Alternative to Mountain King?

mhuk

I've just gone to make my back tyre ghetto tubeless and my 3 month old 2.2" Mountain King (protection, folding) has a small cut in the tread Gutted!

Before I buy a new one are there any alternatives I should consider? I thought (think) the MK is a good all rounder and has only been a bit sketchy in mud, although given the mud was at Dyfi I don't any tyre would have done any better. Nobby Nic?

I'll be running it ghetto tubeless.

Thanks

Dazzza

Nobby nic is a great tyre, just got myself a pair and they gripped surprisingly well in the mud and when they broke grip it was safe and predictable.

And they run great tubeless too.

mhuk

Cheers for the reply - were they snakeskin or Evo?

These will be my tyres for riding anywhere/ everywhere- from forest to the occasional trail centre (got some Black Sharks for anything really muddy i.e. Sleepless in the Saddle).

Dazzza

They were the evo, i never got on with the black sharks which was odd as they had stellar reviews.

RealMan

rubber queen

mhuk

Thanks for the suggestion but reading a review here they're not the tyre for me (too big and too heavy).

.blitz

Dazzza wrote:

Nobby nic is a great tyre, just got myself a pair and they gripped surprisingly well in the mud and when they broke grip it was safe and predictable.

+1

The 2.25s are very good.

Surf-Matt

mhuk - just taken my MKs off - too draggy on hardpack but pretty good allrounders.

I've stuck 1.8" Sauserwinds on - get very good reviews and they roll SO fast. Might be a bit too racey for general use but I'm very impressed with them. Cheap too and one of the lightest tyres out there (apart from Supersonic Contis which last about 3 minutes).

nferrar

I'd go with a Maxxis Advantage or Kenda Nevegal for the rear for reasonable rolling all-rounders that don't mince apart at the sight of rocks (*cough* Nobby Nics *cough*)

Dazzza

Weight *cough* rolling resistance *cough*

mhuk

Cheers for the suggestions, I'll check them out.

Given the amount of rain lately I don't think the forest will be hardpack at the moment

scoob113

Dazzza wrote:

Nobby nic is a great tyre, just got myself a pair and they gripped surprisingly well in the mud and when they broke grip it was safe and predictable.

And they run great tubeless too.

I've recently put NN 2.25's on my Five and made them tubeless. I found making them tubeless using Stans Standard kit purgatory, however have managed to get them to only lose about 10psi per day now. And i think that's as much the wheels (XM317) as the tyres, though they are very loose tyres which don't help with Stans kits getting them initially inflated.

I've had two runs with them, and on both I've found them quite skittery, and that's compared to Speed King's on the same bike and same trail (Glen Tress black). To the extent that I was off the bike twice with the NN's last night, once just a slide onto not bad ground and once into a tree when the bike and i finally parted company. Could just be coincidence re the tyres and just me going too fast for ability and conditions but it hasn't happened before on my hardtail or on my current bike.
Both times it was the rear going for a slide that started it and both times couldn't recover.

Elsewhere on the ride I found the back wheels sliding a lot, made me feel a bit like a speedway rider at times. Again I've not experienced that very much before at all.

I'm about 160lbs on the bike with pressure set to around 28psi.

As i say, possibly just me, but I've not found them a success so far.

mhuk

Did you prefer the Speedking to the NN? Race King was another tyre in the shortlist (of probably 10 so not very short). I've found the sidewalls of the MKs to leak and they were bubbling away all last night (not sure if the bubbles were washing up liquid or sealant).

I know tyre threads come up all the time and tyres are a personal choice - we all ride differently, hardtail/ FS, we are all sorts of weigh and some are XC types, others DH, others aggressive etc. but thanks for the input so far.

I'm XC and about 60/65kg. I'm looking for light, rolls well, decent sidewall protection and predictable grip. In a tyre

Anyone tired Schwalbe Smart Sams?

Surf-Matt

mhuk - my first MK did that (bubbled) then warped and that was it. Protection versions too.
New one hasn't done the same but it's a bit odd. Annoying on a near £40 tyre too!

SK and RK do look tempting but I think Conti and Schwalbe tyres are a bit of a rip off - especially if they aren't DEFINITELY superior. I'm finding my Sauserwinds to be utterly faultless and they were under £20 each!

mhuk

MKs are "only" £25 from Ribble but I'll look for the Sauserwinds.

Before I "knew" anything about bikes let alone tyres, I rode at Coed y Brenin about 3 weeks after buying my bike and did a few days there with the tyres that came with the bike - Scott Ozon tyres. They handled it all- rock, roots, mud, hills and I only crashed once when I was going too fast. I'm pretty sure it was beginner's luck - these days I only use them when it's dry or on the canal.

