Mobile Phone Driving Ban ... PLEASE SIGN

Porgy · June 2009

lost_in_thought wrote:

This petition is, as others have said above, rather pointless until there is some enforcement of the current laws to prove that it's relevant.

of all the hundreds of petitions i have signed in my life so far - I can't think of one that produced a result, and there's a few i regret signing as once i thought about the issue a bit i realised i disgreed with it.

Direct action though - that usually works.

In this case sustained and coordinated direct action levelled at offenders will produce results. Maybe people can sign a pledge to confront mobile phone using drivers wherever they see them.

AllTheGear · June 2009

I signed one at University once, slagging off a lecturer. Regretted it ever since.... I think a while now before jumping on the bandwagon.

lost_in_thought · June 2009

Porgy wrote:

lost_in_thought wrote:

This petition is, as others have said above, rather pointless until there is some enforcement of the current laws to prove that it's relevant.

of all the hundreds of petitions i have signed in my life so far - I can't think of one that produced a result, and there's a few i regret signing as once i thought about the issue a bit i realised i disgreed with it.

The only one which I signed that might have had an impact was that one a while ago about the road tax by distance driven thing - charging by mileage I think... anyway a hell of a lot of people signed it, in the millions I think, and it obviously swayed the govt. into thinking it was a voteworthy issue... which is the only way these things have an impact...

They're a nice gimmick though.

Porgy · June 2009

lost_in_thought wrote:

The only one which I signed that might have had an impact was that one a while ago about the road tax by distance driven thing - charging by mileage I think... anyway a hell of a lot of people signed it, in the millions I think, and it obviously swayed the govt. into thinking it was a voteworthy issue... which is the only way these things have an impact...

In that case I suspect that industry were lobbying hard to get that one dropped too, and poltiicians are more likely to listen to big business than evern millions of people.

Weren't over half the country against going to war in Iraq at one point. They still did it, and I'm sure that ignoring all those millions was the death knell of New Labour even before the economy went tits up - they weren't going to last long.

So it seems that governments don;t respond to what people want - therefore petitions don;t work.

AllTheGear · June 2009

That's like, your opinion, man....

(to no-one in particular...)

rolf_f · June 2009

lost_in_thought wrote:

I also think that either it's just badly worded, even if he is a 'well amazing guy', or needs a lot more clarity.

It's extremely badly worded (confused, poor grammar, irrelevant comments, dreadful use of dubious statistics etc)- ultimately damaging to its own cause. Surely an organisation, if RoadPeace is such a thing, can manage to find somebody capable of putting together a coherent argument? As others have said, existing laws cover this. A much more effective petition would have been one just pleading for proper enforcement.

roger_merriman · June 2009

Porgy wrote:

The oil's about to run out - the thousand dollar oil barrel is on its way. Cars will become very scarce.

This will almost certainly happen while allt he politicians are sitting about discussing their own expenses.

Therefore no petition required - just wait. 8)

oh and why don;t we all celebrate that GM went into bankruptcy today.

and how are bikes to be made/transported if there is nothing to replace oil, cars not having fuel will be the least of our worries becareful of what you wish for.

antfly · June 2009

Instead of an outright ban how about 3 or 6 points and a fine if you get caught on your mobile whilst driving, that would probably work as a deterant.It does seem to be becoming more common again after an initial decline,it might just help to remind people it`s illegal.

nwallace · June 2009

Porgy wrote:

The oil's about to run out - the thousand dollar oil barrel is on its way. Cars will become very scarce.

This will almost certainly happen while allt he politicians are sitting about discussing their own expenses.

Therefore no petition required - just wait. 8)

oh and why don;t we all celebrate that GM went into bankruptcy today.

The suggestion that rising oil prices will kill off the personal transport revolution of the 50's is utter naievity, there is no hope in hell of it being killed off because the fuel that led it has run out. Even if Oil does run out the Fischer Tropsch process is being used right now to convert Coal into Diesel just as every town in the UK did for Gas until North Sea Natural Gas came on tap in the 70's.

Once a suitable alternative power source is available, and in common use there will be even more cars on the road, not less. The claimed ranges and charge times of some of the next generation (early mass market) of Electric Cars are truly impressive and a single charge at home for 4 hours they claim will be enough to cover the same distance as I can do on 35l of Unleaded.

