Times attacks: iPod Zombie Cyclists

downfader

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/u ... 936280.ece

Personally I dont do it, however some of the drivers on there seem to think the honus is only on us to hear what is around us. :? I tried to point out: "how will you hear car horns" The answer seems to be "I dont need to" :roll:

So many examples on there of Drivers blowing hard, moaning "what if I hit you!!?"

Anyway feel free to dig in.The article itself is pretty biased

Agent57

Well, having a go at cyclists who ride with earphones in is fair enough. However, the same argument also holds for drivers who do it, and pedestrians. And inline skaters.

lfcquin

Personally I don't do it, but I resent the sensationalism of the article that assumes it is the iPod that turns people into "Zombies". The sort of examples they use are just people being ignorant and unaware, the iPod has nothing to do with it. If you don't look when you pull out of a junction, chances are you will hit a car, listening to an iPod won;t make too much difference. I am sure there are iPod users who are very aware and responsible when riding or walking.

They're just jumping on the cyclist bashing bandwaggon that the papers seem to be enjoying at the moment. :x

megilleland

I don't like i-pods but at least most cyclists with i-pods have both hands on the handlebars compared to many motorists who text with one hand and have their minds a million miles away from being in control of a ton of metal.

tailwindhome

Are deaf people allowed to ride bikes?

The issue isn't wether or not the cyclist can hear the traffic, it's wether or not the cyclist is paying attention.

Sames goes for drivers using their mobiles, chatting to passengers, keeping the kids quiet, eating their lunch, putting on make-up, shaving..................

The fashion for cyclists to wear earphones on crowded city streets is being held partly responsible for the recent upsurge in cycling injuries and deaths, as well as collisions with pedestrians.

The article provides no evidence for this assertion. In fact ...

It is not known how many of these cases were caused by people listening to music because the DfT and the police do not record the information.

The latest DfT figures show that 820 cyclists were killed or seriously injured in the three months to June, a 19% rise on the same period in 2008

Killed or seriously injured are completely different; lets lump them together to make a bigger number. What? Give comparisons so the number has context?Give analyisis as to root causes of these accidents?No

Another said that “iPod zombies are a menace. I saw a bus clip one of them the other day in Victoria who was oblivious to anything around him.”

Was the bus driver fecking blind?

Times journalists now quote anonymous bloggers as sources.
:roll:

David Cameron, the Tory leader, last year rode unpunished through red lights in London.

:roll:

I hate these cut and paste morons


We are 3-0 up though

downfader

lfcquin wrote:

Personally I don't do it, but I resent the sensationalism of the article that assumes it is the iPod that turns people into "Zombies". The sort of examples they use are just people being ignorant and unaware, the iPod has nothing to do with it. If you don't look when you pull out of a junction, chances are you will hit a car, listening to an iPod won;t make too much difference. I am sure there are iPod users who are very aware and responsible when riding or walking.

They're just jumping on the cyclist bashing bandwaggon that the papers seem to be enjoying at the moment. :x

Excatly, and what is more shocking is how there was actually no proof that the young girl actually had her earphones in. :? Her earphones were even under her scarf ffs.

redvee

I have been guilty in the past but not amymore. The las ttime I rode with music on was with my phone in the top pocket and playing through the loudspeaker on the cyclepath. Tempted to shout at cyclists wearing earphones then pull them out if I can then point out a nonexistant hazard they missed cause of the earphones.

downfader

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/commen ... 936082.ece

However, many cyclists feel uniquely free to ignore the rules of the road. Some are total idiots. But the fact remains that we have no licences to lose and no numberplates to identify us so we can commit with impunity all the offences that would soon find you banned from a car.

Another article, this time from a cyclist. It seems she didnt plan her journey or look properly and was FPN'd for pavement cycling. I always say, if you're unsure you get off and walk. :?

I'm not sure if she's implying theres a majority of offenders, or if the minority are just very visible.

PedalPedant

lfcquin wrote:

They're just jumping on the cyclist bashing bandwaggon that the papers seem to be enjoying at the moment. :x

We do seem to be the current favourite target for the knee jerk brigade. How long do you think it'll be before "stamping down on RLJers, pavement cyclists and iPod zombies" becomes part of an election manifesto :roll:

PP

chuckcork

PedalPedant wrote:

lfcquin wrote:

They're just jumping on the cyclist bashing bandwaggon that the papers seem to be enjoying at the moment. :x

We do seem to be the current favourite target for the knee jerk brigade. How long do you think it'll be before "stamping down on RLJers, pavement cyclists and iPod zombies" becomes part of an election manifesto :roll:

PP

If they do they'll only pick up drivers who are worse: cue winges about "taxes on motoring".

acidstrato

i do it and frankly i dont care what anyone says i'll do what i like. but i am certainly no zombie and the fact of the matter is most cyclist involved accidents would probably still have happened regardless as to whether an ipod is involved

rhann

ive done it, only stopped because someone nicked my headphones, its perfectly safe, no different to a car with music on, you can still here the traffic, and you just keep looking over yuor shoulder a little bit more, which is what we should be doing anyway.

