What is it with women cyclists?

DonDaddyD

biondino wrote:

LiT is definitely not as common as most male cyclists

Cafewanda wrote:

I should hope not :shock: :shock:

She's a very refined lady 8)

The word common in use of a sentence

FFS!

Common
adjective
1 the same in a lot of places or for a lot of people:
It's quite common to see couples who dress alike.
The surname 'Smith' is very common in Britain.

Cafewanda and Biondino are using the word, in what could be considered, a more colloquial way to depict or suggest social class. Their use of the word is most likely an adaptation of the word commoner. This to my knowledge isn't the correct use of the word common, though is accepted.

Sometimes I would just like to post without be criticised….

dilemna

DonDaddyD wrote:

The word common in use of a sentence

FFS!

Common
adjective
1 the same in a lot of places or for a lot of people:
It's quite common to see couples who dress alike.
The surname 'Smith' is very common in Britain.

Cafewanda and Biondino are using the word, in what could be considered, a more colloquial way to depict or suggest social class. Their use of the word is most likely an adaptation of the word commoner. This to my knowledge isn't the correct use of the word common, though is accepted.

Sometimes I would just like to post without be criticised….

Not really relevant to the topic in question and TBH pretty frivalous and trivial in comparison.

benno68

DonDaddyD wrote:

lost_in_thought wrote:

Hmmm, I can't really agree with the fact that it's because women are less aware or proficient on a bike than men.

For every woman I see doing something daft on a bike, I must see 4 men doing something equally daft, and that's not really a huge surprise, seeing as us girls can't make up a huge percentage of people on a bike.

And Joycie is right, a fair few vehicles do display those stickers.

Maybe it's just coincidence, but it does seem rather odd.

Couldn't agree more.

Personally I think I notice it more if a women is in an accident because I don't see many female cyclists on my commute. This is strengthend by the fact that I notice female cyclists more on my commute because they're not as common as male cyclists.

I don't think men are safer or better cyclists than women, but why is it that 6 out of 7 deaths in London are women, if there a fewer women cycling than men it's an even more disproportionate rate.

I wish I knew the answer.

DonDaddyD

I don't think men are safer or better cyclists than women, but why is it that 6 out of 7 deaths in London are women, if there a fewer women cycling than men it's an even more disproportionate rate.

I wish I knew the answer.

Men are on average more aggressive than women. Psychologically, pushing ahead (to the front of the queue) and filtering down the right, often on the wrong side of the road towards an oncoming car, who may in turn has to move slightly to the left is aggressive cycling.

It may be that in those situations (going left on the up on the inside of a vehicle) a more aggressive path filtering to the right is the safer option and one which instinctvely and subconciously women will tend not to take.

DonDaddyD

dilemna wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

Cafewanda wrote:

biondino wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

lost_in_thought wrote:

Hmmm, I can't really agree with the fact that it's because women are less aware or proficient on a bike than men.

For every woman I see doing something daft on a bike, I must see 4 men doing something equally daft, and that's not really a huge surprise, seeing as us girls can't make up a huge percentage of people on a bike.

And Joycie is right, a fair few vehicles do display those stickers.

Maybe it's just coincidence, but it does seem rather odd.

Couldn't agree more.

Personally I think I notice it more if a women is in an accident because I don't see many female cyclists on my commute. This is strengthend by the fact that I notice female cyclists more on my commute because they're not as common as male cyclists.

LiT is definitely not as common as most male cyclists ;)I should hope not :shock: :shock

:

She's a very refined lady 8)

The word common in use of a sentence

FFS!

Common
adjective
1 the same in a lot of places or for a lot of people:
It's quite common to see couples who dress alike.
The surname 'Smith' is very common in Britain.

Cafewanda and Biondino are using the word, in what could be considered, a more colloquial way to depict or suggest social class. Their use of the word is most likely an adaptation of the word commoner. This to my knowledge isn't the correct use of the word common, though is accepted.

Sometimes I would just like to post without be criticised….

Not really relevant to the topic in question and TBH pretty frivalous and trivial in comparison.

The irony, that I made a very valid and on topic post that was trivialised, which led to my response above. Coupled with the fact that you chose to ignore those fivalous and trivial posts to only focus on mine is not lost on me.

But I've since moved back on topic - see above.

Porgy

I'm starting to think that the misogyny of many lorry drivers may be to blame.

Mind you - most lorry drivers I meet seem to hate everyone except other lorry drivers.

dilemna

Perhaps a road side survey should be conducted of cyclists asking which side they prefer to pass to determine whether there is a genuine difference between the sexes. Some of course may not pass at all preferring patience to be the better option .

dilemna

Porgy wrote:

I'm starting to think that the misogyny of many lorry drivers may be to blame.

