New bike from halfords only (cycle2work scheme) about £200

MrMister111

Hi

want to get back on a bike after ages! Work is running a cycle2work scheme so can pay monthly and pay about £150 over 12months for £200 vouchers

It has to be halfords. I know nothing really about good/bad bikes.

Be using it for general getting to work, out with the kids, general stuff nothoing taxing. only offroad will be very rare and very slight, hills etc ith kids.

I am 6' 1" seen the raleigh Glide but too small a frame I think

reading on here it says to keep away from full suspension at my price range, so only front needed.

What about the Apollo XC.26S? as I say I'm no serious biker.

Please give me help and suggestions for upto £220 at halfords for my use. I need to sign up by Wed or loose the scheme

thanks
MrMr

bails87

If you could spend a little more you'd get a much better bike for your money. Maybe consider the Carerra subway, it doesn't sound like you really 'need' any suspension, and seeing as it's got rigid forks it would be lighter than a similarly priced MTB. Pushing the budget a little more, look at the Carerra Vulcan, a better bike than the Apollos and well worth spending an extra couple of quid a week, especially if you'll be using it regularly. In fact I'd avoid all of the Apollos and just look at the GTs and Carerras that halfords sell.

PS, Don't buy that Raleigh!

MrMister111

Thanks I knew that the reply would be spend more

TBH I really dont want to, I will use it very casually, I have an old raleigh now, its fine really for what I use it for (kids out etc) but with this scheme I thought it was too good to miss for a new bike and then hopefully will get me going out more on it.

I seen the Apollo XC and lifted it, it seems very light (to me anyway compared to my old trusty 15y.o. raleigh activator 2!!)

i understand what you will say about pay more, but honestly I am not a biker, theres a lad at wrk who spends '000s on bits and bikes, Im not in that league.

So if you can recommend any bikes for me around <£220 (as got to get a helmet inc this to) in Halfords I would be grateful

The other Apolo is full suspension but you say keep away form all these.

please any help, Ive got to goto Halfords and chose tomorrow to get in the scheme (looking on web site for ideas)

Remember I'm only a amateur trying to loose a bit weight!

cheers

bails87

I know, and I remember the feeling about a year ago when I was looking at spending £200 on a bike and it seemed like an awful lot of money to me too, but I ended up buying another bike after 6 months because the one I had just stopped working every time i did any real off road stuff (might not be such a problem for you with just road commuting and trips with the kids).

But I the extra £40 would be well spent to stretch to the Subway 1, more money has been spent on quality components on that bike because the (limited) budget hasn't had to stretch to suspension forks like it has on the Apollo. If you can't stretch the budget at all then go for the Apollo, its pretty much your only choice to be honest. It might seem strange paying more for a bike without any suspension, but it'll be more harm than good on the Apollo, it'll bounce around and be a waste of energy on the roads, and then when you do venture off road it won't do much apart from pogo, and it sounds like the terrain you'll be riding won't actually require suspension anyway. (sorry if any of that sounds patronising, but it sounds like you dont really need a 'mountain' bike, and a hybrid style thing would suit you better).

Plus if you get into the biking malarkey big time then you'll want a new mountain bike, and the Apollo may well have given up the ghost by then too, so you'll need a commuting one too. Whereas if you get the subway, you can splash out on a mountain bike and keep the subway (which should last much better) for commuting.

Hopefully someone else will appear with some opinions too!

alfablue

There is no Apollo bike that warrants a recommendation IMHO. I wouldn't have one for free! It could even end up costing you more if you try and improve on the components in an attempt to make it satisfactory. The frame and fork are rubbish. You don't need front suspension (particularly not rubbish suspension). The Carrera Subway is a decent bike, however, and it costs £259, only £30 over budget, that will be less than £3 per month more. You can probably expect to save 40% on the scheme, so the Subway would cost less than £14 per month. Presumably you want a bike that will last you many years and that you will be happy with - so why buy one which will fulfil neither, just to save £30? You can buy a bad bike if you want, entirely your choice, but I doubt you will find anyone here to recommend it! If you want to get fit you will presumably want to ride more often, bad bikes discourage this, and are also likely to need earlier repair and replacement of components if used frequently.

Have a look at this article on buying "Bike Shaped Objects" (i.e. things which look like bikes but actually don't function as bikes should - this would describe Apollo bikes IMHO).

See this review of the Subway.

xstrathyx

i have purchased my new bike through the cycle to work scheme also. It is a great idea and you and your employer reap the benefits. I know your budget probably dictates what you can afford. I bought my Trek 3900 disc for just over £320 and am paying back somthing like £4 a week (which in the grand scheme of things is nothing).

