Calling LCD TV Geeks

il_principe

DDD you are preaching to the converted! I'm running a Marantz CD player through Rotel Pre & Power amps, bi wired into a pair of Acoustic Energy floorstanders, as well as a Marantz AV amp with Morduant Short rears (powered by another Rotel Power Amp) and an AE centre. The kit is all quite old now, but the sound is fab. Just want to upgrade the AV amp to something that is HDMI capable. Ideally I want to run the front speakers via a pre out on the Av amp so they work for Stereo and Surround. No way am i running my cd etc through AV. Prob is that so few AV receivers seem to have multiple "pre out' channels. If any one can point me in the direction of one I'd be most grateful!

DonDaddyD

Il Principe wrote:

DDD you are preaching to the converted! I'm running a Marantz CD player through Rotel Pre & Power amps, bi wired into a pair of Acoustic Energy floorstanders

I love it when you talk dirty.... ,

I've got the joy of rebuilding my set. I'm starting with a pair of TDL RTL 3 speakers. Old, but highly sort after in their day. So good my Dad bought 2 pairs, one was the original and the second were the special edition version.

I've had my eye on the originals for possibly a decade.

But let me get this straight, you've got four amps? Two seperate pre/power amp combos... ye gwads man where do you live, a club? Really you should be able to run all four speakers through one amp combo... I mean how big is this room, is it outside? (Then there is the AV amp - presumably for the Home Cinema and not the CD's).

Can't help with the AV conudrum, I wouldn't use it for my CD's either...

My Dad did toy with the idea of a sub that doubled as a coffee table, was a couple grand though... didn't work out.

_Brun_

I need one of these.

Would also need a strategically placed shelf above the toilet.

DonDaddyD

_Brun_ wrote:

I need one of these.

Would also need a strategically placed shelf above the toilet.

I don't care what anyone says that's from Star Trek.... :shock:

Agent57

DonDaddyD wrote:

_Brun_ wrote:

I need one of these.

Would also need a strategically placed shelf above the toilet.

I don't care what anyone says that's from Star Trek.... :shock:

You say that like it's a bad thing... :?

spasypaddy

im getting one of these in the next couple of weeks (hopefully this one)
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Toshiba-37XV635 ... B00220TIY0
ive spent along time choosing it

its also available at dixons for the same price and john lewis stock is so will price match it saving yourself £200 from john lewis

bill_gates

apreading wrote:

Piece of advice - ALWAYS buy your TV from John Lewis!

I disagree, what about the local dealer whether it be a Sony Centre or Panasonic shop which are often run by a franchisee?

That's like saying always buy your bike from Halfords. :oops:

Mr John Lewis made his money years ago and is now a PLC, there are high-street shops that are often local small business that need a piece of the green.

alfablue

Bill Gates wrote:

apreading wrote:

Piece of advice - ALWAYS buy your TV from John Lewis!

I disagree, what about the local dealer whether it be a Sony Centre or Panasonic shop which are often run by a franchisee?

That's like saying always buy your bike from Halfords. :oops:

Mr John Lewis made his money years ago and is now a PLC, there are high-street shops that are often local small business that need a piece of the green.

You are so wrong, John Lewis is a PLC, but all the shares are held in trust for its employees, known as Partners. It is a wonderful, and perhaps the best, example of a worker cooperative. So buying there is the ultimate way to help the "small guy" - the worker!

And you get a 5 year warranty (does Halfords do that?)

And you get great service.

roger_merriman

alfablue wrote:

Bill Gates wrote:

apreading wrote:

Piece of advice - ALWAYS buy your TV from John Lewis!

I disagree, what about the local dealer whether it be a Sony Centre or Panasonic shop which are often run by a franchisee?

That's like saying always buy your bike from Halfords. :oops:

Mr John Lewis made his money years ago and is now a PLC, there are high-street shops that are often local small business that need a piece of the green.

You are so wrong, John Lewis is a PLC, but all the shares are held in trust for its employees, known as Partners. It is a wonderful, and perhaps the best, example of a worker cooperative. So buying there is the ultimate way to help the "small guy" - the worker!

And you get a 5 year warranty (does Halfords do that?)

And you get great service.

I do like john lewis though worth noting that even a 5 year warranty is less than the legal right any way, which is 7 years the problem is doing it your self is hassel, bucket loads of it. but if you have the time/are minded it's there.

alfablue

I think the EU law is for 6 years, but it is really about manufacturers having liability for their products for 6 years. Unlike a JL repair or replace warranty, the legal "warranty" may at best, compensate you for the cost of repair or replacement, less the amount of money that reflects the "enjoyment" you have already had with the product. So if a TV might reasonably last 6 years and fails after 3 you might have a case for a 50% refund.

I think the JL warranty is insurance based.

bill_gates

alfablue wrote:

And you get great service.

Thats probably where I have my beef with Lewis's. The last two things I bought from there failed within the first year and I'm glad I had a 2yr guarantee at the time. These were supposed 'premium goods' but I could have got cheaper elsewhere.

I expect thats why they have to offer extended warranties and use that as a sales tactic as the products they sell seem to be sub-standard.

