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LVRC v BC

mbt1967mbt1967 Posts: 23
edited December 2009 in Amateur race
I've started racing this year. Did a few BC races in the earlypart of the season. Cat 3/4 stuff. I enjoyed it and felt OK in the bunch and launched a few attacks and chased a few down but no points. Need to learn patience.

We had a baby in June which put a big hole in the middle of the season.

Done a couple of LVRC events in the last coupld of weeks (I'm 41) and loved them. I've found there is more space 30 in the bunch not 120. Riders are more considerate of each other and less aggressive. Smoother and less erratic. And definitely more friendly....chatting to former British road race champs in the tea shed afterwards.

I think I'll do both next year but I can see me leaning towards the vets. What are others experiences / opinions?

Posts

  • Next year I plan to do both.
    Vets are better value for money and courses better. Well better than the usual hour plus 5 lap courses everyone seems to use as a club run with a sprint to get points.
    I will ride BC events with my team mates but prefer the lvrc events.
    Will try to do the bc masters events and BC nasters track and worlds track at Manchester then the LVRC track champs in October.
  • BronzieBronzie Posts: 4,927
    The only downside to LVRC races is that there are often some pretty decent riders in the field so the ability level can be much more varied than a typical 3/4. For example I did one of the Mstina Jersey races in Surrey and there was an Elite rider (Premier Calendar regular) in the pack who true to form attacked from the flag. It all settled down a bit once the break had formed of course. :)

    Generally I'd agree that the racing is smoother though and the standard of bike handling better. Certainly much better value at £16 for your licence and £6 pre-entry for the race compared to BC £65 + c.£15 per event. The race I did in Surrey even had transponder timing to place the entire field into the correct age categories.

    As you mention, also tends to be smaller groups on the roads, which makes the racing a lot more interesting as well as that bit safer.
  • ProssPross Posts: 29,627
    Is 40 still the age for vets in road racing or is it 35 like MTB is / was? I turn 37 in November and have been thinking about a return to racing (will realistically be 38 before I'm ready) and fancied the more sensible LVRC.
  • BronzieBronzie Posts: 4,927
    Pross wrote:
    Is 40 still the age for vets in road racing
    Yep
  • Pross wrote:
    Is 40 still the age for vets in road racing or is it 35 like MTB is / was? I turn 37 in November and have been thinking about a return to racing (will realistically be 38 before I'm ready) and fancied the more sensible LVRC.
    Why 38 to be ready?
    If you train over winter for base miles you will be fine to race from April easily.
  • Had absolutely no idea that LVRC existed, until I came across it on the forum. Checked out the website, and I'm interested, but there seems to be a lack of races in Scotland.

    Is anyone from north of the border on this forum a member of the LVRC?
  • ProssPross Posts: 29,627
    Oldwelshman, I just don't think I'm realistically going to get enough miles in over the winter to race next season. My main aim for next season is to get fit enough to do some sportives and a charity ride I'm organising (my main reason for getting back on the bike). If all goes well and I am fit enough I may try a race at the end of the season if I can find a suitably flat course :wink:
  • ToksToks Posts: 1,143
    Pross wrote:
    Oldwelshman, I just don't think I'm realistically going to get enough miles in over the winter to race next season. My main aim for next season is to get fit enough to do some sportives and a charity ride I'm organising (my main reason for getting back on the bike). If all goes well and I am fit enough I may try a race at the end of the season if I can find a suitably flat course :wink:
    I'm not sure how many miles you feel you need to get in but you can definitley race on as litte as 4-5 training hours per week. However that training time can't be weak.

    You'll need to ramp up the intensity such that your close to average race pace intensity on at least 50% of your training time. I spoke to a vet rider who was surprised to get dropped in a 3/4 race at Hillingdon despite doing lots of long rides such as London to Birmingham an back. He was fine when the pack cruised at fairly sedate 22mph but a few 26-28mph surges and it was game over.

    I'm guessing most of his rides were in the 14-16mph. :roll: I do most of my training on a flat loop and when in race prep mode I average 19/20mph for an hour 3 or 4 x per week. That pretty much keeps in shape to be compettitive in all 3rd and LVRC circuit and short road races races.
  • jgsijgsi Posts: 5,029
    Toks wrote:
    Pross wrote:
    I spoke to a vet rider who was surprised to get dropped in a 3/4 race at Hillingdon despite doing lots of long rides such as London to Birmingham an back. He was fine when the pack cruised at fairly sedate 22mph but a few 26-28mph surges and it was game over. .