Anyone who is lethal while driving a car will be lethal regardless of what they are driving on the road.

prj45 · June 2009

I watched a doco about Venice a while back. During the shoot the narrator got stopped for speeding in his boat in the harbour.

The policeman told him to pilot his boat to the pound where it would be impounded for three weeks.

Which he duely did.

Very refreshing.

always_tyred · June 2009

lost_in_thought wrote:

AndyManc wrote:

Just to add , research has shown that using a mobile phone has the same detrimental effects as driving under the influence, both acts are premeditated and intentional , drink driving carries a ban , so should the total ignorance and wilful neglect of operating a mobile phone.
.

Research has also shown that being over 60 is as detrimental to your reaction time as being young and a few microgrammes over the limit...

What about spoiled little sh!t children watching cartoons loudly in the back and begging for ice cream? Do they have an effect on reaction time?

Where did that come from? I'd better get over to the Rant thread and let one off.

lost_in_thought · June 2009

Always Tyred wrote:

lost_in_thought wrote:

AndyManc wrote:

Just to add , research has shown that using a mobile phone has the same detrimental effects as driving under the influence, both acts are premeditated and intentional , drink driving carries a ban , so should the total ignorance and wilful neglect of operating a mobile phone.
.

Research has also shown that being over 60 is as detrimental to your reaction time as being young and a few microgrammes over the limit...

What about spoiled little sh!t children watching cartoons loudly in the back and begging for ice cream? Do they have an effect on reaction time?

Where did that come from? I'd better get over to the Rant thread and let one off.

Porgy · June 2009

roger merriman wrote:

Porgy wrote:

The oil's about to run out - the thousand dollar oil barrel is on its way. Cars will become very scarce.

This will almost certainly happen while allt he politicians are sitting about discussing their own expenses.

Therefore no petition required - just wait. 8)

oh and why don;t we all celebrate that GM went into bankruptcy today.

and how are bikes to be made/transported if there is nothing to replace oil, cars not having fuel will be the least of our worries becareful of what you wish for.

it's not what i wish for - it's happening - even the oil industry acknowledge that its days are numbered. Even if there is a hundred years of oil left it's ra[pidly becoming too expensive to recover.

There's more than enough solar energy to replace oil once we get get going - in the meantime there's going to be trouble - as you say - but, don;t shoot the messenger, I'm not the cause of this. :shock:

Anyway - the end of oil may mean the end of the big corporation as we know it. Not a bad thing. We organise differently. Bikes made locally and sold locally, what's wrong with that?

Porgy · June 2009

nwallace wrote:

Porgy wrote:

The oil's about to run out - the thousand dollar oil barrel is on its way. Cars will become very scarce.

This will almost certainly happen while allt he politicians are sitting about discussing their own expenses.

Therefore no petition required - just wait. 8)

oh and why don;t we all celebrate that GM went into bankruptcy today.

The suggestion that rising oil prices will kill off the personal transport revolution of the 50's is utter naievity, there is no hope in hell of it being killed off because the fuel that led it has run out. Even if Oil does run out the Fischer Tropsch process is being used right now to convert Coal into Diesel just as every town in the UK did for Gas until North Sea Natural Gas came on tap in the 70's.

Once a suitable alternative power source is available, and in common use there will be even more cars on the road, not less. The claimed ranges and charge times of some of the next generation (early mass market) of Electric Cars are truly impressive and a single charge at home for 4 hours they claim will be enough to cover the same distance as I can do on 35l of Unleaded.

Anyone who is lethal while driving a car will be lethal regardless of what they are driving on the road.

If it was being managed properly yes. But it seems that the change over to alternative fuels is being resisted by vested interested - we're in a massive recession that isn;t going to go away as long as our economy is dependent on oil.

And the idea that we can keep burning fossil fuels is incredibly naive.

I reckon there's going to be a gap - with fossil fuels too expensive and alternative technologies still not available. There's lots of experimental stuff, but nothing that works reliably yet, with the capacity to provide energy for all of us.