Dazzza

scoobmw wrote:

Dazzza wrote:

Nobby nic is a great tyre, just got myself a pair and they gripped surprisingly well in the mud and when they broke grip it was safe and predictable.

And they run great tubeless too.

I've recently put NN 2.25's on my Five and made them tubeless. I found making them tubeless using Stans Standard kit purgatory, however have managed to get them to only lose about 10psi per day now. And i think that's as much the wheels (XM317) as the tyres, though they are very loose tyres which don't help with Stans kits getting them initially inflated.

I've had two runs with them, and on both I've found them quite skittery, and that's compared to Speed King's on the same bike and same trail (Glen Tress black). To the extent that I was off the bike twice with the NN's last night, once just a slide onto not bad ground and once into a tree when the bike and i finally parted company. Could just be coincidence re the tyres and just me going too fast for ability and conditions but it hasn't happened before on my hardtail or on my current bike.
Both times it was the rear going for a slide that started it and both times couldn't recover.

Elsewhere on the ride I found the back wheels sliding a lot, made me feel a bit like a speedway rider at times. Again I've not experienced that very much before at all.

I'm about 160lbs on the bike with pressure set to around 28psi.

As i say, possibly just me, but I've not found them a success so far.

Im presuming you bought the ust version of the nics?

Tyres are very subjective, i have at least 7 pairs and so far the nics are my favourite, did have conti vapours but i had no end of puncture problems, with tyres i think it's more down to riding style then if the tyres has good reviews or not.

I've bought tyres in the past with an excellent rep only to find they made the bike a deathtrap, least for me they did so i take reviews with a very large grain of salt, either way the nics certainly work for me and they're staying on. 8)

As for schwalbe being a rip off, yes they are more expensive but the quality shows, besides i got mine for £53 all in on ebay.

http://www.nextdaytyres.com/home.aspx

Surf-Matt

Dazza - what put me off Schwalbe is many reports of them wearing out very quickly and/or puncturing. Will be keen to see how yours last.

My Sausers look every bit as tough as my MK Protections - but time will tell.

Dazzza

Well so far no punctures, no idea on longevity but the nics are meant to wear well, it's the racing ralphs you have to watch, the giant gets on very well with them which must be why giant put the rr's on their higher models.

Matt - If you're really that curious give it a ride, i use spd's as well, least then you'll know for sure if you like em.

chorscroft

I'm running a SpeedKing SS 2.1 and it's great. Rolls fairly well, corners brilliantly and has a nice tread that doesn't clog in mud and grips fairly well in all conditions. It's also damn light!

I'm also running a RaceKing SS 2.2 and I'm not overly impressed. The carcass is too big for the tread size and although it rolls really well and has great grip on hardpack and smooth tracks, it has poor grip on loose stuff and mud and due to the lack of sideknobs, corners quite poorly.

In summary... buy a speedking supersonic!

Gobs

Don't the Supersonics wear very quickly though as suggested above?

chorscroft

Well I haven't put an awful lot of miles on them but they don't feel any more flimsy than any other tire.

The only complaints of supersonic I've heard wasn't that they wear out quickly but that they are more susceptible to sidewall tears than other tires, but I haven't found that to be a problem.

jam1e

Not wanting to hijack the thread but I'm selling a pair of Conti RaceKings UST in 2.4 - £35 posted.

They're fast and have good grip but they get bullied off line a bit on the rocky descents I spend a lot of time on...

scoob113

Dazzza wrote:

Im presuming you bought the ust version of the nics?

Tyres are very subjective, i have at least 7 pairs and so far the nics are my favourite, did have conti vapours but i had no end of puncture problems, with tyres i think it's more down to riding style then if the tyres has good reviews or not.

I've bought tyres in the past with an excellent rep only to find they made the bike a deathtrap, least for me they did so i take reviews with a very large grain of salt, either way the nics certainly work for me and they're staying on. 8)

As for schwalbe being a rip off, yes they are more expensive but the quality shows, besides i got mine for £53 all in on ebay.

http://www.nextdaytyres.com/home.aspx

Hi, no I got the standard 2.25 tyres to then seal up using the Stans kit rather than buy the UST ones. Totally agree re tyres, just thought I'd share my experience too. At the end of the day they seemed to me like they'd be good for me. So much so i was willing to spend £60 on them. And they may yet be good for me too, just not yet. Maybe I'm going quicker on them and sliding more, or equally likely I'm just not up to the job of the Black at Glen tress :-) heh heh.