As one of the previous posters pointed out, if you can afford a little more, you will certainly get a nice bike and one that equips you better.

All the best in your quest, i know you ll get "sound" advice on here. i have!

MrMister111

The subway only has a 18" frame. I think I would need bigger as I'm 6'1"

also it says it has the same frame 7005 aluminium series one as the apollo xc26s

I know the more I spend the better but it will be just for street use light bumps etc.

thanks

alfablue

The Subway also comes in a 20" frame.

7005 aluminium is the type of aluminium alloy, it in no way means the frame is the same, merely that the metal is the same. You could build a battleship out of the same alloy, but it wouldn't ride or feel like a Carrera Subway (in fact, you would have trouble getting your leg over )

We can only advise you honestly, you don't have to take it, but likewise we cannot change our honestly held views to suit your preconceptions. Even if someone comes along here and tells you it is a good bike, or a good idea to buy, it won't change the bike, it is what it is.

Apollo bikes sell in huge numbers, so surely all those people can't be wrong? Well, yes they can, and I feel sorry for everyone of them that has the misfortune to have been mis-sold one. Apollo bikes are Halfords answer to supermarket bikes, sold in large numbers to people who have no experience of what a decent bike looks or rides like.

andy46

i had the 07 model of the apollo you mention, all i can say is DON'T DO IT!

In my experiance of owning one it was a complete waste of time and money and even put me off mtb for a while. I had a number of problems with the disc brake binding on every ride making it impossable to ride. I upgraded this to a bikehut item which solved the problem but IMO cable discs are just a gimick. Also i would tend to stay away from grip shifter's for the gears as these seem to be very inaccurate, and the suspension forks are just like pogo sticks that will scare the life out of you if you atempt to try anything slightly off road, a decent pot hole could be enough! :shock: if you have to buy from halfords i agree that the subway seems a decent bike, or for a bit more money a carrera, i think they are also some offers on GT bikes at the minute but i'm not sure how much these are, you would be getting a much better bike and i'm sure you would get much more enjoyment from it.

As they say the choice is yours!

MrMister111

I am listening to comments honestly.

I cant find the subway in 20" on halfords though.

Are they that bad. Is there anything else on halfords?

I understand but I think you all have higher expections of a bike than me.

are all apollos that bad or just this one? £180 is a reasonable amount to pay I thought

cheers

Dirtydog11

If your going to get an Apollo then you might as well save yourself some money and buy one of these outright.

http://direct.asda.com/British-Eagle-Tu ... lt,pd.html

Yes I know its crap but I reckon its better value than an Apollo.

alfablue

They do the bike in 20" though the website may not show it - as you are ordering in-store, they should be able to get one for you. The Subway must be one of their best sellers (apart from Apollo), they are widely used by commuters.

Yes, all apollos are bad, they focus on appearance rather than components or quality. Components will be poor and won't last, the frames are poor, the tyres and seats will be poor, they are designed to appeal to what 13 year olds think a bike should look like. The difference between a cheaper apollo and a more expensive one is that there are more useless gimicks and components bolted on, they are fundamentally useless in any form.

To generalise here, people have a weird sense of what a bike should cost - this is partly due to brands like Apollo - the public have been trained to think a bike over £100 is expensive! People don't look at a £400 washing machine as overpriced, yet a decent bike has as much design and engineering, and probably needs to be manufactured with much greater precision and care. As for losing weight - how much do people spend on things like gym memberships that they rarely use? £50/pcm? You want to commute on it - how much does driving cost, or public transport? Any way you look at it, a £260 bike is not much to pay for what it can deliver.

Your £180 is nearly enough to get you a "real" bike, but the Apollo isn't one. Of what Halfords sell, the best brand at the lowest price is Carrera - they are very good value for money, and if you went to a proper bike shop looking for a similar quality hybrid it would probably cost £50-£80 more.

The standard advice for anyone looking for a £180 bike is to buy secondhand, as it isn't really possible to buy a new worthwhile bike at this price (other than a Carrera Subway in one of Halford's frequent sales). As you are using Cyclescheme, s/h is not available, so you need to spend more.

I do have higher expectations of a bike than you, I expect it to work well, operate smoothly, change gear reliably, have components that last a reasonable time, and for it to be a pleasure to ride. Have you read the link I posted about Bike Shaped Objects? You should.

Northwind

MrMister111 wrote:

I seen the Apollo XC and lifted it, it seems very light (to me anyway compared to my old trusty 15y.o. raleigh activator 2!!)