Other recources are running low too - what are we going to make cars out of without oil and metals and energy to runt he plants?

In ordr for alternative energy to become viable, fossil fuel prices still have to rise, and stay high - which means energy is going to become expensive anyway whatever happens. that'll halt or even reverse the personal transport revilution if nothing else does.

Finally as information technology improves, and the world homogonises, what are we going to want to travel far for anyway?

antfly · June 2009

Always Tyred wrote:

lost_in_thought wrote:

AndyManc wrote:

Just to add , research has shown that using a mobile phone has the same detrimental effects as driving under the influence, both acts are premeditated and intentional , drink driving carries a ban , so should the total ignorance and wilful neglect of operating a mobile phone.
.

Research has also shown that being over 60 is as detrimental to your reaction time as being young and a few microgrammes over the limit...

What about spoiled little sh!t children watching cartoons loudly in the back and begging for ice cream? Do they have an effect on reaction time?

Where did that come from? I'd better get over to the Rant thread and let one off.

Are you talking about your kids here?
Maybe if you stopped spoiling them and feeding them ice-cream they wouldn`t be so shite.

The Rookie · June 2009

antfly wrote:

Instead of an outright ban how about 3 or 6 points and a fine if you get caught on your mobile whilst driving.

Get with it, it already is 3 points for holding a mobile while driving, that's 1/4 of a drivers licence before he's getting to a totting ban of 12 points.

Like all new labours laws, its under resourced on enforcement so its net effect is almost zero, what is needed is more traffic police catching bad driving habits in general, not just mobiles, but poor signalling, lack of visual checks and attention etc etc the things that put all road occupants at risk everyday (ped's us, drivers etc), this govt has had 10 years concentrating on speed using camera's combined with less road policing and despite cars being made much safer now (for people they hit as well as occupants remember) the number dying has stopped decreasing for the first time in nearly 50 years, techhnology is failing, the Mk1 (Police) eyeball is needed back on the streets.......

Simon

antfly · June 2009

Oh,I `m clearly not with it because because I thought it was just a fine.In that case it needs to be enforced plus some posters or adverts to remind people that it is an offence and of how dangerous it is.It would also be good if they could use all those cameras to prosecute people on mobiles,if they don`t already, and not just when they have caused an accident.

always_tyred · June 2009

antfly wrote:

Always Tyred wrote:

lost_in_thought wrote:

AndyManc wrote:

Just to add , research has shown that using a mobile phone has the same detrimental effects as driving under the influence, both acts are premeditated and intentional , drink driving carries a ban , so should the total ignorance and wilful neglect of operating a mobile phone.
.

Research has also shown that being over 60 is as detrimental to your reaction time as being young and a few microgrammes over the limit...

What about spoiled little sh!t children watching cartoons loudly in the back and begging for ice cream? Do they have an effect on reaction time?

Where did that come from? I'd better get over to the Rant thread and let one off.

Are you talking about your kids here?
Maybe if you stopped spoiling them and feeding them ice-cream they wouldn`t be so shite.

No - I just saw you in the back of your mom's car the other day.

always_tyred · June 2009

Porgy wrote:

it's not what i wish for - it's happening - even the oil industry acknowledge that its days are numbered. Even if there is a hundred years of oil left it's ra[pidly becoming too expensive to recover.

There's more than enough solar energy to replace oil once we get get going - in the meantime there's going to be trouble - as you say - but, don;t shoot the messenger, I'm not the cause of this. :shock:

Anyway - the end of oil may mean the end of the big corporation as we know it. Not a bad thing. We organise differently. Bikes made locally and sold locally, what's wrong with that?

Oil companies will simply start cultivating algael blooms and generating ethanol. And cutting down rainforest to grow grain and brew ethanol. Sorted.

Electricity is the obvious replacement - either used to generate hydrogen to turn back into slightly less electricity, or just stored in batteries. Its not a huge step to imagine a standard cell which you could take out and replace at a "pertrol station" to get around the issue of having to wait at a service station on the M1 for 8 hours while your car is recharged.

