Pedalling technique

popstar

As being an ex-roadie, would like to go in right direction to MTB skillz* 
I have been buffled by flat non fix pedals, as I have been taught to fix my feet to pedals in order to pedal correct completing the whole pulling-pushing circle'
Guess MTB has different concept? Taking into account that there are jumps etc involved, maybe this is the reason or am again wrong? 
Plz those in the know, give newbie right direction. 

canada16

Its just preference really.

Some MTB'S have clips and some have flats.

I like flats as I like to swing my feet in the air before I crash :shock:

Its all up to you.

If you are new to the trails, i would use flats at first and once you become more confident with you jumping ect.. then switch.

Anonymous

Or don't switch. Plenty of MTBers don't get on with SPDs. (but ssssh, saying that on this forum tends to stir up a hornet's nest of hardcore SPD defenders )

.blitz

SPDs are great if you ride the kind of terrain that allows you to spin nice round circles and you only have to unclip once every three hours. But on nadgery, gnarly, stop-start techy stuff they are a PITA.

llamafarmer

Here we go again.

If you're used to riding SPDs then get some on your mountain bike mate, they're great but people either love them or hate them.... as you can see.

stubs

If you want to try SPD get some cheap Shimano M520 s from Chainreaction or the like back off the spring tension with the little screw and give it a go

Anonymous

OH god, here we go :roll:

.blitz

yeehaamcgee wrote:

OH god, here we go :roll:

What do you think about SPDs on hardtails? Or flats on FS bikes?

Anonymous

AAAAARGH

This is why we don't want roadies in this part of the forum, you'll just start trouble, I swear it

popstar

Well, my intention was not to start the war of words between fix and non fix* but actually to see if there is a concept behind the certain technique. 
As for fixed feet pedalling, it gives me more torque through push-pull circle, also it gives more edge (while in air) 
in lifting-controlling back end balance. I guess that flat pedals are better for random fun-ride, and some funky extreme rather than hill climbing. As mentioned before, think it's everyone's prefference, but then would like to see opinion of those who did ride both fixed and non fix pedals*
Why do people deffending so fiercely flat pedals? Explain please what's advantage of them? 

Anonymous

It's just a tongue in cheek bit of silliness, don't worry.

Anyway, I rode SPDs for a while several years ago, and decided to go back to flats, I can't really see any real advantage to SPDs unless you're actually competing, and need every mill;isecond advantage possible.
With decent flat pedals, and grippy shoes, I find I actually have more control (yes, you read that right ) over the bike than with SPDs.
See, clipless pedals have a degree of float built into them, and if I was to use my feet to rotate the bike, I'd unclip. On flat pedals, I can use the sole of my feet to move the back end of the bike in the air, or when sliding into corners and so on.

Also, I found that the extra power I could get from SPDs was rarely usable, because the only time I could have really done with that power, the trail was so steep, that tyre-traction was the limiting factor anyway.

Flat pedals will allow you to rotate the cranks through over 180 degrees with each foot, the only point you're missing out is thelast two tirds or so of rotation.


BUT
This is comnig from someone who used SPDs for a while, and found them pointless.
Other people swear by them, and will have different opinions.

(trouble on this place is people are always insistent that their view, alone, is the correct one)

robertpb

There will always be advantages on both sides, but with modern flat pedals and sticky soled shoes the difference in output is not that much.

You still scrape the pedal back up with flats, you just have to do it slightly differently to SPD's.

As yeehaamcgee has pointed out it's a loss of traction on steep hills or the bars trying to go over your head, that comes first.

Of course the biggest advantage of flats is being able to stand on the crossbar, going downhill singing " raindrops keep falling on my head "

.blitz

yeehaamcgee wrote:

trouble on this place is people are always insistent that their view, alone, is the correct one

Everyone's entitled to their own opinion but some are more informed than others

That aside, everybody knows a 29" HT singlespeed with a flat pedal on one side and a SPD on the other is the future of MTBing*

*joke, obv.

popstar

Thank you on fully detailed through view, it does explain a lot of things to me. Seems flat pedals are the way to go for maximum fun. Although could you-anyone recommend flats with that revolutionary grip as some peeps say similar to clip pedals?
In my younger years, my trainer did well, to break my habits of just pushing on pedals, now am screwed with that pulling technique complex lol, guess to enjoy MTB is all about: - grab hard your grips, and boy do you run on those pedals! Pulling technique, what pulling technique?

Anonymous

.blitz wrote:

]Everyone's entitled to their own opinion but some are more informed than others

NO THEY'RE NOT, I AM ALWAYS RIGHT

.blitz

yeehaamcgee wrote:

.blitz wrote:

]Everyone's entitled to their own opinion but some are more informed than others

NO THEY'RE NOT, I AM ALWAYS RIGHT

Anonymous

Well, I've always found DMR V8 -style pedals to be really grippy, when combined with Vans waffle tread shoes.
Alternatively, tons of people swear by impact 5:10 shoes.