ThreeLionsBrian

Why look over your shoulder, there's enough morons to the sides and in front of you

What exactly are you looking for?

I look when turning right or to see if i've dropped the group that's about it.

shouldbeinbed

Times, anti bike polemic - Yawn Yawn, Yawn.

scary prejudice and assumptions from the coroner quoted tho. He sounds like a bit of a James Martin.

was the IPod on? if not then the impact has not only removed the phones from her ears and tucked them back under her scarf but also turned her music off.

I wonder if he's suggested a long list of contributory physical, medical and psychological factors likely to have caused the accident referred to.

was there a freak gust of wind, did Abigail have a minor siezure or stroke, was the driver travelling faster than they testified, what corrobboration was there that she was seen wearing the earphones or that the accident occurred as the still living half of it testified? what was the weather- could she have been momentarily blinded by the sun, bends? walls? hedges? is there medical testimony as to the quality of her hearing generally and on and on

Posession of an IPod and headphones near the ears - Constable Savage and Not the Nine O'Clock news springs to mind


Edit - I don't ride with my music on, but have an earbud and phone mic so that if I fall or get knocked off I've got access to the emergency services without hoping for a good samaritan.

Porgy

redvee wrote:

I have been guilty in the past but not amymore. The las ttime I rode with music on was with my phone in the top pocket and playing through the loudspeaker on the cyclepath. Tempted to shout at cyclists wearing earphones then pull them out if I can then point out a nonexistant hazard they missed cause of the earphones.

It's a shame I don;t ride in Bristol because I think I would really enjoy punching anyone who tried this with me.

Porgy

rhann wrote:

ive done it, only stopped because someone nicked my headphones, its perfectly safe, no different to a car with music on, you can still here the traffic, and you just keep looking over yuor shoulder a little bit more, which is what we should be doing anyway.

Actually - I find it difficult to concentrate in a car with music on too loud - and i'm sure i'm not alone there.

So it's hypocritical for drivers, mostly half asleep, surrounded by every comfort of home, heating on too high, blind spots all round them, often with a broken or badly adjusted wing mirror, and stereo on far too loud, to tell us that we're zombies!!

This article was laughable as a balanced piece of journalism. They kept having to point out that there was no evidence for their assertions.

It's just another routine slightly disguised anti-cycling article of old.

I guess I will shortly be adding this to the list of things that I get heckled and/or attacked over by motorists:

1. not paying road tax (when I do)
2. not having insurance (when I do)
3. not wearing a helmet (when I don;t need to)
4. not riding in the gutter (when no-one should)
5. not using the footpath cycle lanes (when I don;t have to)
6. not passing a test (which I have)
7. having long hair (my business)
8. being overweight (my business)

LOL!! listening to an ipod makes you run people over on the pavement.

And after all the ridiculous hype, near the bottom, they finally get round to asking someone who is able to give a definitive, unbiased and sensible answer. The CTC:

However CTC, the national cycling group, argues that people should be left to make their own judgments. “We encourage deaf people to cycle so we don’t think it’s essential to hear traffic in order to ride,” said a spokeswoman. “You have to be sensible. The most important thing is that you look around you all the time — especially over your shoulder.”

and as for:
“If cyclists had to take a test, like all other road users do, and pay insurance, then perhaps there would be a lot less idiots riding their bikes,

Not sure about that - it doesn't stop most motorists being idiots.

spen666

Porgy wrote:

rhann wrote:

ive done it, only stopped because someone nicked my headphones, its perfectly safe, no different to a car with music on, you can still here the traffic, and you just keep looking over yuor shoulder a little bit more, which is what we should be doing anyway.

Actually - I find it difficult to concentrate in a car with music on too loud - and i'm sure i'm not alone there.

So it's hypocritical for drivers, mostly half asleep, surrounded by every comfort of home, heating on too high, blind spots all round them, often with a broken or badly adjusted wing mirror, and stereo on far too loud, to tell us that we're zombies!!

This article was laughable as a balanced piece of journalism. They kept having to point out that there was no evidence for their assertions.

It's just another routine slightly disguised anti-cycling article of old.

I guess I will shortly be adding this to the list of things that I get heckled and/or attacked over by motorists:

1. not paying road tax (when I do)

Perhaps you can explain how you manage to pay a tax that was abolished over 70 years ago.

2. not having insurance (when I do)
3. not wearing a helmet (when I don;t need to)
4. not riding in the gutter (when no-one should)
5. not using the footpath cycle lanes (when I don;t have to)
6. not passing a test (which I have)
7. having long hair (my business)
8. being overweight (my business)

LOL!! listening to an ipod makes you run people over on the pavement.

And after all the ridiculous hype, near the bottom, they finally get round to asking someone who is able to give a definitive, unbiased and sensible answer. The CTC:

However CTC, the national cycling group, argues that people should be left to make their own judgments. “We encourage deaf people to cycle so we don’t think it’s essential to hear traffic in order to ride,” said a spokeswoman. “You have to be sensible. The most important thing is that you look around you all the time — especially over your shoulder.”

and as for:
“If cyclists had to take a test, like all other road users do, and pay insurance, then perhaps there would be a lot less idiots riding their bikes,

Not sure about that - it doesn't stop most motorists being idiots.