I suppose it is good to help the employees but all small retailers also have staff who need wages as well. Spread the wealth. John Lewis got their break decades ago.

alfablue

Are you seriously suggesting JL as a rule, sell substandard products?????????????

Were these branded or own brand?

If branded, are you suggesting they are of lower quality than the same branded products you could buy elsewhere?

Honestly, I really don't think there is anything dodgy like this going on at JL, maybe you were unlucky, maybe you chose badly, but can you really diss the whole organisation over two failed products?

bill_gates

alfablue wrote:

but can you really diss the whole organisation over two failed products?

That's not my argument, just highlighting my own experiences on product quality from the John Lewis Group.

My original point was that going into a huge corporation like JL and spending money that the mark-up could help to prop up other small business in the local community is a better ethos.

I'm quite proud that cyclists have the 'support the LBS' ethos, I try to apply that to the majority of my purchases whether it be a new car, telly or a £30 set of lights for my bike.

alfablue

Look, I tend to agree with you on the support the LBS ethos, just I think JL is an exception to the usual image of the big bad corporation. You will understand I am pretty keen on the idea of worker cooperatives, and I will pay a premium knowing that the workers benefit, rather than a small (or large) business and/or the share holders benefit whilst employees are on minimum wage. How do your LBS's perform in terms of staff pay and conditions? I haven't got a clue about mine. There are a few bike shop cooperatives around, I suppose the best known would be EBC.

Sorry, this has gone well OT.

bill_gates

alfablue wrote:

How do your LBS's perform in terms of staff pay and conditions?

That's something I don't know that much about, I don't know anyone who works in JL to make comparison.

At my LBS, I know their names and they know mine. They are the same folk every-time I go in. They give me good discounts and there products and knowledge are exceptional. I'm sure I could even get a credit account with them if I so desired. I also expect that the owner of the shop has great staff as he is likely to be looking after them in terms of providing a good working environment and paying them a satisfactorily suitable wage.

I bought my car from the local dealer about 2m from my house, I travelled about 7m to get my telly and the same for my bike(s), all bought from business owned, established and HQ'd in my locale. I hope they make good money and the profits not only reward the staff for hard work and great service but also the owner for taking the risk in the first instance to establish the business. Whether this is thousands every year for a nice living or just enough to allow him to get to his Sunday ride with a decent pair of shorts, I'm not bothered, as long as it stays local.

Couldn't tell you who owns Halfords or John Lewis PLC but I'm sure the top man drives a rather expensive motor and is what is known in the modern world as a 'fat-cat'.

alfablue

The employees own JL.

I agree with the "buy local" mantra, however, some of my local businesses are absolute rogues to their staff. You may be supporting a local business with a fat cat / stalinist boss. But hey, at least it is a local rogue!

Headhuunter

DonDaddyD wrote:

nicklouse wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

Plasma has improved, however don't get one, the image still sticks to the screen and regardless of the whole "Plasma better than LCD" at big inches i.e. bigger than 37/42inch. The image can still stick to the screen and it's blurry.

sorry total crap.

What part?

Plasma screens are susceptible to screen burn-in and image retention. FACT.

Plasma screens have better contrasts ratios (deeper blacks) than LCD screens. Above certain sizes the Plasma screen will still show blacks as black whereas an LCD screen will start to look grey. Fact.

The whole plasma screen image (as a whole) still looks blurry to me, this is a subjective opinion, so it's not fair to dismiss it as 'crap'. You can however disagree with it.

Yes, I'd heard that plasmas are much more susceptible to image burn, apparently it's not uncommon for channel logos in the corner of the screen to end up burned onto plasma screens. They're also hugely energy innefiicient and put out a lot of heat, so expect larger leccy bills.

Headhuunter

apreading wrote:

Piece of advice - ALWAYS buy your TV from John Lewis.

They give you a FREE 5 year guarantee and will price match any bricks an mortar store that has it in stock. Now you may not realise that many of the online retailers have a high street shop somewhere in the country - John Lewis will send someone to check from a local branch and hey presto - you get your TV at the cheapest price and a free 5 year guarantee, along with the best replacement policy going for light leakage/dead pixels etc.

Also I think they will refund the difference if you find it cheaper within 30 days too - so if you see someone even cheaper after you bought it, go back to them.

Oh and go for Panasonic or Sony - dont bother with the rest if you want the best!

I agree that Sony and Panasonic have consistently been rated as some of the best LCD screen producers. Certainly when I did my research a couple of years ago, I bought a Sony, most review sites and mags recommended either Panasonic or Sony with very few exceptions. Also true that John Lewis offer a free 5 year guarantee, but they will not complete on price with the net and in the end I bought my Sony at a considerably cheaper price from Amazon and got a 3 year guarantee thrown in anyway.

DonDaddyD

Headhuunter wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

nicklouse wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

Plasma has improved, however don't get one, the image still sticks to the screen and regardless of the whole "Plasma better than LCD" at big inches i.e. bigger than 37/42inch. The image can still stick to the screen and it's blurry.

sorry total crap.

