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Falling off

RiatsalaRiatsala Posts: 44
edited June 2009 in Commuting chat
I've recently switched from a "city bike2 with 33 width tyres to a road bike with 25 tyres. In two weeks I've come off twice. Is this just because I've got to get used to narrow tyres or could it be that the Kenda tyres my bike ame with just don't grip?

Any recommendations on a grippy 700 x 25 welcome :roll:

Posts

  • always_tyredalways_tyred Posts: 4,965
    Riatsala wrote:
    I've recently switched from a "city bike2 with 33 width tyres to a road bike with 25 tyres. In two weeks I've come off twice. Is this just because I've got to get used to narrow tyres or could it be that the Kenda tyres my bike ame with just don't grip?

    Any recommendations on a grippy 700 x 25 welcome :roll:

    Is there anything in common with the two offs? Are you perhaps used to the steering input of a flat bar hybrid, and upsetting the balance by doign the same with a road bike?

    Conti's are quite grippy. Depends how long you want to make them last. As I recall, when you arefar enough down the range to get the word "sport" in the product name, they aren't grippy any more, but will last ages.

    To be honest, if you have wire bead just about anything and replace them with foldable just about anything, you'll probably feel the difference. Nothing to do wiht the bead, its just that foldables tend to be higher up any given range.
  • biondinobiondino Posts: 5,990
    Are you leaning over like crazy in turns? It seems very unlikely that any tyres will just slip away from under you in normal riding conditions. We'd need to know the specifics of the accident (especially weather and road surface) to know if there's a connection.
  • SewinmanSewinman Posts: 2,131
    I fell off a few times when making that switch, you will get used it. Take it easy for a while.
  • LDN-FlyerLDN-Flyer Posts: 97
    How did you fall? I have contis no gripping problems? Maybe you should slow down a little when cornering?
  • RiatsalaRiatsala Posts: 44
    Riatsala wrote:
    I've recently switched from a "city bike2 with 33 width tyres to a road bike with 25 tyres. In two weeks I've come off twice. Is this just because I've got to get used to narrow tyres or could it be that the Kenda tyres my bike ame with just don't grip?

    Any recommendations on a grippy 700 x 25 welcome :roll:

    Is there anything in common with the two offs? Are you perhaps used to the steering input of a flat bar hybrid, and upsetting the balance by doign the same with a road bike?

    Conti's are quite grippy. Depends how long you want to make them last. As I recall, when you arefar enough down the range to get the word "sport" in the product name, they aren't grippy any more, but will last ages.

    To be honest, if you have wire bead just about anything and replace them with foldable just about anything, you'll probably feel the difference. Nothing to do wiht the bead, its just that foldables tend to be higher up any given range.

    I think you have made some useful observations, I do find the steering ifferent. Both 2offs2 were on slippery surfaces on which my previous bike wouldn't have gone over. One clarification, what is foldable?

    Thanks
  • RiatsalaRiatsala Posts: 44
    biondino wrote:
    Are you leaning over like crazy in turns? It seems very unlikely that any tyres will just slip away from under you in normal riding conditions. We'd need to know the specifics of the accident (especially weather and road surface) to know if there's a connection.

    On my first "off" I was on a slighlty dirty/slippery road, no idea how I came off. The second time I was going around a 90 degree corner on a "drizzily" morning and just lost it. As I replied above I wouldn't have come off on my previous bike so my first thought was the original fit tyres just aren't grippy.

    It ewould appear from all your comments this is not hte case and that I just have to ride slower until I've got used to the bike
  • RiatsalaRiatsala Posts: 44
    Sewinman wrote:
    I fell off a few times when making that switch, you will get used it. Take it easy for a while.

    when you say"get used to it" I assume you mean the new bike and not falling off..

    Thanks for the encouragement
  • jongingejonginge Posts: 5,945
    Just a general point (not necessarily relevant to your offs): avoid painted lines and metalwork like the plague, especially when cornering.
    FCN 2-4 "Shut up legs", Jens Voigt
    Planet-x Scott
    Rides
  • biondino wrote:
    Are you leaning over like crazy in turns? It seems very unlikely that any tyres will just slip away from under you in normal riding conditions. We'd need to know the specifics of the accident (especially weather and road surface) to know if there's a connection.