Porgy

spen666 wrote:

Porgy wrote:

rhann wrote:

ive done it, only stopped because someone nicked my headphones, its perfectly safe, no different to a car with music on, you can still here the traffic, and you just keep looking over yuor shoulder a little bit more, which is what we should be doing anyway.

Actually - I find it difficult to concentrate in a car with music on too loud - and i'm sure i'm not alone there.

So it's hypocritical for drivers, mostly half asleep, surrounded by every comfort of home, heating on too high, blind spots all round them, often with a broken or badly adjusted wing mirror, and stereo on far too loud, to tell us that we're zombies!!

This article was laughable as a balanced piece of journalism. They kept having to point out that there was no evidence for their assertions.

It's just another routine slightly disguised anti-cycling article of old.

I guess I will shortly be adding this to the list of things that I get heckled and/or attacked over by motorists:

1. not paying road tax (when I do)

Perhaps you can explain how you manage to pay a tax that was abolished over 70 years ago.

2. not having insurance (when I do)
3. not wearing a helmet (when I don;t need to)
4. not riding in the gutter (when no-one should)
5. not using the footpath cycle lanes (when I don;t have to)
6. not passing a test (which I have)
7. having long hair (my business)
8. being overweight (my business)

LOL!! listening to an ipod makes you run people over on the pavement.

And after all the ridiculous hype, near the bottom, they finally get round to asking someone who is able to give a definitive, unbiased and sensible answer. The CTC:

However CTC, the national cycling group, argues that people should be left to make their own judgments. “We encourage deaf people to cycle so we don’t think it’s essential to hear traffic in order to ride,” said a spokeswoman. “You have to be sensible. The most important thing is that you look around you all the time — especially over your shoulder.”

and as for:
“If cyclists had to take a test, like all other road users do, and pay insurance, then perhaps there would be a lot less idiots riding their bikes,

Not sure about that - it doesn't stop most motorists being idiots.

you, sir, are a pedant!

spen666

Porgy wrote:

...
you, sir, are a pedant!

not at all


Road Tax and the Road fund were abolished for a reason that is as valid today as bwack in the 1930s.

You are doing all cyclists a dis service by suggesting such a tax/ fund exists. You are playing into the hads of the motorist.

Churchill was correct when he said that not abolishing the road tax would lead motorists to think they "own" the road.

How many times do you get told as a cyclist you have no right to be on the road as you do not pay road tax?

Porgy

spen666 wrote:

Porgy wrote:

...
you, sir, are a pedant!

not at all


Road Tax and the Road fund were abolished for a reason that is as valid today as bwack in the 1930s.

You are doing all cyclists a dis service by suggesting such a tax/ fund exists. You are playing into the hads of the motorist.

Churchill was correct when he said that not abolishing the road tax would lead motorists to think they "own" the road.

How many times do you get told as a cyclist you have no right to be on the road as you do not pay road tax?

you're not telling me somehting i don;t already know and have stated before on this forum, but i'm sorry when told i don;t pay road tax - yes i do is a lot snappier than "Road Tax and the Road fund were abolished for a reason that is as valid today as back in the 1930s."

It used to happen quite a lot until I bought my MP3 player, now I have no idea what they shout at me.

squired

I don't cycle with headphones, but I do always have cotton wool in my ears. When I was riding into London a couple of years ago I came to the conclusion that the excessive noise wasn't good for my ears, so started using cotton wool to dampen it down a little. Some days without cotton wool it felt like I'd been in a nightclub. When I have (very occasionally) used earphones it has been to listen to cricket in one ear, the chatter of which causes very little distraction.

The article is clearly a poor attempt to attack cyclists. The examples given are weak, but will potentially give drivers another get-out when they are involved in an accident with a cyclist. I remember many years ago when I was knocked over by a left turning car. I was cycling to a park to study for an exam I had a few days later. In my backpocket I had a walkman (with the earphones wrapped around it), so that I could play some music while I was reading in the park. After the crash I was checking the everything was undamaged. As soon as the van driver saw my walkman he started claiming I must have been listening to music, which must be what caused the crash. Following articles like this I can see insurance companies seeking out these get-outs more and more frequently to save them paying out for legitimate claims.

mattward1979

Depending on my mood (and the weather... ) I occasionally use headphones, and in all honesty there is no difference to the way that I cycle. Except perhaps that I dont get quite so close to actually soiling myself when a lorry driver decides to blaze past me at 60mph on a dual carriageway seemingly proving to all around that he is in some way superior.

Headphones or not, a stupid motorist will kill me if they make a mistake. But at least ill go out with some decent rock and roll in my ears.

Mr_Cellophane

I loved this one

Ben Rosenthal wrote:
stupid people are stupid, whether they are riding a bike, driving a car or writing a badly researched article.