So aye, I'm on my third type, Maxxis, Conti, now Schwalbe.

To answer an earier question re the Speed Kings from someone else - yes i can now say I had more fun on the 2.3 Speed Kings with inner tubes in that I'm having on the 2.25 NN's tubeless. That isn't to say that won't change though. I strongly suspect there are other factors and that they're all pretty good really. I might go for a heavier tyre again next time. I just can't be bothered changing tyres just now - it's taken me for weeks to get Nobby Nics to infflate and stay inflated with the Stans NoTubes kit and I don't want to go back through that again 9and I have no spare flid anyway !).

Cheers.

scoob113

chorscroft wrote:

Well I haven't put an awful lot of miles on them but they don't feel any more flimsy than any other tire.

The only complaints of supersonic I've heard wasn't that they wear out quickly but that they are more susceptible to sidewall tears than other tires, but I haven't found that to be a problem.

Hi there - I didn't find any issues with my Speed Kings round any of the rocky bits at Glen Tress either. And I thought I might.

Dazzza

Try having a nose at intense tyres, can't go tubeless on em and you need very good tyre levers but i have a feeling you'll love em.

Funny enough i was going to suggest you were going faster with the nics and just didn't realise.

Im very surprised you didn't buy the ust version, didn't you have a nose on stans site, it shows what tyres are good to use with the sealant.

Those three brands you've tried at pretty much the top ones, i don't envy your position lol.

mhuk

I've tried neither but there are a few threads on xcracer comparing RK Supersonic to RR and the general opinion was RR gave better handling grip for a similar level of reliability/ puncture resistance, but without trying them personally I can't comment (and riders are all weights and styles of riding).

A friend of mine runs RR tubeless all round and we ride the same trails and she hasn't had a problem with them - she did Dyfi, Marin and Mayhem on them.

@jam1e: cheers for the offer but too big for my frame and USTs are a bit heavy.

scoob113

Dazzza wrote:

Try having a nose at intense tyres, can't go tubeless on em and you need very good tyre levers but i have a feeling you'll love em.

Funny enough i was going to suggest you were going faster with the nics and just didn't realise.

Im very surprised you didn't buy the ust version, didn't you have a nose on stans site, it shows what tyres are good to use with the sealant.

Those three brands you've tried at pretty much the top ones, i don't envy your position lol.

Yep - checked the site, andd did the usual pile of reading on everyting so fancied going for the light tyres to give them a go.

PS, the Maxxis I have on my HT are just fine, just that they're staying on the HT, and the Speed Kings came with the 5 that I thoght would be worth a replacement to see how good other ones might be. So overall, my Maxxis tyres are good - like 'em. Speed Kings are actually good (particularly in the dry), but couldn't seal them with NoTubes and thought they *might* struggle on the rocky stuff. Its a bit of a story but i ended up running the Speed kings longer and actually got used to them, but then NNs were in the garage and was desperate to get them to work. Will see how the NN'ss go over time :-)

Speed - there is every chance. I'm enjoying the bike so much now and MTB'ing in daylight is quite good fun (my biking is usually a Winter evening activity strangely). So might be just getting naturally quicker and therefore crashing :-) Duno though - difficult to tell.

Gobs

Would switching from a Mountain King 2.4 UST to a 2.2 version have a noticeable increase in speed?

mhuk

A 2.2 MK protection is 580g, 2.4" UST is 800g (given wieghts)- you might not go faster but it should be easier as you have nearly 500g less rotational mass to turn round.

That's ignoring factors like grip/ rolling resistance, comfort etc.

mhuk

This makes an interesting read: http://forums.mtbr.com/showpost.php?p=4 ... stcount=13

http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key= ... b3WA&hl=en

http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key= ... jrShdZdcLA (you'll need a google login; click on Tire Data).

NN has a higher thorn resisitance than MK Protection..

Surf-Matt

Have to admit, I do seem to get nearly as many punctures in my MK Protections as I do in other tyres I've had. I think the "Protection" part is really just the sidewall and I never get pinch flats anyway.

My Sauserwinds have done a decent mileage now with not a single flat - and they don't have any extra protection.

Funny with tubeless - converts bang on about them being lighter - well every tubeless ready version of any tyre seems a lot heavier. Then you need pints of sealant. My "heavy duty" tubes weigh 155g, my Supersonics weigh 100g and my tyres weigh 450g. I would be very surprised if any tubeless set up got anywhere near that.