Much ado about nothing - Shimano DURA-ACE Di2

nicensleazy

The new shitmano di2 Dura- Ace electronic gearset. My friend has just had it fitted to his new Pinarello Prince. He has just brought it around hot from the work shop. Well, my first thoughts were, what are you doing putting Shitmano on a lovely Italian racing bike. Its a bit like putting a Toyota engine in a Maserati - you just wouldn't do it. After he showed off his new gear set, I was left thinking whats all the fuss about. More things to go wrong possibly. Also, with any brand new item which has just entered the market, there are bound to be teething problems.

As he rode off into the distance and I closed my front door, I thought thank God for Campagnolo!

Infamous

You're a nice friend to have.

balthazar

Why does everybody - even cyclists - use cars as the analogy, when comparing the quality or prestige of things? Is our language of quality assessment so steeped in motoring that we can't think about it in terms of anything else?

(What's wrong with Toyota? I imagine they make very good engines. Maserati might benefit from them! certainly save some petrol...)

fossyant

Funny thing is, if Campag did electronic, we'd all know it wouldn't work. Italians can't even get Bosch electronic equipment to work correctly in their cars....... I had an Alfa 147 Selespeed for a few years, lovely car, but shocking electronics.

All I can say, even as Shimano fan, not on an Italian frame...no.....

It's a clever system, but I'd rather stick to manual.

Smokin Joe

5 or 10 years down the line electronic shifting will be so comonplace nobody will look twice at it. No reason it won't be reliable, motorcycles have been exposing far more complex electronics to the elements for decades without any problems.

Every innovation from indexing, clipless pedals, STI / Ergo, alu, cf, compact frames etc has been dismissed as unnescessary on their introduction, then quickly became the norm.

avoidingmyphd

were any of the opinions in the OP developed from encountering the new groupset?

looks like they were predetermined and stored up ready to blurt out when you saw it!

does it work? is it quick? slow? smooth? easy/hard to set up? did he have tribars and two sets of shifters? did that work?

don't know. but i'm guessing you didn't come up with "shitmano" on the day...

Airwave

I would think Reds the only colour&prancing horses the only animals.Technolgy's nothing to be scared of,soon very soon they say we'll send a man to the moon.

Chrissz

Didn't Mavic have an electric shifter system about 10 years ago?

Smokin Joe

Chrissz wrote:

Didn't Mavic have an electric shifter system about 10 years ago?

About 15 years ago, and they almost got it right.

However, as Shimano's bill for paperclips is probably bigger than Mavic's turnover I would expect the "Almost" to disappear.

Frank the tank

I'm a Shimano user through and through but to put it on a Pinarello prince just aint right somehow.

However with regard to electronic shifting I'm sure it will ultimately be the way forward even for weight weenies. I agree with "smokin joe", for some reason new innovations are percieved to be unneccessary but they evolve and suddenly the old technology appears to be exactly that, old.

mmitchell88

nicensleazy wrote:

As he rode off into the distance and I closed my front door, I thought thank God for Campagnolo!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Irl5Nt6ENF4

nicensleazy

It was a bit tongue in cheeck actually, yes I'm sure its the way forward. I guess as the years role on, the rear mech will slim down and the whole unit will become quite stream line. However, where I do draw the line is putting it on a Pinarello Prince, sorry, it just didn't look right.

downfader

I am left thinking two things on electronic shifting.

The first thing is that when it does kick off it will be a much more advanced system, almost automatic. My understanding currently (no punn intended) is that the buttons just work like normal shifters, albeit as buttons. :? I also think it will be much much lighter in weight.

The second thing that strikes me is that the old cable system is pretty simple as it goes. Simplicity is easier to deal with over CPUs and stuff. There will always be a market for simple gears on bikes - just looking at the resurgence in popularity of the fixie seems to prove that to a point.

NWLondoner

Anything that makes shifting gears quicker and smoother has to be a good thing??

I would be worried about the battery running out 60 miles from home!!!

Tom Butcher

I can't ever see it catching on - yes people probably said the same about lots of innovations that have - but there have been other innovations that haven't caught on too and my money is on this being one of them.

Certainly auto shift is a non starter.

nicensleazy

Well ,I'll even admit...yes me........Super Record 11. I went from Chorus to Super Record 11. Whilst its very nice and the carbon is great and the weight etc etc, in real terms, I don't notice that £££££££ great deal of difference.

IanTrcp

It's a wired system at present isn't it?

