Altura Attack Reproofing

sgray100474

Have a pair of Altura Attack overtrousers which have been dewaterproofed due to being washed in biological powder, should have used non-bio. Guy in Zyro said they are fooked. I was wondering if any of you superior beings had found a way of undoing said damage. I have put them through a cycle of reproofing with Granger's reproof wash. Ta.

anjs

Nikwax tech wash to start with. Clean out the soap tray and run a few empty hot cycles to clean out all the residue then wash it just in tech wash. Check for beeding afterward. If not beeding then was with TX proffer.

sgray100474

Will do. Ta.

sniper68

Never use bio or non bio it killer the DWR.Always use a specialist cleaner or natural soap flakes(i use soapflakes)always clean out the powder draw and set the machine going empty on a few hot washes before hand.

alfablue

Grangers/Nikwax will not stop your failed waterproof from leaking.

Even if the DWR dies, it should not make such product leak. The DWR is merely to cause the water on the surface to "bead up" (water forms into drops) rather than "wet out" (flat sheen of water) as the former allows breathability, the latter doesn't. If the fabric wets out you can get wet inside because of sweat, but this is different to the fabric leaking. The fabric should be inherently waterproof regardless of the DWR, unless it fails (usually de-lamination). Most or all of these products can fail. The difference between the best (Gore-Tex) and the worst (anything distributed by Zyro) is that the former will replace or refund your product without quibble, for life, whilst the latter will only quibble, and will replace Zero (note, just one letter different!).

The products like Grangers & NikWax are good, but they only replenish the DWR, they don't "reproof" a failed fabric.

I have had many such products, my Altura Attack Extreme lasted 5 weeks before it failed, fortunately Wiggle did the right thing and I wasn't subjected to Zyro. I learned my lesson and went back to Gore.

sgray100474

Thanks guys for all the info. I'm going to have one last shot at reproofing, but like you say,alfablue, I think mine have had it and the only way to go is Gore.

Northwind

alfablue wrote:

Most or all of these products can fail. The difference between the best (Gore-Tex) and the worst (anything distributed by Zyro) is that the former will replace or refund your product without quibble, for life, whilst the latter will only quibble, and will replace Zero (note, just one letter different!).

If you tell Gore that you ignored the washing instructions, they won't refund, even if it had no material impact on the failure- been there myself. And as for no quibble, total nonsense, my mate had a fairly new Gore jacket fail at a seam and they said it had been "overstressed". Never crashed... The jacket just wasn't fit for purpose. Gore do have a good warranty and good products but they're not what you make out.

alfablue

Northwind wrote:

The jacket just wasn't fit for purpose. Gore do have a good warranty and good products but they're not what you make out.

I make it out to be only what my experience has shown, which is 5 no quibble warranty claims myself and 3 for other family members. As I have never had any quibbles I can't speak otherwise.

(On one occasion they did mention punctures to the fabric - I had fallen in a hawthorne bush, but they still found it was faulty).

I am not making out that the warranty covers items that you break or mistreat, but its fairly easy to follow the care instructions. If the product fails due to materials or manufacture, and you haven't damaged it, they replace it. I don't think your post contradicts this. I am not sure why you would tell them you washed it contrary to the instructions if it had no effect, but credit to you for your honesty 8)

I have found their products do fail, possibly as often as other brands, but the distinctive feature is the warranty.

Northwind

They inspect the product so if you've damaged it- with harsh cleaners or too-hot washes, they'll know, is the point. The OP here hasn't had some random failure, he's damaged the jacket so warranties don't really come into it, Gore would respond the same. Cleaning wrongly doesn't just damage the DWP, it can cause delamination of the membranes, which in turn causes further damage as they're not durable by themselves (open up a goretex garment and you'll see what I mean, the liner is about as tough as clingfilm)

Surf-Matt

So the three Altura jackets I've had that still work fine - flukes?

Now got a Reflex and it's the best jacket I've had by miles (and a 9/10 score)

Tech wash then tx direct waterproofed my two pairs of Endura Singletracks - doesn't last ages but it does work a treat.

I do agree about Zyro though - completely and utterly useless.

the_moodster

stick it in the tumble dryer on a low heat for an hour or so, this is usually a good re-energiser for DWR

bushtuckerlad

Nikwax/Tech wash proofer works a treat.I also use this on all my walking/hiking equipment.

alfablue

Northwind wrote:

They inspect the product so if you've damaged it- with harsh cleaners or too-hot washes, they'll know, is the point. The OP here hasn't had some random failure, he's damaged the jacket so warranties don't really come into it, Gore would respond the same. Cleaning wrongly doesn't just damage the DWP, it can cause delamination of the membranes, which in turn causes further damage as they're not durable by themselves (open up a goretex garment and you'll see what I mean, the liner is about as tough as clingfilm)

No arguments with this, at all. If you damage anything, don't expect a warranty claim to work.

The membrane on most waterproofs is PTFE, very thin, not very strong once it loses contact with the "host" fabric.

alfablue

Surf-Matt wrote:

So the three Altura jackets I've had that still work fine - flukes?