Right, the activator 2 was officially the most rubbish bike of its time Remember it well... I dare you to go on retrobikes and try and sell it to someone as a perfect retro fixer-upper...

The apollo there is possibly worse. Their hardtails aren't as bad as their full suss bikes but they're still bad, lots of very cheap parts so they can be unreliable too, and expensive to keep going.

If you can possibly stretch to £260 for the Carrera Subway, you won't regret it- it's not just about performance, though the Carrera is massively better than the Apollo, it's also about quality, reliability and durability, which in turn will cut your servicing and parts cost. it's reasonably priced, but it's also a pretty nice bike.

barbej

If you are set on spending around £220 and do not intend to use it only on paths then I would go for a hybrid bike like:

Raleigh Chiltern £249. This has full mudguards, rack and is a 3 speed hub geared bike.

This sort of bike is less nickable, it will cost you a lot less to run as 3 speed hub gears rarely need anything doing to them unlike other bikes. Also racks and mudguards are suprisingly expensive later on. If you really get into cycling, its still a good commuter bike and you can keep the more expensive one for riding offroad as MTB are very nickable.

Alternatively get a Raleigh Oakland at £179 though this will cost you more to run in chains (thinner than a hub geared chain) and freewheels.

Also Halfords can get any bike available in the UK on their scheme so you can choose anything.

MrMister111

what about this one then?

http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stor ... yId_165499

its a diamond back? any better? its £199

So I can get any bike I want and halfords will order it in?

alfablue

MrMister111 wrote:

what about this one then?

http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stor ... yId_165499

its a diamond back? any better? its £199

So I can get any bike I want and halfords will order it in?

This review, from the Halfords site, is what you would expect from a bike that is too cheap (note, there are positive reviewsd also, but mostly from people who have had the bike a day or two. Also note, this bike has suspension forks that you don't need, which the user cannot service, and wich reduce the possible spend on other components on the bike).

"I had a 93' Diamondback Traverse which gave me years of good service on and offroad(in fact still have it) And the build quality was excellent for the time. I stopped MTBing and decided to get back into it. Found this Diamonback by chance while out looking for something else and going by past experience bought one. Within the first 2 weeks I noticed the gear changing getting choppy and took it back and they agreed to do the 6 week service there and then and carry out the gear adjustments at the same time. Got it back worked okay but still find myself adjusting the gears myself after every ride. I replaced the Grip Shifters for rapid fire thumb shifters the following month at a small reputable shop and the gears are easier and don't give me as much bother. This past couple of weeks I started to get a grumbling noise from the Bottom Bracket, I chose to service this myself and didn't need any expertise to see that a couple of the bearings were flat or worn in places and ended up changing the bottom bracket for a sealed bearing type ( i was advised not to change the front chainset out for an expensive hollow tech or such like). I have since found out that I can't find any info for servicing my front suspension and can't even find Zoom Forks on the Net without coming back to this bike. Looking back I wish I had saved my money up for a bit longer and bought a higher spec bike from the small reputable shop. Lesson Learned!"

andy46

just been on halfords site, please stay away from anything with grip shifter gears they are totally unreliable and a bit dangerous out on the road (in my experiance).

you can get a GT aggressor with 20% off at the minute, that works out about £280! I know it's more than you would like to spend but i'm sure other's on here will agree with me that's not a bad bike for the money.

TheHatter

I'd give the subway a go. I've been using the Subway one for commuting 100 miles a week in all (and I mean all!) weathers and it been great. I've had no problems at all with the grip shift gears. I went for it after Cycling plus gave it 10/10 and I think its well deserved.
Only issue was with the seatpost that snapped but other than that its been great.

MrMister111

thought diamond back were good?

alfablue

Many manufacturers make bikes down to a price for a certain section of the market, the fact that they may make some okay mid-range or even top end bikes does not mean the very cheapest ones are any good. You can't just take a brand and assume every model is great. There is no way Diamond Back can offer any better spec than any other bike has at a given price point. Perhaps the frame might be marginally better, or not, than another brand, but the review shows that on this sort of budget you are likely to have forks that work poorly, cannot be serviced, and things like the bottom bracket, gear shifters and chainset (another review) need early replacement. This would make the "bargain" buy cheap bike actually cost a lot more than the more expensive type you are being recommended. As they say, buy cheap - buy twice - never more true than in this example. If you did need to replace the components as the reviewer did, you would still end up with a poor bike with rubbish forks, just it would now have cost you £300-£400, not £199!

alfablue

You really should read this:

http://southcoastbikes.co.uk/articles.a ... cle=NO_BSO

You may then understand the point I am making. One interesting thing in that article:

Modern manufacturing methods have enabled a relative reduction of the price of many consumer goods. The bicycle is not exempt from this. For £300+ you can choose from a range of well-built bikes utilising quality components for almost any purpose. £300 is not expensive. Look at the following table. For further information and sources see end of article.
Average Weekly Wage Cost of reasonable bicycle No of Days to buy
1955 . . . . . £8.25 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . £33 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 28
1980 . . . . . £110.20 . . . . . . . . . . . . . .£200 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 12.7
2005 . . . . . £518.70 . . . . . . . . . . . .. . £400 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5.4
Today it takes less than an average week's wage to buy a good quality bicycle. Fifty years ago it took nearly a month. And the bike you'd buy today would be a far superior, more comfortable and responsive ride than its counterpart of yesteryear. You can sometimes get reasonable bikes for even less.

MrMister111

Yeh I know what you mean but I dont want to spend too much really, comments Ive got everywhere are saying spend a lot more £300+ for a "proper" bike.

It will just be "round the doors" really, up and down paths, general bumps etc, nothing off road really

Out of the above, as they are basically the only ones around my price point which is best?

Also people in another forum are saying stretch to the Carerra Subway. this is £260, but no suspension, and to be honest doesn't look as good (god that sounds vain)

I understand the proper biker man, will whiff at these bikes at these prices, but I not a proper biker, I just want something to get too and from work, and around doors with kids, basic riding, nothing serious.

Please help me in this and remember what Im looking for, and please look on Halfords site as it has to be from Halfrds

cheers

alfablue

MrMister111 wrote:

It will just be "round the doors" really, up and down paths, general bumps etc, nothing off road really

Also people in another forum are saying stretch to the Carerra Subway. this is £260, but no suspension, and to be honest doesn't look as good (god that sounds vain)

Look, this is the point I have been trying to make - you are not going off road, so you don't need suspension. Therefore the Subway is better not worse.

Consider this, 2 bikes each cost £200, one has a suspension fork that may cost £40 of the total, the other has a rigid fork, £10 of the total, the £30 difference means the suspension bike has £30 of cost cutting elsewhere on the bike, so it is a worse bike.

Cheap suspension is worse than having no suspension, always! It will be bouncy, will unsettle the bike over bumps (the opposite to what suspension ought to do), it will sap energy when riding up hills, it will go wrong and not be serviceable, and will therefore cost you extra to replace, it will make the bike probably 1kg or 2kg heavier - for no gain, just pain!

When I started mountain biking there were no suspension forks, we rode everywhere! When good suspension forks came on the market we were able to do these same routes faster, but we never needed suspension. For the use you intend, suspension is at best a costly and heavy irrelevance, at worst, it means the whole bike is much poorer value.

Of the remaining components, upon which the costs have been cut to fund the useless suspension, these will not work well out of the box, and will quickly fail.

So you like the look of a bike with "toy" suspension, then get it, but what is the point in asking what is the best bike, when best to most people means function, reliability and value for money, not the rather questionable appearance of a toy suspension fork.

Cheap does not make good value if you have to pay out more fairly early on just to keep it running.

My advice, forget the suspension fork - it is money down the toilet. However you seem to have set your mind on getting a poor bike on the basis of its appearance, so be it.

MrMister111

thanks for all your comments, I do appreciate them, i really do, and I totally understand what you are saying I realy do.

I was before all of this gong to get a dual suspension, because I thought it was the best!!

reading here and other places, I realized I was being daft. So then I started getting comments and stuff.

i really wont be using the bike everyday, hope I do! but I need something to fit me.

lads at works saying (around my price point) dont get Apollo, and they would have a frnt suspension, much better to have front for the road/communting they say (again at my price point, some sniffed and said get a boardman!)

tbh theres nothing wrong with my activtor 2, its getting me from A to B, I would not have thought about getting another bike if it wasnt for this scheme, so proce is a factor for me.

If I like it and get into it, I will buy a proper bike £300+ if I use it and go off road

cheers

gk141054

I have a GT Avalanche 2.0 which I commute on daily. My commute is all road / cycle path and having (front) suspension just isn't really worth it.

I lock mine out most of the time which is the same as not having any at all. Occasionally i'll have it opperational because i'm jumping on and off pavements between the road and cycle lanes, but thats because I really try to push myself to get from A to B as quickly as possible.