So, while oil is getting to be more of a pest to extract, there's masses of coal to produce electricity with.... or uranium. :roll:

Don't pin any hopes on wind or solar though. Too expensive and too inefficient and a tiny p!ss in the ocean.

biondino · June 2009

Always Tyred wrote:

What about spoiled little sh!t children watching cartoons loudly in the back and begging for ice cream? Do they have an effect on reaction time?

Where did that come from? I'd better get over to the Rant thread and let one off.

If you're the one spoiling them then I don't think you can complain! Cartoons? In the car? Why can't they just count cows or VW Beetles or be sick like we had to do back in our day?

biondino · June 2009

Porgy wrote:

Anyway - the end of oil may mean the end of the big corporation as we know it. Not a bad thing. We organise differently. Bikes made locally and sold locally, what's wrong with that?

I do agree with you, but when we're paying £2k* for a Ridgeback hybrid we might struggle to accept it as a good thing.

*or £2k's worth of goats, barley or thatching or whatever barter system the future will throw up

antfly · June 2009

Always Tyred wrote:

antfly wrote:

Always Tyred wrote:

lost_in_thought wrote:

AndyManc wrote:

Just to add , research has shown that using a mobile phone has the same detrimental effects as driving under the influence, both acts are premeditated and intentional , drink driving carries a ban , so should the total ignorance and wilful neglect of operating a mobile phone.
.

Research has also shown that being over 60 is as detrimental to your reaction time as being young and a few microgrammes over the limit...

What about spoiled little sh!t children watching cartoons loudly in the back and begging for ice cream? Do they have an effect on reaction time?

Where did that come from? I'd better get over to the Rant thread and let one off.

Are you talking about your kids here?
Maybe if you stopped spoiling them and feeding them ice-cream they wouldn`t be so shite.

No - I just saw you in the back of your mom's car the other day.

What repartee,talk about Oscar Wilde!
Leave my mum out of this,she`ll kick your ass.

biondino · June 2009

Always Tyred wrote:

Porgy wrote:

it's not what i wish for - it's happening - even the oil industry acknowledge that its days are numbered. Even if there is a hundred years of oil left it's ra[pidly becoming too expensive to recover.

There's more than enough solar energy to replace oil once we get get going - in the meantime there's going to be trouble - as you say - but, don;t shoot the messenger, I'm not the cause of this. :shock:

Anyway - the end of oil may mean the end of the big corporation as we know it. Not a bad thing. We organise differently. Bikes made locally and sold locally, what's wrong with that?

Oil companies will simply start cultivating algael blooms and generating ethanol. And cutting down rainforest to grow grain and brew ethanol. Sorted.

Electricity is the obvious replacement - either used to generate hydrogen to turn back into slightly less electricity, or just stored in batteries. Its not a huge step to imagine a standard cell which you could take out and replace at a "pertrol station" to get around the issue of having to wait at a service station on the M1 for 8 hours while your car is recharged.

So, while oil is getting to be more of a pest to extract, there's masses of coal to produce electricity with.... or uranium. :roll:

Don't pin any hopes on wind or solar though. Too expensive and too inefficient and a tiny p!ss in the ocean.

Eh? If solar panels could cover 1% of the world's deserts they would provide over 100% of the globe's energy needs. The technology is close to breakeven point now, with efficiencies many times higher than they were even ten years ago.

lost_in_thought · June 2009

antfly wrote:

Always Tyred wrote:

antfly wrote:

Always Tyred wrote:

lost_in_thought wrote:

AndyManc wrote:

Just to add , research has shown that using a mobile phone has the same detrimental effects as driving under the influence, both acts are premeditated and intentional , drink driving carries a ban , so should the total ignorance and wilful neglect of operating a mobile phone.
.

Research has also shown that being over 60 is as detrimental to your reaction time as being young and a few microgrammes over the limit...

What about spoiled little sh!t children watching cartoons loudly in the back and begging for ice cream? Do they have an effect on reaction time?

Where did that come from? I'd better get over to the Rant thread and let one off.

Are you talking about your kids here?
Maybe if you stopped spoiling them and feeding them ice-cream they wouldn`t be so shite.

No - I just saw you in the back of your mom's car the other day.

What repartee,talk about Oscar Wilde!
Leave my mum out of this,she`ll kick your ass.