Now got a Reflex and it's the best jacket I've had by miles (and a 9/10 score)

Tech wash then tx direct waterproofed my two pairs of Endura Singletracks - doesn't last ages but it does work a treat.

I do agree about Zyro though - completely and utterly useless.

My Altura Reflex was my fave jacket, lightest, most breathable, most comfortable. It lasted 7 months, not bad I wish I had faith in the distributors such that I could buy another one, by I don't have any faith in them at all.

alfablue

bushtuckerlad wrote:

Nikwax/Tech wash proofer works a treat.I also use this on all my walking/hiking equipment.

Yes it does, providing the underlying fabric is still waterproof.

micksjoiner

is this the stuff you used to waterproof your trousers http://www.amazon.co.uk/Nikwax-Tech-Was ... 083&sr=8-1

sgray100474

No, I used Peter Storm clothing re-proofer, made by Granger's.

Surf-Matt

Alfa - what happened to it after seven months?

Micks - that's what I use - I bought a big container of that and the tx Direct which actually waterproofs it - you can even make jeans waterproof albeit briefly. My Singletrack (slightly water resistant as standard) are pretty much 100% waterproof now - but they need re-proofing every two months or so. I bought big container (a litre) of the Tech Wash and Tx direct.

To do it properly you need to:

Wash with non bio powder
Wash with Tech wash
Wash with tx Direct

Once that's done, it's very waterproof and breathable.

micksjoiner

do you just put the Tech Wash and Tx direct. in drawer in washing machine like normal washing powder, is it that easy!

alfablue

Surf-Matt wrote:

Alfa - what happened to it after seven months?

The Altura Reflex? It just started leaking through the arms (upper side - maybe I just rode too fast ). This seems to be where they all fail first. 7 months is "good"! My Altura Attack Extreme (lovely jacket) lasted 3 or 4 weeks (same failure). No amount of Grangers/Nikwax resolves the issue when the laminate fails. Fortunately both these purchases were from Wiggle, so no hassle for a refund. I was sad because a) it was an xmas pressie from my lovely g/f and b) I really liked the design and fit of the jacket, and orange was starting to grow on me

After this failed, I did ask at the LBS, (Bike in Bristol), "If I bought an Altura Attack Extreme, and it started leaking, what would you do?" I was (optimistically) hoping for a response like "We will stand by what we sell and replace it immediately if it's faulty". Instead, after checking with the manager, they said they would send it back to the distributors and "see what they thought". (bear in mind this was a £130 jacket). Now I know the distributor is Zyro, and I know how they walked away from all responsibility on a Cateye product I had, so I wouldn't trust them as far as I could spit. The upshot is I won't buy Altura any more.

I am currently working my way through a Gore Bike Wear Alp X II - great jacket, but last weekend I got wet arms, so it will have to go back. A PITA, but at least I know it will be replaced or refunded (and with no quibble because they won't find I have mistreated it in any way).

I think I may be particularly unlucky with waterproofs, I don't know why, I spend good money, and I treat them to the letter of their care instructions (and I slip quite easily into OCD!). I Am resigning myself to having 2, so I always have one while the other goes back for replacement :?

Surf-Matt

Micks - yep that's exactly what you do.

Alfa - that seem very unlucky! One of my cheap Altura jackets has lasted five years although I haven't worn it for ages.

Agree about Zyro though - not heard a good word about them. Reminds me of the banks that we seem powerless to act against while they rape the country (but on a lesser scale).
Anti Zyro uprising anyone?

I've sent them about three complaint letters in the past - they just don't give a stuff.

I reckon a few manufacturers would pull their exclusivity deals with Zyro if they knew that they were actually putting customers off buying their products.

turnerjohn

Surf-Matt wrote:

So the three Altura jackets I've had that still work fine - flukes?

Now got a Reflex and it's the best jacket I've had by miles (and a 9/10 score)

Tech wash then tx direct waterproofed my two pairs of Endura Singletracks - doesn't last ages but it does work a treat.

I do agree about Zyro though - completely and utterly useless.

+1 with Altura gear ! and it also gets top rating from ALL the bike mags so can't be all that bad !!!

One thing worth mentioning tho.....if you washed a wool jumper from new on an 80 degree setting and it shrunk...would you take it back and claim it was faulty?...no cos the washing instructions say 30 cool wash! ....so mate dont think you really can take them back on that one.

zero303

Strange about the Altura warranty... I've had an '08 attack fall apart after about 8 months ('08 model had piss poor glued seams that came away), '09 jacket was provided, much better construction but lost it's waterproofing after similar period. Replaced with another '09 jacket no questions asked.

It's not perfect but in terms of fit, looks and breath ability, it's the nicest jacket out there. I'd be a bit narked at the price if I wasn't getting a good warranty. But as it turns out I'm on my third one 2.5 years and only paid once

the_moodster

hmm, three jackets in three years is poor tbh. my waterproof is going on 10 years old and going strong. i'd be dissapointed if a jacket didn't last at least 5 years without needing attention