What part?

Plasma screens are susceptible to screen burn-in and image retention. FACT.

Plasma screens have better contrasts ratios (deeper blacks) than LCD screens. Above certain sizes the Plasma screen will still show blacks as black whereas an LCD screen will start to look grey. Fact.

The whole plasma screen image (as a whole) still looks blurry to me, this is a subjective opinion, so it's not fair to dismiss it as 'crap'. You can however disagree with it.

Yes, I'd heard that plasmas are much more susceptible to image burn, apparently it's not uncommon for channel logos in the corner of the screen to end up burned onto plasma screens. They're also hugely energy innefiicient and put out a lot of heat, so expect larger leccy bills.

Not just that, but they are bigger and heavier than LCD screens (they need to have a glass panel to hold in the gas that helps form the image).

Also what I don't like (image retention) is when you change there is a few seconds of last channel/new channel mix on the screen.

On LCD's

I'm a serious Samsung man, my phone, camera and TV are Samsung and if I didn't build my PC as a hobby, that would have probably been Samsung too (if they made PC's I don't know).

It's not just the picture quality though, I like the functionality and easily navigated menu, set up and connectivity. If not for those things I'd probably go for a Hitachi, which has a better reputation in other countries (like America) than over here but uses the Samsung panel (screen). If not that then I would buy some unknown German/Asian TV (with good build quality) that has awesome picture quality but again unheard of here.

I'm like that with all items I buy, I bought a Seat Ibiza as it has VW build quality and a VW engine without the VW price

I often buy the brand quality not the brand.

On John Lewis and Local shops/internet/Richer Sounds

John Lewis is a brilliant example of a worker cooperative organisation.

I'm all for supporting the little guy, sole trader.

I would not put either ahead of supporting my pocket. Cheapest most reliable place wins and that's usually online (Often Amazon).

The TV will likely come with it's own guarantee and the guarantee that it's got a decent (good) build quality. (I've known TV's to last more than 10yrs).

il_principe

JL will get my business regardless, however my exp on Sun left much to be desired! The salesman was practically playing with himself over the Sammy TV's, banging on about LED etc - problem was that most of what he said was total crap (and he had nasty breath). I did get them to set up the Philips for me to see though and I'm sorry DDD but it kicked the crap out of Sammy, i get that JL is not the best of places to test but still having played around with the settings i was v impressed with the Philips. I do like JL though for their guarantee and prices seem good.


AV amp wise I reckon I'll go for another Marantz, the SR5003 in stock locally so I'll go and look.

@Greg, that sub looks like a good bet, cheers.

greg66_tri_v2.0

Il Principe wrote:

but it licked the crap out of Sammy

Ummmm. Nice image. :shock:

il_principe

Greg66 wrote:

Il Principe wrote:

but it licked the crap out of Sammy

Ummmm. Nice image. :shock:

Doh.

Edited.

CiB

Slightly OT but hey - so is half the thread.

Freeview will start to carry HD programming from December initially in the NW and soon after from Crystal Palace, with more being added in 2010. The addition of HD to the Freeview MUX will roughly follow analogue switch-off, for obvious reasons.

Sony will be launching a range of FV HD TVs in November, so if anyone's planning to buy HD but doesn't want to or can't go down the Sky / Freesat / cable route, this the solution.

bill_gates

LED televisions seem to be creeping into the marketplace and I understand that Samsung already have some of these available for purchase.

il_principe

Bill Gates wrote:

LED televisions seem to be creeping into the marketplace and I understand that Samsung already have some of these available for purchase.

Yep, saw one on Sun from their new range. Underwhelmed.

Yahraas

I'm also on the lookout for a new TV to showcase downloaded files via my popcorn hour and my kids Wii. I printed out some details of the Tosh 37V635DB and the Pana TX-L37S10B and took them down to JL in Canary Square. The chap in there was very helpful and suggested the pana would be the better set.

Upon looking the stock up he discovered that JL have a special on the Pana at the moment and are selling it at £489 (Amazon is £599).

Being a measly prol I did want a 42 plasma, but when I told him the size of the space (recess 110cms wide) we advised that a 37 would be a better bet.

Panasonic do do a 37 plasma, but the salesman said that a full HD LCD would be a better buy.

The only thing that is putting me off buying a new TV is this. I have a 32 inch Loewe vitros that is working fine. 75% of the content I watch is SD content through cable and I haven't yet seen a HD TV that works well with SD content.

bill_gates

Yahraas wrote:

The only thing that is putting me off buying a new TV is this. I have a 32 inch Loewe vitros that is working fine. 75% of the content I watch is SD content through cable and I haven't yet seen a HD TV that works well with SD content.

I have a Loewe in my second room which has only got Sky+ SD as an input and the picture from it is fantastic, it genuinely is that good that I've not bothered to get a second multi-room HD card (extra £10 a month from Sky).

I often find that both my telly's display SD that well that I often don't know whether I'm watching the HD variant of the channel anyway although this years Le Tour on Eurosport's 'Native HD' was truely spectacular.

The sound from the HD versions of Sky's channels is certainly crisper.