Mind you - most lorry drivers I meet seem to hate everyone except other lorry drivers.

Without wanting to turn your arguement into a sieve, how about female HGV and PSV drivers?

shoulder_of_orion

I was at Oval just after the accident happened on Monday. I knew it was something bad and spoke with a couple of other cyclists we could all sense something bad had happened. I had a sick sense that a cyclist had died and when I found out one had it put me off for a couple of days.

In that Londonpaper article it says that 6 out of the last 7 cyclists killed by lorries have been females. That does not seem like a co-incidence. I would probably go along with the views that men are basically more arrogant cavalier risk takers and in a kind of counter-intiuitive logic this makes them less likely to get run over by a lorry turning left.

RIP Catriona.

ride_whenever

Does anyone have relative numbers for male and female cyclists in total and for accidents and fatalities? As far as I can see, there are far more women getting hit and or killed that there should be.

Interestingly, my ex says I cycle like an unpredicatable loon, rarely checking behind me. Yet in the last year she has been hit twice and I haven't been hit at all. I think it is certainly a risk perception thing, i can't remember who said it, but the thought that men know they're doing something stupid, whereas women tend not to as much maybe.

DonDaddyD

dilemna wrote:

Perhaps a road side survey should be conducted of cyclists asking which side they prefer to pass to determine whether there is a genuine difference between the sexes. Some of course may not pass at all preferring patience to be the better option .

A testosterone could also be including into the research to establish if there is a correlation between aggressive riding in that situation and the hormone related to elevated levels of aggression - which women tend to have less of.

(Though I could be wrong about testosterone influencing aggression)

antfly

I was catching up with a bloke on a mountain bike yesterday on a busy bypass when he suddenly turned right, across both lanes without even looking or signalling. He must have great faith in his ears.

Sewinman

I was just thinking about this incident and its really depressing me. Its crazy that people are dieing at incidents taking place at traffic lights, with one vehicle simply turning left. There isnt any high speeds involved.

Something should be done...i dont know what!

il_principe

Sewinman wrote:

This is the latest one to go (RIP)...she sounds like an experienced cyclist so maybe just very very bad luck.

http://www.thelondonpaper.com/thelondon ... a-cockburn

I missed this one. If she was doing the Etape you'd assume she was very proficient. So sad. Thoughts with her family. I'm loosing track but there seem to have been a lot of these recently. My GF is under strict orders to steer well clear of HGV's. She might be excessively cautious as a result but I'm not complaining. I really think Boris needs to think about restricting HGV movement in the capital - perhaps none allowed during Rush Hour. It's bad enough now, imagine what it will be like as the Crossrail project gets underway - all the dirt is being hauled out via the road network, and there's the Olympics to consider. It's bad enough round London Bridge atm with the Spire build in full swing.

Sewinman

Quite an interesting link:

http://www.londonskaters.com/cycling/sa ... hicles.htm

Porgy

dilemna wrote:

Porgy wrote:

I'm starting to think that the misogyny of many lorry drivers may be to blame.

Mind you - most lorry drivers I meet seem to hate everyone except other lorry drivers.

Without wanting to turn your arguement into a sieve, how about female HGV and PSV drivers?

1. that's why i said 'many' not 'all'

2. do you know that any of the dead female cyclists were killed by female drivers? None that I'm aware. So you're just being pointless and irrelevent. Well done!!

3. it's not an argument - it was a remark. You can take far too seriously if you wish to. Is that my problem? :roll:

4. stop wasting my time.

antfly wrote:

I was catching up with a bloke on a mountain bike yesterday on a busy bypass when he suddenly turned right, across both lanes without even looking or signalling. He must have great faith in his ears.

One of the arguments for having headphones when you cycle - it makes you use your eyes.

il_principe

From Movingtarget:

The grisly list of female cyclists killed by lorries in London so far in 2009 is:

1. Eilidh Cairns, 5th February, Notting Hill Gate
2. Rebecca Goosen, 8th April, Old Street
3. Meryem Ozekman, 9th April, Elephant & Castle roundabout
4. Adrianna Skrzypiec, 15th May, Woolwich
5. Emma, 12th June, Charterhouse Street
6. Catriona Cockburn, 29th June, Oval

This is a truly horrible list, and the percentage of London cyclists killed by lorries that were female so far in 2009 is now 85%.

dilemna

Am I right in guessing that fewer ladies cycle than men, yet in these types of fatalities, it is highly likely that a lady cyclist will be involved thus making it an urgent issue for female cycllists to be made aware through education and awareness training? Whether or not men avoid such situations due to more aggressive assertive riding, better understanding and anticipation of how large vehicles move or higher levels of testosterone it does not matter as they don't seem to get caught out. Quite how they manage this I don't know as I see enough male numptee cyclists go up the inside of large vehicles that are close to the kerb or are near to turning or alternatively scoot around the offside of the vehicle directly into the path of oncoming traffic :shock: . Perhaps they are not afraid to shout or bang loudly on the side of the vehicle. Women may seek to avoid confrontation so when a driver cannot see them and the vehicle continues in it's path toward them then the results are predictable and terrible.

