EPO microdosing.

aurelio_-_banned

Paper showing that once a high level of blood haemoglobin has been established via the use of high-level doses of Epo, this level can be maintained via microdosing.

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The effects of microdose recombinant human erythropoietin regimens in athletes

This study appraised the veracity of claims that athletes can evade doping controls by injecting microdoses of recombinant human erythropoietin (rHuEPO), which rapidly disappear from the circulation. We confirmed that microdosing can reduce the window of detection to as little as 12-18 hours post-injection, suggesting that authorities must adopt appropriate counter measures.

As expected high dose rHuEPO treatment rapidly elevated Hb concentrations within ~2 weeks (140 to 166 g/L; 148 to 174 g/L; subjects 1 and 2, respectively). We found that it was possible to maintain elevated Hb values using microdoses of rHuEPO. After 3 weeks of the microdose regimen Hb concentrations were still 164 g/L and 170 g/L respectively (and 164 g/L and 162 g/L 1 week after all injections ceased).

...Our results show that it is conceivable for athletes to maintain illicit rHuEPO doping even during multiday endurance events when competitors may be tested at the end of each day (ie at 24 hour intervals).

http://www.haematologica.org/cgi/reprint/91/8/1143

So much for microdosing not being worthwhile as it only gives a small increase in blood haemoglobin! It seems that all you need to do is establish your 'normal parameters' with high doses of Epo and then use micro-doses to maintain that level.

fast as fupp

where can i get some?

iainf72

fast as fupp wrote:

where can i get some?

OTC in Switzerland

dave_1

aurelio wrote:

Paper showing that once a high level of blood haemoglobin has been established via the use of high-level doses of Epo, this level can be maintained via microdosing.

---

The effects of microdose recombinant human erythropoietin regimens in athletes

This study appraised the veracity of claims that athletes can evade doping controls by injecting microdoses of recombinant human erythropoietin (rHuEPO), which rapidly disappear from the circulation. We confirmed that microdosing can reduce the window of detection to as little as 12-18 hours post-injection, suggesting that authorities must adopt appropriate counter measures.

As expected high dose rHuEPO treatment rapidly elevated Hb concentrations within ~2 weeks (140 to 166 g/L; 148 to 174 g/L; subjects 1 and 2, respectively). We found that it was possible to maintain elevated Hb values using microdoses of rHuEPO. After 3 weeks of the microdose regimen Hb concentrations were still 164 g/L and 170 g/L respectively (and 164 g/L and 162 g/L 1 week after all injections ceased).

...Our results show that it is conceivable for athletes to maintain illicit rHuEPO doping even during multiday endurance events when competitors may be tested at the end of each day (ie at 24 hour intervals).

http://www.haematologica.org/cgi/reprint/91/8/1143

So much for microdosing not being worthwhile as it only gives a small increase in blood haemoglobin! It seems that all you need to do is establish your 'normal parameters' with high doses of Epo and then use micro-doses to maintain that level.

So they'd have to micro dose all year every week as the passport would catch them otherwise as they drop off the false parameter? Logic suggests they must keep that act up for years on end to avoid being caught.

Where are you on Wiggins? A doper? Or proof that one doesn't need to stand on final GC podium at first TDF attempt to avoid suspicion?

deal

Dave_1 wrote:

So they'd have to micro dose all year every week as the passport would catch them otherwise as they drop off the false parameter? Logic suggests they must keep that act up for years on end to avoid being caught.

Ricco managed to fool the uci into beleiving he had a naturally high haematocrit, presumably this was artifically maintained over a lengthy period.

aurelio_-_banned

Dave_1 wrote:

So they'd have to micro dose all year every week as the passport would catch them otherwise as they drop off the false parameter? Logic suggests they must keep that act up for years on end to avoid being caught.

I am sure that haemocrit levels can vary across quite a wide range and still be held to be within 'normal parameters'. If they get a bit high they could always claim they had been doing 'altitude training' and if they get a bit low claim that they were tired, suffering from anaemia and so on.

Dave_1 wrote:

Where are you on Wiggins? A doper? Or proof that one doesn't need to stand on final GC podium at first TDF attempt to avoid suspicion?

It's far too early to make any conclusions, given that the racing has been so low-key so far that even 'The French' have been winning stages. (Twenty-six riders are still within 5 minutes of the yellow jersey!) Lets see what happens on Mt. Ventoux.

Kléber

Sadly most academic research is years behind the dopers. A paper is only confirming what some riders (and runners, swimmers, rowers etc) have been doing for many years.

For sometime there were papers suggesting that EPO abuse would be bad for athletes as the thick blood would be so hard to pump around that riders would be slower. Meanwhile large Spaniards and small Italians were sailing up mountain passes or crushing their rivals in time trials.

fast as fupp

iainf72 wrote:

fast as fupp wrote:

where can i get some?

OTC in Switzerland

mail order?

