09 ultegra or 2010 105??

Gogadjetgo

this may be a no brainer for the ultegra......but i was wondering what the differances are? im aware that the new 105 is basicly 2005's Dura Ace, so what year's dura ace is the 09 ultegra?
looking to buy ether the 2010 trek 2.3 or an 09 1.9

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated. both bikes are roughly the same price from different shops.

Cheers, P.S im upgrading from an ambrosio frame with a sora groupset.

jrab

Shimano are launching a new Ultegra which looks very similar to '09 Dura-Ace with hidden cables etc, but I haven't heard about major 2010 upgrades for 105.

As far as I can see, the 1.9 has full 2009 Ultegra, the 2.3 has full 2009-spec 105 with Ultegra rear mech. Finishing kit and wheels seem to be the same, major difference is the 2.3 seems to have carbon stays.

Generally, not much between Ultegra and 105 - little bit lighter, little bit slicker shifting. From my experience (I've ridden the Trek 1.9 and have 105 on my bike), biggest difference seems to be the brakes - Ultegra quite a bit sharper and better feeling, easier to modulate.

For same price, choice seems to be slightly better group or carbon stays. Up to you - eeny-meeny-miney..?!

Richard

Gogadjetgo

thanks for the reply mate.
only thing ive never found out bout my bike is what the seat stays are and what the benifits of them being carbon would be? the 2010 2.3 if full 105, no rear ultegra mech, a price hike of about £150 for a down grade and new paint job!
Cheers

Speed_King

i USE THE 2010 105'S ON MY TARMAC ELITE AND THEY ARE INDEED LAST YEARS ULTEGRA, AS CONFIRMED BY A GUY I KNOW AT SPECIALLIZED, AM LOOKING FORWARD TO THE NEW DURA-ACE THOUGH, WITH THE HIDDEN CABLES ETC SHOULD BE VERY COOL! TRUST ME GOGADJETGO THIS ISNT A DOWNGRADE MATE MORE LIKE A SWEETER MOVE SIDEWAYS, IT RUNS AS SMOOTHLY AND IS AS EFFICIANT AS LAST YEARS ULTEGRA WHICH I HAD ON LAST YEARS TARMAC COMP.
SEATSTAYS BTW ARE TO RE-ENFORCE THE REAR TRIANGLE THROUGH THE DRIVE SYSTEM AND BEING CARBON FIBRE IT MAKES IT LIGHTER.
HOPE THIS HELPS?

ps: Jrab i also noticed the the sharpness in the ultegra braking but i think that shimano have made the 2010 105's easier to modulate this year as i am finding out

Caligari_uk

I was also on the verge of buying a 1.7 or 1.9 (both 2009) a few weeks ago, but unfortunately they no longer had my size.

Have you managed to test out the 2010 versions, Gadget? I've seen pics of them on the All-Terrain website, and I'm not overly keen on the white and platinum paint jobs. The 2010 Trek Madone 4.5 looks rather 'yummy', though.

I didn't realise that the 2010 105s were the 2009 Ultregas, either - is that really the case?

jrab

Carbon rear stays in theory allow the manufacturer to produce complex shapes, use more material at the sides of the stays and lay-up the fibre directions to increase lateral stiffness (better power transmission) while allowing flexibility vertically to make the ride smoother. Not necessarily lighter. Same applies to carbon frames.

Aluminium frames can have profiled hydroformed stays which are specially shaped to serve the same purpose (eg Cannondale Synapse). The Trek frame uses lots of hydroforming too.

As with all things, appearances can be deceptive - a very good all-aluminium frame will ride and handle better than a poor alu/carbon frame where the carbon is there for showroom / marketing appeal..... Also have the issue of how well the carbon section is integrated into the aluminium main triangle - if this is not done well it can add weight and affect performance rather than offer any benefit. I would trust Trek to do a good job though.

As far as I can tell from Shimano website, "2010" 105 group is still the 5600-series unchanged from "2009" spec. Each upgrade tends to use design concepts and technology trickled down from the higher groups, but not the actual components. Shimano's upgrade from 5500-series to 5600-series 105 used features of 6600-series Ultegra, which in turn used features of 7800-series Dura-Ace. New 6700-series Ultegra uses features of 7900-series Dura-Ace. So 5600 105 is generally similar to 7800 Dura-Ace, except D-A will still use better materials so will still be lighter & slicker.

To answer the original question, Ultegra (slightly) better than 105, Trek 2.3 frame likely better than 1.9. Better frame usually the wise choice - it will still be there after the 105 parts have worn out and been replaced by Ultegra...!

Richard

Gogadjetgo

caligari........ive not tried one yet, shop said they wont have one to test till March, so thats pretty usless! i to am not sure of the paint job on the 2.3...but im sur eid get over it if it performed.

Speed King....cheers for the reply. im liking the sounds of the 105

jrab..... so the only differance your saying they have made to 105 is paint it black? think ive got my head around the series numbers!

weepiglet

I agree with JRAB!

I have a 1.9 which I got about 3 months ago and am very very happy with it. I am presuming it has the 09 Ultegra on it with which I am very happy although I have to say if I had the opportunity to get a better frame with what is essentially the same mechs then it is a no brainer!

The issue with brakes wouldn't be such an issue for me as I wouldn't be hurtling down mountains at breakneck speeds so why bother.....do you have ventilated discs on your car?

holybinch

weepiglet wrote:

The issue with brakes wouldn't be such an issue for me as I wouldn't be hurtling down mountains at breakneck speeds so why bother.....do you have ventilated discs on your car?

Err, riding in the wet maybe?

jrab

Gogadjetgo - yep, 105 just painted black.... Also do a titanium-coloured version, I have chainset on my BH. Black looks good on the right bike but will scratch easily, esp cranks.

Series numbers basically :-
7xxx - Dura-Ace
6xxx - Ultegra
5xxx - 105
4xxx - Tiagra
3xxx - Sora
2xxx - "cheap 'n' nasty"
Second digit defines the "generation". Don't mean to sound like a spotter!

Better brakes will always make a difference, even on the flat - tight corner on a road you don't know, numpty in car cutting you up, better control in slippery / wet conditions. Easy to upgrade brakes though, lots of aftermarket stuff. ( I do have vented discs, standard fit on my car - not drilled or grooved though.)

Richard.