And many cyclists have head phones in their ears which is a big no no :shock: .

An awareness campaign is needed for all cyclists.

Porgy

dilemna wrote:

And many cyclists have head phones in their ears which is a big no no :shock: .
.

That's your opinion - would you like to back that up with some facts?

il_principe

dilemna wrote:

Of course many cyclists have head phones in their ears which is a big no no.

Sorry but this is rubbish. I cycle with headphones and have had no issues as a result as I USE MY EYES and can still hear traffic anyway.

MrChuck

Porgy wrote:

One of the arguments for having headphones when you cycle - it makes you use your eyes.

:shock:

Porgy

dilemna wrote:

An awareness campaign is needed for all cyclists.

But not HGV / lorry drivers? :roll:

Porgy

MrChuck wrote:

Porgy wrote:

One of the arguments for having headphones when you cycle - it makes you use your eyes.

:shock:

:shock: :shock: :shock:



:P

Porgy

my computer crashed causing multiple posts :shock:

dilemna

Porgy wrote:

dilemna wrote:

Porgy wrote:

I'm starting to think that the misogyny of many lorry drivers may be to blame.

1. that's why i said 'many' not 'all'

2. do you know that any of the dead female cyclists were killed by female drivers? None that I'm aware. So you're just being pointless and irrelevent. Well done!!

3. it's not an argument - it was a remark. You can take far too seriously if you wish to. Is that my problem? :roll:

4. stop wasting my time.

antfly wrote:

I was catching up with a bloke on a mountain bike yesterday on a busy bypass when he suddenly turned right, across both lanes without even looking or signalling. He must have great faith in his ears.

One of the arguments for having headphones when you cycle - it makes you use your eyes.

Your words highlighted in bold. A sweeping generalisation me thinks which presumably includes mysogenistic female HGV drivers .

Porgy

dilemna wrote:

Your words highlighted in bold. A sweeping generalisation me thinks which presumably includes mysogenistic female HGV drivers .

it wasn't a sweeping generalisation - i said many - now define many as a percentage - you can't. It doesn;t even mean majority.

And in what way does that include female drivers?

whe you use the word "presumably" it smacks of trying to put words in my mouth that I never said.

I'm guessing English isn't your first language in which case, take it from me

you're wrong.

dilemna

Porgy wrote:

dilemna wrote:

And many cyclists have head phones in their ears which is a big no no :shock: .
.

That's your opinion - would you like to back that up with some facts?

Yep I pass must be at least 10 riders every day who have head phones in. 8 out of 10 of them I hear clearly what they are listening to. If you can't hear something coming up behind you - such as me as they give a sign of fright as they didn't expect another cyclist to pass them, how on earth are you going to know if you are about to be run down? I see soooo many cyclists who don't bother to look behind when changing direction let alone when a vehicle is approaching fast and close from behind. Frequently looking behind will save your life and a final life saver immediately before you pass, turn or cross anything definitely will. I always hear cars long before I see them. Engine note and tyre noise is a good indicator of their speed and proximity.

Sewinman

Come on, the assertion that more women are being killed this way due to misogyny of HGV drivers is utterly ridiculous. You are essentially saying that these events are murder.

Porgy

Sewinman wrote:

Come on, the assertion that more women are being killed this may due to misogyny of HGV drivers is utterly ridiculous. You are essentially saying that these events are murder.

manslaughter probably.

anyway - i'm not arguing - it was a REMARK

and a throw away one at that

I have no intention of arguing this. disagree if you like - but there's no point I have no intention of pushing the point home.

Sewinman

Porgy wrote:

Sewinman wrote:

Come on, the assertion that more women are being killed this may due to misogyny of HGV drivers is utterly ridiculous. You are essentially saying that these events are murder.

manslaughter probably.

anyway - i'm not arguing - it was a REMARK

and a throw away one at that

No, saying its because of misogyny means that HGV drivers are targeting come cyclists because they are women. Intent - murder.

It was a stupid remark and you should withdraw it.