    My guess would be quite the opposite. The thinner tyres on a road bike make it much more important to lean into corners than on a thicker, grippier tyre. It's quite hard to do at first, but you must keep body and bike in a line and lean over.

    from: http://www.sheldonbrown.com/brakturn.html

    Leaning the upper body and the bicycle together, keeping them in line as when riding straight.
    This technique has the advantage of keeping the steering axis, tire contact patches and center of gravity all in the same plane. This preserves the proper handling characteristics of the bicycle, and makes a skid less likely. You can verify this yourself by performing an experiment suggested by Jobst Brandt:

    "Some riders believe that sticking out their knee or leaning their body away from the bike, improves cornering. Sticking out a knee is the same thing that riders without cleats do when they stick out a foot in dirt track motorcycle fashion. It is a useless but reassuring gesture that, on uneven roads, actually works against you. Any body weight that is not centered over the bicycle (leaning the bike or sticking out a knee) puts a side load on the bicycle, and side loads cause steering motions if the road is not smooth. Getting weight off the saddle is also made more difficult by such maneuvers.
    "To verify this, ride down a straight but rough road standing on one pedal with the bike slanted, and note how the bike follows an erratic line. In contrast, if you ride centered on the bike you can ride no-hands perfectly straight over rough road. When you lean off the bike you cannot ride a smooth line over road irregularities, especially in curves. For best control, stay centered over your bike."
  • biondinobiondino Posts: 5,990
    slight addendum to jon's comment - don't avoid them like the plague when going in a straight line if it means you veer off widldly and suddenly into, say, the kerb or traffic or put yourself at risk of a different accident! As long as you're not turning (or braking) on them you'll be fine, even in the wet.
  • always_tyredalways_tyred Posts: 4,965
    Okay, well, firstly, a 32c will have a bigger contact patch with the road than a 23c or 25c, no matter what you get. So one way or another you may have to make up the time on the straights!!

    Foldable - tyres that fold, literally, as opposed ones with wire beads that hold the tyre in a hoop permanently.

    Seems that loose surfaces are your problem.
  • fossyantfossyant Posts: 2,549
    Kenda tyres are rubbish full stop. Change them
  • AndyMancAndyManc Posts: 1,393
    Riatsala wrote:
    I've recently switched from a "city bike2 with 33 width tyres to a road bike with 25 tyres. In two weeks I've come off twice. Is this just because I've got to get used to narrow tyres or could it be that the Kenda tyres my bike ame with just don't grip?

    Any recommendations on a grippy 700 x 25 welcome :roll:

    It's a totally different discipline, I've had to change my riding style completely, you can't get away with the same riding attitude as you use with an mtb or flat bar hybrid.

    You have to watch the road surface more, looking for loose stone or dirt, take corners smoother and even control your position more , using primary when possible.

    Take things easy till you've gained more experience, I'm not sure tyres is the main issue.




    .
    Specialized Hardrock Pro/Trek FX 7.3 Hybrid/Specialized Enduro/Specialized Tri-Cross Sport
    URBAN_MANC.png
  • SewinmanSewinman Posts: 2,131
    AndyManc wrote:
    Riatsala wrote:
    I've recently switched from a "city bike2 with 33 width tyres to a road bike with 25 tyres. In two weeks I've come off twice. Is this just because I've got to get used to narrow tyres or could it be that the Kenda tyres my bike ame with just don't grip?

    Any recommendations on a grippy 700 x 25 welcome :roll:

    It's a totally different discipline, I've had to change my riding style completely, you can't get away with the same riding attitude as you use with an mtb or flat bar hybrid.

    You have to watch the road surface more, looking for loose stone or dirt, take corners smoother and even control your position more , using primary when possible.

    Take things easy till you've gained more experience, I'm not sure tyres is the main issue.




    .

    +1

    I fell off 3 times in 2 weeks but recently I feel pretty confident. You will stop falling off soon.
  • gb155gb155 Posts: 2,048
    fossyant wrote:
    Kenda tyres are rubbish full stop. Change them

    Agreed, They caused me hell on my Dawes and were utter tripe on my Giant.
    On a Mission to lose 20 stone..Get My Life Back

    December 2007 - 39 Stone 05 Lbs

    July 2011 - 13 Stone 12 Lbs - Cycled 17851 Miles

    http://39stonecyclist.com
    Now the hard work starts.
  • lost_in_thoughtlost_in_thought Posts: 10,563
    I like my Kenda tyres... I like them so much that I transferred them onto new wheels rather than buying new tyres.

    The ones that came on the Tifosi, on the other hand, I don' t like. I'm going to buy some Kendas for it.

    I have to say I'm amazed you're having such trouble, I really didn't going from the 'old commuter' (pic link in sig) to the Bowery... and I don't think it's really that different...

    I suppose you could be leaning it too far or something, but I still think it's rather odd.