Kléber

EPO is bad for your health. Here's what the team doctor probably fails to mention:
http://www.medpagetoday.com/ProductAler ... tions/5231

emadden

iainf72 wrote:

fast as fupp wrote:

where can i get some?

OTC in Switzerland

Not possible at all.

Maybe 10 years ago, but not anymore

drenkrom

fast as fupp wrote:

where can i get some?

Find out where the local haematologists go for a pint, pay up a few rounds. Done.

emadden

drenkrom wrote:

fast as fupp wrote:

where can i get some?

Find out where the local haematologists go for a pint, pay up a few rounds. Done.

I work in Zug, Switzerland and AMGENs international headquarters is next door. I remember two years ago on the morning that the Tour de Suisse was due to start I saw two Astana team cars parked outside the Amgen office...

In all honesty there is no way they were picking up "supplies", but I kinda wished I had my camera with me, would have made a funny picture....

GyatsoLa

Just before the last olympics here in Ireland a middle distance runner was caught with EPO he got by mail order from Brazil (he'd been monitored for quite a while due to suspicious competition patterns and jumps in performance). He confessed to doping. Then they tested the stuff he ordered and found out it was fake!

afx237vi

^ LOL, sounds similar to Richard Virenque's famous "time trial special" as given to him by Willy Voet.

In case you don't know, during the 1997 Tour, Virenque had heard about this mysterious new drug that some other teams were using for time trials. Virenque pestered Voet to give him the drug, but Voet was skeptical... he knew nothing about it. In the end, Voet gave in, got hold of the stuff and injected Virenque before the final TT.

Anyway, Virenque did the best TT of his life, finishing 2nd behind Jan Ullrich. Naturally, he was ecstatic and amazed by how good his "TT special" was... only, the one thing he didn't know was that Voet had injected him with a glucose solution instead. The power of the mind, eh?

Noodley

It's like Ron Weasley in the new Harry Potter movie

donrhummy

afx237vi wrote:

^ LOL, sounds similar to Richard Virenque's famous "time trial special" as given to him by Willy Voet.

In case you don't know, during the 1997 Tour, Virenque had heard about this mysterious new drug that some other teams were using for time trials. Virenque pestered Voet to give him the drug, but Voet was skeptical... he knew nothing about it. In the end, Voet gave in, got hold of the stuff and injected Virenque before the final TT.

Anyway, Virenque did the best TT of his life, finishing 2nd behind Jan Ullrich. Naturally, he was ecstatic and amazed by how good his "TT special" was... only, the one thing he didn't know was that Voet had injected him with a glucose solution instead. The power of the mind, eh?

Yes, assuming either one of them is telling the truth, which there is little evidence they've EVER done.

afx237vi

donrhummy wrote:

afx237vi wrote:

^ LOL, sounds similar to Richard Virenque's famous "time trial special" as given to him by Willy Voet.

In case you don't know, during the 1997 Tour, Virenque had heard about this mysterious new drug that some other teams were using for time trials. Virenque pestered Voet to give him the drug, but Voet was skeptical... he knew nothing about it. In the end, Voet gave in, got hold of the stuff and injected Virenque before the final TT.

Anyway, Virenque did the best TT of his life, finishing 2nd behind Jan Ullrich. Naturally, he was ecstatic and amazed by how good his "TT special" was... only, the one thing he didn't know was that Voet had injected him with a glucose solution instead. The power of the mind, eh?

Yes, assuming either one of them is telling the truth, which there is little evidence they've EVER done.

Well it was Voet who originally told the story in "Breaking the Chain". Not entirely sure what reason he would have for making that particular anecdote up :?:

Kléber

Danish rider Jesper Skibby also said that sometimes he'd get a saline injection from the team doctor yet he'd ride his socks off thinking he was supercharged that day.

andyp

Wasn't serial dope offender Dario Frigo arrested at Milan Malpensa once buying EPO he'd ordered from someone in Switzerland, only for it to turn out to be a saline solution?

flattythehurdler

drenkrom wrote:

fast as fupp wrote:

where can i get some?

Find out where the local haematologists go for a pint, pay up a few rounds. Done.

Nah, I asked my friend who is a haematologist, who told me to ask the renal boys. Asked them, who told me to ask a haematologist. Maybe I need to up the ante.

shinyhelmut

Or buy more rounds

shinyhelmut

I'm going to China on business on Sunday. Do you think I can source some there?

EricCunha

how many days after the last dose I can be detected by doping test in urine?
(alphaepoetin)

RichN95.

EricCunha wrote:

how many days after the last dose I can be detected by doping test in urine?
(alphaepoetin)

35 days minimum. You can't take any chances. Mind you drinking a can of Red Bull will have the same effect.

Seriously, if your thinking of doping with EPO - don't, it's for retards at amateur level. It'll screw up you health and its not worth doing to win a cat 2 race or what ever your doing. Either try training or find another sport.

And why are you dragging up a year old thread. And what happened to Aurelio? He stopped posting after he signed for Liverpool.

In summary, you're an utter idiot.