A shame, as I'd pay dearly for the facility to use a second set of shifters to covertly/wirelessly change the gears on my mates bike. Typically when he's least expecting it. "Let's see how you get on up there in 53x12...."

blu3cat

IanTrcp wrote:

It's a wired system at present isn't it?

A shame, as I'd pay dearly for the facility to use a second set of shifters to covertly/wirelessly change the gears on my mates bike. Typically when he's least expecting it. "Let's see how you get on up there in 53x12...."

Which is why it will stay wired for now.

I mean has anyone had a wireless computer that goes crazy when they pass a cab / large radio transmitter etc.

I think it's a good thing, but it's gonna take a while for battery weights and sizes and total costs come down before I would consider it.

ride_whenever

I thought Di2 was slower shifting but much smoother due to waiting for the correct allignment before shifting.

Personally I think it is a great idea, but not on a prince...

schlepcycling

blu3cat wrote:

I think it's a good thing, but it's gonna take a while for battery weights and sizes and total costs come down before I would consider it.

I agree on the price but as for weight it's lighter than the Dura Ace 7800 set up by 113g and only 68g heavier than 7900 so the weight think is a bit of a red herring.

freehub

What actually is wrong with Shimano on an Italian bike? Is it just bike snobbery?

As long as it works and is good and reliable I don't see a problem. People say campag or SRAM is better blah blah blah but I think most of this is just bike snobbery.

softlad

freehub wrote:

What actually is wrong with Shimano on an Italian bike? Is it just bike snobbery?

it is pure bike snobbery, yes.

better not mention my Colnago CX1 that I have decked out with a full Shimano Sora group set and custom Nippon/rising sun paint job.......

whydoesitalwaysrainonme

I ike shimano, the japs always get it right. Take kawasaki, honda, yamaha, suzuki (all japanese brands) for example, they always think practically and they always work properly, then take ducati (italian brand) for example yes they go fast and yes they work nicely...at first but then they need constant maintenance and the engines are very complicated (complicated, like campy).

freehub

:?:

softlad

whydoesitalwaysrainonme wrote:

take ducati (italian brand) for example yes they go fast and yes they work nicely...at first but then they need constant maintenance and the engines are very complicated (complicated, like campy).

Ducati complicated..??

You've presumably never seen Honda's NR750, or Suzuki's RG500..?

andy_f

Well my Gios Carbon V107 is built with Shimano Dura Ace 7700. I have ridden Shimano shod bikes for the last 22 years without any problems at all but i have to admit i am looking at changing the chainset for a new Campag as it looks a lot nicer and the new Dura Ace looks like something the Predator would have thrown at Arnie.

kozzo

Smokin Joe wrote:

5 or 10 years down the line electronic shifting will be so comonplace nobody will look twice at it. No reason it won't be reliable, motorcycles have been exposing far more complex electronics to the elements for decades without any problems.

Every innovation from indexing, clipless pedals, STI / Ergo, alu, cf, compact frames etc has been dismissed as unnescessary on their introduction, then quickly became the norm.

But the source of energy was the same... rider.
In motobike you already have eletcric system, new circuit it is just enhancement.
Maybe all road racers will use dynamo hub :?:

mmitchell88

softlad wrote:

whydoesitalwaysrainonme wrote:

take ducati (italian brand) for example yes they go fast and yes they work nicely...at first but then they need constant maintenance and the engines are very complicated (complicated, like campy).

Ducati complicated..??

You've presumably never seen Honda's NR750, or Suzuki's RG500..?

Or my bl**dy Honda VFR 800 VTEC. Over a grand for a 32000 mile service. Whereas my Aprilia RSV was both a thing of beauty and bullet proof. 8)

Anyway, my Colnago (CLX admittedly) is running a mix of Ultegra/Fulcrum bits. I don't think it's an issue.

alfablue

Italian engineering is greatly underrated, it is actually superb and highly innovative, often years ahead of the game (for instance Ducati's desmodromic). Where Italian products have suffered is in manufacturing, but this has improved vastly. Nevertheless there still remains a lot of prejudice based on historic problems that have been resolved, and they can compete with the best.

chriskempton

I don't think there has been much ado at all. I think there's been more ado about Super Record, with the astounding ingenuity of adding an eleventh sprocket. All for only £2,000. :roll:

Like with many technological breakthroughs, early versions will probably be a bit crap, but I think electronic shifting may become the future. On Campag bikes as well.