People in glass houses should not.....

antfly · June 2009

.......throw stones.
{what glass house?}

always_tyred · June 2009

biondino wrote:

Always Tyred wrote:

Porgy wrote:

it's not what i wish for - it's happening - even the oil industry acknowledge that its days are numbered. Even if there is a hundred years of oil left it's ra[pidly becoming too expensive to recover.

There's more than enough solar energy to replace oil once we get get going - in the meantime there's going to be trouble - as you say - but, don;t shoot the messenger, I'm not the cause of this. :shock:

Anyway - the end of oil may mean the end of the big corporation as we know it. Not a bad thing. We organise differently. Bikes made locally and sold locally, what's wrong with that?

Oil companies will simply start cultivating algael blooms and generating ethanol. And cutting down rainforest to grow grain and brew ethanol. Sorted.

Electricity is the obvious replacement - either used to generate hydrogen to turn back into slightly less electricity, or just stored in batteries. Its not a huge step to imagine a standard cell which you could take out and replace at a "pertrol station" to get around the issue of having to wait at a service station on the M1 for 8 hours while your car is recharged.

So, while oil is getting to be more of a pest to extract, there's masses of coal to produce electricity with.... or uranium. :roll:

Don't pin any hopes on wind or solar though. Too expensive and too inefficient and a tiny p!ss in the ocean.

Eh? If solar panels could cover 1% of the world's deserts they would provide over 100% of the globe's energy needs. The technology is close to breakeven point now, with efficiencies many times higher than they were even ten years ago.

You have to make the solar panels.

(And I'd also like to see the source of your information - there is likely a good deal of "best case scenario" in there)

Porgy · June 2009

biondino wrote:

Porgy wrote:

Anyway - the end of oil may mean the end of the big corporation as we know it. Not a bad thing. We organise differently. Bikes made locally and sold locally, what's wrong with that?

I do agree with you, but when we're paying £2k* for a Ridgeback hybrid we might struggle to accept it as a good thing.

*or £2k's worth of goats, barley or thatching or whatever barter system the future will throw up

While I'd be all for it, I doubt we're going back to medieval times. But for sure in a hundred years the economy will be completely different from how it is now, and I'd defy anyone to make an accurate prediction for that. The only certainty I think is that the future is uncertain.

What people value, and consider worth paying a lot of money to buy in the next century would probably shock most people now, if only we could know.

One thing's for sure though - if you're paying 2k for a bike, then you will expect it to last a few years. there'll be none of that built in obselesence I hope.

Porgy · June 2009

Always Tyred wrote:

Oil companies will simply start cultivating algael blooms and generating ethanol. And cutting down rainforest to grow grain and brew ethanol. Sorted.

Electricity is the obvious replacement - either used to generate hydrogen to turn back into slightly less electricity, or just stored in batteries. Its not a huge step to imagine a standard cell which you could take out and replace at a "pertrol station" to get around the issue of having to wait at a service station on the M1 for 8 hours while your car is recharged.

So, while oil is getting to be more of a pest to extract, there's masses of coal to produce electricity with.... or uranium. :roll:.

have you heard of climate change at all?

antfly · June 2009

None of us has crystal balls but one thing is for sure,if everyone is driving electric cars and the power stations are burning coal then it isn`t going to solve anything,pollution would probably be a whole lot worse.

always_tyred · June 2009

Porgy wrote:

Always Tyred wrote:

Oil companies will simply start cultivating algael blooms and generating ethanol. And cutting down rainforest to grow grain and brew ethanol. Sorted.

Electricity is the obvious replacement - either used to generate hydrogen to turn back into slightly less electricity, or just stored in batteries. Its not a huge step to imagine a standard cell which you could take out and replace at a "pertrol station" to get around the issue of having to wait at a service station on the M1 for 8 hours while your car is recharged.

So, while oil is getting to be more of a pest to extract, there's masses of coal to produce electricity with.... or uranium. :roll:.

have you heard of climate change at all?

Oddly enough, with the exception of the coal thing, the other technologies are broadly carbon neutral. Indeed, having billions of tonnes of dead algae in the sea might be seen as an effective means of carbon capture.

Mobile Phone Driving Ban ... PLEASE SIGN

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