if I can get it working better.
I have a couple of questions:

Should the derailleur be sprung or should it be loose to swing up/down as shown in this video?


Can you take the X9 derailleur apart to clean and grease the pivot points? Is the main spring replaceable?

Northwind

That's normal- when there's a chain on it'll be pulled forward by the mech's tension.

d3matt

Thank you.
When I went to remove it, I then noticed that the bolt that holds the derailleur to the hanger had come out by about 2 (maybe 3) turns!
I've only done three 20 mile rides since I changed the hanger and I did do up the bolt very tight. I'm surprised it can come loose so quickly and by so much. That could explain why my gears are jumping under load as the derailleur was about 2-3 mm out of align.

mattv

X9 mechs seem very sensitive to grit and dust int he pivots. This stops them dropping down to the smallest gear without encouragement. Soak it in thin oil, this tends to give short term results. The springs are very light on these mechs. By the look of it, there are no problems with the 2011 10speed kit though, a few hundred miles in mine is doing fine.

With the Boardman, check as well that the freehub body is ok. See if the cassette itself is clicking properly as you turn it, ie not occasionally "missing" when you are pedalling. See if it has any play if you try and rock it side to side as well. Seen quite a few Boardmans of all types with duff freehub boodies after a few weeks of riding.

The Rookie

Just put an X9 (medium cage - 08 model off ebay) onto my commuter, X0 twist shift up front (great for de-cluttering a commuter!) did it all up, set the B-screw (nice touch having the built in steel stop to stop it digging in the mech hanger and needing occasional adjusting, take note Shimano) and went to test it, bingo, worked perfectly out the box, no cable adjusting at all (all new jagwire teflon coated with yellow outers as I have a 'black/gold colourscheme going on).

Simon

rybu

Another frustrated x9 rear derailler owner!!

i too have a boardman team fs (two weeks old) and it is jumping, changing and clattering.

I only used it the once, back to Halfords (they didnt set it up in their defence).

I followed the Sram guide but its just not right???

I'll see what they have to say.

Something tells me that i need to will be going back their alot - Its very frustrating why it doesnt work properly.

As for the B screw, it just doesnt follow what Sram manual says regarding the gap throughout the rear cog positions.

The Rookie

Just set the B-screw for the gear the wheel is closest to, the mech can't know (for example) whether you are using a 32-11 or a 34-11!

Simon

coopsman1

I just spent a couple of hours on Saturday setting up my SRAM X9. Yes it is a bit of a nightmare but with patience and plenty of cups of tea on stand by you will get there.

Without teaching you to suck eggs.

First thing I suggest is make sure the inner cables are moving freely in the outer casing. Hold one end of the cable and run through the gears on the shifter. It should tighten and return smoothly. (no need to pull the inner cable).

Also pour some light oil down the inners.

Adjust the high & low limit screw as you currently do. Leave the B screw for now.

Route the inner cable throught the loop on the rear mech and also MAKE SURE it goes through the groove cut into the cable clamp. I can not stress how long it took me to figure this out. If you dont it result in poor shifting.

Now start in Top gear (9/10) and test to see if it shifts into the next cog up. If it does nottighten the barrel adjuster half a turn.

Repeat these steps until it does change cog smoothly.

Now run through all the gears and adjust the barrel adjuster 1/8 of a turn at a time.

When you are happy set the B screw while in Bottom gear (1) to about 6mm. Then shift down into Top gear (9/10) and if the chain is rubbing on the top jockey wheel turn the B screw half a turn until it stop rubbing.

That should be it.

Like I said not teaching you to suck eggs or anything but it takes time and patience with the X9.

Chunkers1980

coopsman1 wrote:

I just spent a couple of hours on Saturday setting up my SRAM X9. Yes it is a bit of a nightmare but with patience and plenty of cups of tea on stand by you will get there.

Without teaching you to suck eggs.

First thing I suggest is make sure the inner cables are moving freely in the outer casing. Hold one end of the cable and run through the gears on the shifter. It should tighten and return smoothly. (no need to pull the inner cable).

Also pour some light oil down the inners.

Adjust the high & low limit screw as you currently do. Leave the B screw for now.

Route the inner cable throught the loop on the rear mech and also MAKE SURE it goes through the groove cut into the cable clamp. I can not stress how long it took me to figure this out. If you dont it result in poor shifting.

Now start in Top gear (9/10) and test to see if it shifts into the next cog up. If it does nottighten the barrel adjuster half a turn.

Repeat these steps until it does change cog smoothly.

Now run through all the gears and adjust the barrel adjuster 1/8 of a turn at a time.

When you are happy set the B screw while in Bottom gear (1) to about 6mm. Then shift down into Top gear (9/10) and if the chain is rubbing on the top jockey wheel turn the B screw half a turn until it stop rubbing.

That should be it.

Like I said not teaching you to suck eggs or anything but it takes time and patience with the X9.

Be wary of this - Better to use the Park guide.

The limit screws are just that - nothing to do with the indexing.

Remove slack by pulling the cable and tightening - a barrel adjuster is for fine tuning and should ideally only ever be a couple of full turns out.

rybu

Well,

I have left my bike with Halfords, the boardman team fs runs fine on the stand through the gears but actually riding it a couple of the rear gears jump and judder.

Can anyone answer this????

What would the additional effect of pedalling/ chain tension have on the rear setup,???

I am new to mountain biking so don't call me stupid.....