    Are your tyres at the right pressure?
  • biondinobiondino Posts: 5,990
    LiT, you are the only person I've ever heard of who likes Kendas... someone's got to be lucky on them, I guess, but you really want to buy more?
  • always_tyredalways_tyred Posts: 4,965
    I think that Kenda make decent cyclocross tyres. Perhaps this is a sobering reminder that even if you make decent products, if the market is proliferated with high volumes of low quality dross with your name on it, it doesn't matter.

    Raleigh anyone?
  • RiatsalaRiatsala Posts: 44
    Riatsala wrote:
    I've recently switched from a "city bike2 with 33 width tyres to a road bike with 25 tyres. In two weeks I've come off twice. Is this just because I've got to get used to narrow tyres or could it be that the Kenda tyres my bike ame with just don't grip?

    Any recommendations on a grippy 700 x 25 welcome :roll:

    Well thank you everyone, all your comments taken on board.

    I've now switched to Bontrager Race Lite tyres, a choice somewhat forced by a puncture, and am taking corners more gently.

    I'll let you all know how I get on with the new tyres
  • benno68benno68 Posts: 1,689
    biondino wrote:
    LiT, you are the only person I've ever heard of who likes Kendas... someone's got to be lucky on them, I guess, but you really want to buy more?

    I like mine too, 700 x 25 - I don't want to curse myself but I get on fine with them.

    The only time I almost browned my chamois was when taking a downhill corner in the rain and going over a manhole cover, not an experience I want to repeat. :oops:

    @ Riatsala - I don't think it's the tyres were causing the problem (so keep the Kenda's for spares, or send them to LiT who'll make good use of them) but you just need to get used to your new bike on different road conditions before pushing it too hard.
    _________________________________________________

    Pinarello Dogma 2 (ex Team SKY) 2012
    Cube Agree GTC Ultegra 2012
    Giant Defy 105 2009
  • simon_ramseysimon_ramsey Posts: 116
    I've got a pair of Kenda tyres sitting in my garage and have had no issues with them !!
  • The RookieThe Rookie Posts: 27,804
    Running a Kenda rear, no probs (2.1" kwick hybrid - so not a 700 'road' tyre).

    I also wonder whether brand tyres made for OEM's to put on match up to a similar tyre they sell aftermarket....

    Simon
    Current steed - Whyte T129, 2013 frame, mongrel Revelations, Giant dropper, Stans S1 wheelset. 12, Magura Trail Sport brakes, 1x11. 12.8Kg
  • RiatsalaRiatsala Posts: 44
    Riatsala wrote:
    Riatsala wrote:
    I've recently switched from a "city bike2 with 33 width tyres to a road bike with 25 tyres. In two weeks I've come off twice. Is this just because I've got to get used to narrow tyres or could it be that the Kenda tyres my bike ame with just don't grip?

    Any recommendations on a grippy 700 x 25 welcome :roll:

    Well thank you everyone, all your comments taken on board.

    I've now switched to Bontrager Race Lite tyres, a choice somewhat forced by a puncture, and am taking corners more gently.

    I'll let you all know how I get on with the new tyres

    Well this evening's downpour offered the test I'd waited for; the Bontragers passed with flying colours not a hint of a slip.
  • gradiricgradiric Posts: 89
    I switched to Bontrager Race Lites for the first time about 2 years ago, after about 8 years of commuting. In my opinion they are the best commuting tyre I've ever had - they are highly puncture resistant and last far longer than most others I've used.


    Biondino and LiT - I see from your photos that you're running Ultremos on your bikes. I was thinking of getting some for my non-commute road bike, but have so far resisted due to the cost. I have been using Conti GP 4000S up until now which are light, sticky and ride extremely well, but don't last very long. How do you find the Ultremos?
    Time VRS Pro-Team 08 – weekend steed
    Condor Moda - commute
    Scott something or other - manky old MTB
  • biondinobiondino Posts: 5,990
    I love the Ultremos - they are so swift, so sure-footed, very light and I've not had a single puncture in approaching 3000 miles. I have even just bought the pink versions for my fixie :)

    Having said that, bear in mind there has just been a recall of the Ultremo R tyres due to a manufacturing flaw - there's a thread about it from a few days ago, so I'd read that too.
  • gradiricgradiric Posts: 89
    Thanks Biondino - having read reports of exploding Ultremo Rs, think I'll stick with the Contis instead.
    Time VRS Pro-Team 08 – weekend steed
    Condor Moda - commute
    Scott something or other - manky old MTB
  • fossyantfossyant Posts: 2,549
    Conti Grand Prix 4 seasons - great all round tyre.
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