It's worth bearing in mind, that the very cheap DMR copies use slightly thicker pins, than the allen grub-screws on real DMRs. I find that those grub screws contribute a great deal to grip.
However, on some of the cheaper pedals, you can replace the pins with the grub screws anyway.

.blitz

popstar wrote:

Thank you on fully detailed through view

Bet you're glad you asked eh?

popstar wrote:

Although could you-anyone recommend flats with that revolutionary grip as some peeps say similar to clip pedals?

Kona Wah-Wahs are pretty good with AM40 or 5.10 shoes. Alternatively you could stick with what you're familiar with and use MP66 shoes with SH56 multi-release cleats.

mac_man

I'm a returning noob to the MTB scene but have discovered one thing about shoes.... in the dry there's not much difference between trainers and proper flat MTB shoes. But when the going gets muddy your trainers will slip like a bugger.

Thats just my experience....

I'm now using some slightly better shoes which also have padding on the ankle as well. Ideally you want some shoes that will grip onto the pins that most pedals have.

You won't have this prob with clip ins... so you might want to keep with them.

popstar

Will give some lurking on google reviews about DMR V8 vs Kona wah-wah, and 5.10 I heard about them from other topics too

MacAndCheese

I'm going to buck the trend and say I LIKE BOTH :shock: , flats and spd's. Always used to ride flats, then I got into SPDs which still use the most, but if doing anything really techincal or more 'extreme'(I hate that word) I dig out the old V8s and Vans.

.blitz

MacAndCheese wrote:

I'm going to buck the trend and say I LIKE BOTH

There's always one

robertpb

MG1's and 5:10's what more can I say.

Northwind

As far as the correct pedalling action goes... On rough ground, it's more important to keep your feet on the pedals than it is to spin perfect circles, so keeping a little weight on the back pedal does wonders. On flat stuff, obviously you can't pull up with the back foot but you can still lift up- you just have to make sure you don't lift fast enough to actually lift right off the pedal. Unweighting the back pedal can increase the effectiveness of your downstroke.

The big difference is that SPDs force you into a perfect spin, which can cover up a bit of bad technique, whereas to spin well on flats you need good technique. That's a disadvantage of flats really but it can be got around just with practice. Oh, and try to avoid the "mash the front pedal", the technique I was taught is to "paw the ground like a bull"- push down then back, not just down.

Doing all this gives you probably 9/10ths of the efficiency benefits of SPDs- some studies have shown that pulling up really adds very little power, and that most of the benefit of pulling up on a back SPD is to unweight the pedal rather than adding power. You can still do that with flats, it's just tricky.

jinnorfolk

I keep reading about spd which I assume are the pedals that need special shoes

Yes I am new to mtb and cycling in general.

And Flats which I assume are pedals with no attachment.

But what about toe clips/straps they came with my Kona Blast and I have been using them in thetford.

I dont see much mention of them on this forum though. I assumed they were a sort of half way house

stubs

The main advantage of flats is all those cool scabs and scars on your shins from all the times you miss the pedals my shins look like someone has been playing noughts and crosses on them with a stanley knife

Anonymous

jinnorfolk wrote:

I keep reading about spd which I assume are the pedals that need special shoes

Yes I am new to mtb and cycling in general.

And Flats which I assume are pedals with no attachment.

But what about toe clips/straps they came with my Kona Blast and I have been using them in thetford.

I dont see much mention of them on this forum though. I assumed they were a sort of half way house

Yep, SPDs (or spuds) are Shimano's system of a pedal with a clip, and shoes with a "cleat" that click into them.
Flats are like the old BMX style pedals, usual;ly have spikes to hold your foot in place.

Toe clips & straps, well, I always thought they were absolutely lethal on mountain bikes.
You're meant to put your foot in them, then do the straps up tight, binding your foot to the pedal. This means to unmount, you have to reach down and undo the strap again.
Bugger that for a game of soldiers.

Druid \'64

I got clips like the ones below and i find them brilliant, you're not locked to the bike, your feet are always in the correct position and you can wear any shoes. I had mine years ago and the only thing i might use instead are Power straps

Anonymous

but you have to turn your pedal over 180 degreed every time you want to put your foot in.

I appreciate that you like them, but personally, I can't see any redeeming features in either of those, at all.

Druid \'64

honestly............. I am going to get the powergrips cos the hard ones are a pain in the arse to get back into (fliping them 180) that way when i pull out there's less hassle. i can just put my foot ON the peddel and use them like flats till i get a chance to "clip in".

BUT

Each to their own, as long as your happy and comfortable 8)

Anonymous

What's the advantage of them though?