    Agreed with above.
    training has to include a fair number of fast paced sectors ie 25mph+ to cope with the often very variable race paces - those accelerations that happen at a no given notice - and if your position ends up at the back to cope with the elastic band effect until you can get a better bunch position.
    There is a big difference between sportive riding and a 50 mile road or circuit race.
  • ProssPross Posts: 29,627
    Thanks guys - it's not so much the mileage as my general lack of fitness. I did race for about 8 years as a final year junior and 3rd cat senior which is why I'm trying to be realistic - even after a 12 year break I can remember the pain lol. That said I had my second ride of my "comeback" yesterday and felt a huge improvement from the previous week and I know that once I get back riding with my old club I won't be able to resist. Will probably have a crack at some races at the end of next season if I can find flat enough courses (easier said than done around here!). Got a couple of years left before I can ride with the vets though, had hoped road racing had adopted the 35 year vet class from MTB :wink:
  • Monty DogMonty Dog Posts: 20,614
    I much prefer LVRC races to BC races - not just for the quality or riding but also the consideration of other riders - most have raced for years and are there for the enjoyment, rather than suffering an excess of testosterone, taking risks and riding beyond their abilities. It has been noticeable this year that fields are bigger and there is a greater variety of abilities - sometimes there's a big acceleration which sorts the race out before it settles down for the middle portion of the races. Talking to club mates, we reckon the LVRCs are better races and use Surrey League races for training! Finally, for £6 a race, I reckon there's no better racing anywhere.
    Make mine an Italian, with Campagnolo on the side..
  • I haven't done much racing over the past few years but I have to say that the LVRC events that I have done are very fast or at least no walk in the park.

    Don't be fooled by the slightly larger bellies before the start of the events, a lot of the guys racing in the LVRC are very good bike riders.

    I have felt more comfortable in 3rd cat events than most of the LVRC events I have done.

    I have to say though the LVRC events I have done have been very well organised and I will be treating them as key events for me next year.
  • I agree with Pocketrocket.

    3/4 races are your ability level, as opposed to LVRC races which are your age group, but could have Elite level riders in your race. Malcolm Elliot would qualify for this,although I don't think he is an LVRC member.

    Rich.
  • I believe Ben Luckwell has done a few LVRC events (I could be wrong) and we all know how good he is, or at least we should know, or would know if he was in the same race as you as he rips your legs off Laughing

    http://www.sportbeans.co.uk/cycleteam/t ... kwell.html

    Since I have come back to racing I have noticed how bad things have got in our sport -- yes we have pockets of brilliance amongst the young but in general if you look at a lot of clubs there are less youngsters in the clubs than in the 80's.

    Most people in cycling seem to be approaching 40 or over --- so the LVRC are doing a good trade, 3/4 cat racing is slow, I say this as I seem to be able to get around a 3/4 race with no training and being 3 stone over weight, I am unlikely to win a race but not far from it. In a 3/4 race I look around and notice that there really aren't many young people racing. (I race in the south east)

    Something needs to be done about this.

    The above might be just my experience what do you guys think? is there a danger of cycling dying due to the fact that there are not enough youngsters racing?
    I was talking about Road racing above but take time trialing --- which I don't normally do these days because I am censored at it .
    I am 43 I was invited to do the a time trial where one rider leads a veteran rider around a 17 mile course my partner was a very fit (fitter than me) 67 year old.
    Years ago I am pretty sure this event would have had a youngster 25 and below leading out a vet but now we had in nearly all, if not all teams vets leading out vets ??

    Can you see the problem LVRC is great but maybe there needs to be a LYRC (y= young) maybe there is and I just don't know about it.

    And another thing 3/J races where the riders had to race on restricted gears 52x15 are there many of these races these days?
  • Dess1eDess1e Posts: 239
    The juniors still have to race on restricted gears, the senior riders in the same race don't.
  • Tom ButcherTom Butcher Posts: 3,830
    I
    The above might be just my experience what do you guys think? is there a danger of cycling dying due to the fact that there are not enough youngsters racing?

    OK slight change of thread direction but I'll pick your point.

    I know what you mean - there are relatively few young riders - young being under 25s. We've got relatively few 16-25 year olds in the club and talking to long serving members far fewer than say 20 years ago.

    But at the same time we've just had the biggest overall turnout in our club evening 10s since the late 80s. We've got more people road racing and doing cyclo X than at any time since I've been a member (6 or 7 years). We've also got a midweek training ride that has had up to 40 people out this year, new people doing audax, more kids doing track, circuit and cycloX racing than I can remember and so on.