If you are only going for a leisurely cycle to the shops then I wouldn't bother with suspension at all, you won't need it.

alfablue

MrMister111 wrote:

lads at works saying (around my price point) dont get Apollo, and they would have a frnt suspension, much better to have front for the road/communting they say

I think they are very wrong - if you read the commuting section on this site you would see many people who have replaced their front suspension for a rigid fork for commuting. I certainly did this on my mtb when I used it for commuting - and this was a high quality lightweight suspension fork that cost over £400, not some "toy" fork - the £50 rigid fork I replaced it with was far better for commuting.

If you look at some high end bikes designed for commuting you will see they DO NOT have suspension forks - for example, this £999 Marin, ask yourself why top end commuters do not have suspension. . . . Also note that on this and the other forum you mention, the advice is against suspension - I would suggest that such fora have much more experienced cyclists than your average lad at work - many of us have "been there / done that" in terms of buying unsuitable bikes, over the years, you could benefit from the lessons that we have learned at our considerable cost.

I am afraid that a typical novice buyer these days thinks they need suspension because they see most people have it, its a vicious circle, but they have all been fooled! Including your work colleagues.

CycloRos

MrMister111 wrote:

If I like it and get into it, I will buy a proper bike £300+ if I use it and go off road

That's just crazy! :shock: Havin read this thread the most important thing to you by the sounds of it is price i.e. no more than £220, but your willing to waste the initial £220, probably be disappointed and then spend another £300+ (which will come out of your own pocket not the C2W scheme!)

I'd listen to the advise you're getting, the bikes people have suggested would be much better suited to what you need.

oh and why are you capped at £220? most C2W schemes run up to a grand, could you not up the value of the voucher? you'll hardly notice the amount of money coming out of your pay packet for a few hundred quid over 12 months...

quentin_miller

Think you should ask for advice in the road/commuting section of this site.

I agree with everyone else that you should spend more than £200 on a bike, so it has a better build, plus it is easier to replace the components on a better bike.

Also I think the Carrera Subway is a good runner for the money.

Every so often Halfords knock 20% off Carrera bikes so you could it at just under £235.

MrMister111

well been into halfords just back. couldnt see any extra 20% voucher or anything, that would have helped decision though, as lad at work had a Kellogg's voucher when he got his and was another 10% off it again with the C2W scheme

they said as you did, the lad actually had a subway and said was great, but he did the coast to coast and stuff and said when he's on a local grass suspension might be better.

I looked at the ladies version of the subway, which was only one they had, seemed ok, just nothing special thats all (to me anyway)

Then asked about that apollo and the Diamnondback, again said basically what you all have said, its fine, reason has suspension as more designed for comfort.

then I saw a Vulvan V spec for £270, he says thats a big step up in quality (as you have all said!), all named components etc, but again, I just didn't "like it", didnt have a disc brake, which I have to say seemed to work great on the bikes that had them, also the weight was the same as the Diamondback.

there wasnt much else really, exactly what I had saw online, so the choice was subway (from all your advice), vulvan V, diamondback, apollo, couple of others couldnt remember names, guy in shop said he tried to err people away form the Apollos and next up is the diamondback.

So I thought about my usage again, and its my 1st time hopefully back on for round the doors, and I decided I wanted suspension on the front (surely you can lock it out/adjust it if required?), so that was subway out, then preferred all round the diamondback, frame looked better (I know your going to go mad when I talk about the look of it! but it helped me in choice)

chose the Diamondback... :oops: surely this is better than the apollos?

please dont shout at me, I see where you were all coming from, but for me I wanted the bike to stand out a bit, have front sus, be better than i got now.

cheers

alfablue

Won't shout at you

The suspension most probably won't have lockout (and maybe no meaningful adjustment). You don't need disc brakes (don't know if it has them), cheap mechanical disc brakes can be a constant pain to keep running smoothly, poor front suspension adds nothing to comfort when you look at how it makes the ride worse, you want the bike to stand out - it may amongst people who don't know about bikes. I hope you enjoy it, anyway. The fact that it may be a bit better than what you are used to may keep you happy. Just don't get on any decent bikes! Let us know how you get on with it.

Kiblams

MrMister111 wrote:

I decided I wanted suspension on the front (surely you can lock it out/adjust it if required?)

Would be incredibly suprised if that fork has any adjustment let alone a lockout, did you ask about that before buying? Unfortunatly if you decide that you want a new fork with adjustment/lockout you won't be able to upgrade due to it being a threaded headset.

I am not one of the peopkle who say you need to spend hundreds and hundreds on a bike to make it a worthwhile buy as I spent £175 on mine in Jan, but I hate to see people bying bikes that aren't upgradeable

Oh and if you weigh more than 15st be careful of the rear freewheel hub as too many curbs will snap the axel as mine did.

Otherwise, enjoy the bike