    So I don't know - does it matter that cycling is becoming more a sport for the 30 plus age group and their own kids ? I never raced a bike until my mid 30s - I don't see my racing as any less important for the sport than a 22 year old - OK the 22 year old might go on and be a decent rider but the older rider may have kids to introduce to the sport and is more likely (in my experience) to put something back organising events. Just judging by the amount of people I see out cycling is on the up - it'd be nice to have more young riders too but so long as people are riding and racing the sport is healthy however old they are.

    it's a hard life if you don't weaken.
  • oldwelshmanoldwelshman Posts: 4,733
    Cycling is also one of the sport at which you can remain very competative at an older age.
    I am 48 and still competative on track and road, obviously not as good as 23 tears ago but can staill compete agianst younger cyclists.
    This is not possible in most sports.
    I played rigby and as a back your not going to compete at high level past 33, similar for football.
    I did squash and knees got knackered at about 45 and I was still trying to be competative but knees said no, so went back to cycling after 23 years off and I am as fit as I have ever been and knees ok.
    As Tom said if older guys are stil competative then their offspring may take it up also.
    We definately need more velodromes to introduce youngsters to cycling as they will progress to road cycling also.
    The closed circuit racing such as Hillingdon will also encourage them and in a safe environment.
  • ProssPross Posts: 29,627
    The above might be just my experience what do you guys think? is there a danger of cycling dying due to the fact that there are not enough youngsters racing?

    Got loads of youngsters in our club, over half the field in the U16, U12 and U10 cyclo cross fields locally most weeks but don't know how many of them 'road' race. Obviously at that age it is all closed circuit stuff. It seems to be the junior category where there are less whereas when I started there were a load of us.
  • oldwelshmanoldwelshman Posts: 4,733
    LVRC yes!!
    Just got back from \KVRC track champs, gold in points, silver in sprint and silver in team pursuit my season has now been worth it :D
  • Well done Welshman. You must have been close to winning the overall?
    Jim
  • oldwelshmanoldwelshman Posts: 4,733
    edited November 2009
    JimMoff wrote:
    Well done Welshman. You must have been close to winning the overall?
    Jim
    Hi JIm :D
    Yes I was one point away.
    In the last race, scratch, Steve Clayton of Planet X knew he had to finish just infront of me for overall so he marked me all race, every break I tried.
    Steve is a class rider and very experienced so I am honoured to have been marked by such a rider :D He is nice bloke also and we have trained together a few times in last few weeks.
    Martin Webster lapped the field as lots of riders would not work to close gap. Then for the sprint Steve led out, Webster on his wheel to his right, as I went round Webster took me up off the sprnters line and I had to kick back go below then round Steve.
    Martin told me he was "helping" Steve which was a bit naughty as he should not have been in the sprint as he had already won!! So steve got silver me brinze and I missed overall by one point by width of tye in te sprint final, and in the scratch :D
    I put a pic of the photo finish in the track section.
  • ProssPross Posts: 29,627
    Well done, had hoped to get over to watch but couldn't make it.
  • Dai

    Good ride and shame only 1 point from a jersey. At least you are the National points champion :D

    Jim
  • Congratulations old welsh bloke. Was it in Manchester? I went up with our club a couple of weeks ago....fantastic.
  • oldwelshmanoldwelshman Posts: 4,733
    No the LVRC is at Newport.
    This year think the British is at Newport, Europeans at Manchester and Worlds at Portugal, so I better start saving :D
  • Picking up on Pocket Rocket point about there not being enough younger riders road racing ---- yes your right and it is not helped by the fact that senior riders are allowed to use bigger gears when competing against them in races.

    What ever happened to resricted gear road racing for all rides ie a 3/J race where all riders were resricted to using a 52x15 gear or 93inches.!?

    Back to topic
    Anyway YES LVRC if you are living in the South East but in some areas of the country this league is not so strong. And some old timers might find that they have to train even harder than they used to when they were 20 to keep up with the pace of some of the LVRC events. Needless to say though they are very well organised and worth a punt if your looking to re-launch past glory :lol:

    Personally I believe there is a big gap in the market for league type road racing and I believe there should be a weight related league --- A bit like horse racing all cyclist would be weighed with there bikes and weight added to each rider so that all riders weighed the same. :shock: well it's a thought. :lol:
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