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Petition Elderly Drivers to retake test at 70

liversedgeliversedge Posts: 1,002
edited June 2009 in Campaign
I went to setup a petition at the No10 site only to find it exists already. Please sign up.

Currently over 70s self declare their fitness, and in recent studies retesting the elderly reduced death from driving in the elderly population by a staggering 86%.

It expires in June. http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/AgedDrivers/
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Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com
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Posts

  • AnonymousAnonymous Posts: 79,692
    I actually think everyone should be retested every few years...
  • liversedgeliversedge Posts: 1,002
    setup a petition then!!! but sign the one thats already there too!
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    Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com
  • I'm not so sure about a re-test. There have been a couple of highly-publicised incidents recently of drivers over the age of 70 causing deaths but in the greater context of things they are small beer to the number of inexperienced kids killing themselves in cars. A far more suitable solution would be a medical check-up say, every three years, after attaining the age of 70. Personally I don't want to be driving when I retire if it all possible. I shall have my bus pass, free rail travel through being an ex-employee by then, and of course my bikes.
    Re-testing the over 70's is just another knee-jerk reaction, why not ban 'em all? I'm far more inclined to go along with NapoleonD than this.
    Start Weight: 128 kilos (20.2 st) (April 17th 2009)
    Current Weight:119 kilos (18.7 st) (June 18th 2009)
    Target Weight: 92 kilos (14.5 st) (sometime mid-2010, hopefully sooner)
  • liversedgeliversedge Posts: 1,002
    My experience living in Surrey is that they are the most dangerous drivers on the road. I have more near misses with the elderly than anyone else.

    Not sure what high publicity incidents you are referring to - so can't accept the "knee-jerk reaction" comment.

    It is not an either/or decision - if you think young drivers are an issue campaign against that also. You can support both.

    I did not advocate banning them so not sure what your point is there.

    Edit: Check out this, it is from the USA where they do have retests for the elderly: http://www.usroads.com/journals/rmej/9903/rm990302.htm

    And from the DoT: http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roadsafety/re ... 70?page=10
    --
    Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com
  • Let us be honest, although there are large sections of the population who are bad divers as well as being young, we have to work towards better road conditions alround. One solution won't work in ever case, so we have to start somewhere.

    This isn't about banning over 70's, it's about checking personal roadworthiness.

    I will sign.

    Perhaps NapoleonD has an idea with retesting. How about a retest instead of penalty points?
  • PorgyPorgy Posts: 4,558
    The problem is our car-centric society. People who opt out of car ownership are seen as freaks, hippy's, poor, or subversive. Until car ownership is seen as a privilege, not a right, and motorists pay the full cost of their anti-social habit -which will mean very serious penalties for those who risk others' lives by being unfit to drive, then we're going to get nowhere.

    I won't sign the petition as I believe it to be entirely the wrong approach.
  • liversedgeliversedge Posts: 1,002
    interesting. How would you implement this right approach - harsher sentences after an accident?
    --
    Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com
  • PorgyPorgy Posts: 4,558
    liversedge wrote:
    interesting. How would you implement this right approach - harsher sentences after an accident?

    I no longer believe in harsher sentences for anyone.

    Unfortunately I believe we have entirely the wrong kind of legal system, the wrong kind of government, and the wrong kind of society for much to change.

    I have become extremely politcally apathetic of late. Britain is probably beyond saving, and I am considering going elsewhere as soon as I've straightened my finances out.

    I also believe that we're heading to a potentially catastrophic end-point for our corporate society that many of these injustices will be sorted out by nature way before man gets to grip with them.
  • Porgy, why are you on a campaign website then?
  • PorgyPorgy Posts: 4,558
    Porgy, why are you on a campaign website then?

    er...is this a campaign website?

    I thought it was about cycling.
  • I feel another petition coming on. Instead of points and fines for minor offences how about a fixed period of time in which a person must pass a drving test or lose their license. Something along the lines of;
    A person receives a speeding notice which also serves as their new 'conditional' driving license. It expires in 1 year (or some other fixed time frame). If they cannot pass a driving test in that time they are then issued with a provisional license (should they with to apply for one) and become a learner driver again.

    what would happen to an offender who already has a 'conditional' license?...
  • liversedgeliversedge Posts: 1,002
    I guess the logic being you have broken the law and need to reacquaint yourself with it. isn;t that what the driving days do? For serious offences don't you get a ban and then have to retake your test?

    I like your scheme but it does feel a tad harsh, esp. if no mitigating circumstances can be taken into consideration.
    --
    Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com
  • AnonymousAnonymous Posts: 79,692
    During my time as a traffic officer I saw some appalling driving from people of all ages, from 11(!) to 99. Structured retesting is the way forward I feel. (Obviously for those of driving age).

    I also feel there should be a sliding scale of points for speeding and variable speed limits on motorways, amongst other things...
  • dennisndennisn Posts: 10,523
    Now wait a minute. "Elderly at 70". Thanks a lot. I'm 60 and still plan to be riding and
    snow skiing for(I hope) at least the next 10 years. Of course that doesn't mean I can still drive car safely but I can hope. So take your "elderly 70" and ........ :wink::wink:

    Dennis Noward
  • PorgyPorgy Posts: 4,558
    Do these petitions actually achieve anything?

    If everyone's busy setting up their own petitions to reflect their own personal wants then I tend to think they will be disregarded as pretty worthless.

    Wouldn;t it be better to form a group to represent cyclists wishes and allow them to campaign on your behalf.

    Better still join one that already exists.
  • beverickbeverick Posts: 3,461
    I know two people over 70 - they're both 77 so well over 70 in fact - and they are two of the best driver's I know. A third is 70 in June and he's in the same category - a competent, considerate and careful driver.

    I can think of at least five people in their 20's, 30's and 40's who really should be made to learn to drive before they are allowed near a road.

    So I don't think I'll be signing.

    Bob
  • Mr_CellophaneMr_Cellophane Posts: 690
    Some of my father's friends are renewing their driving licences. Problem (for them) is that they haven't moved houses for many many years and still have the old red book licence. These licences were not computerised so the DVLC has no record of these people ever taking their test. :roll:
  • Mike HealeyMike Healey Posts: 1,023
    Thank goodness I've got over a year to go before I'm elderly. I''m already making preparations to go into a rest home/sheltered housing and I've put an order in for an electric scooter and an ankle tag so that I can be found when I wander off.

    If I can still ride my bike, as I totter, on palsied limbs, thro' the lower foothills of senility, I'll make sure that I only go out wi' t'Autumn Tints, who will look after me and make sure I don't ride on the wrong side of t'road.

    It is very important that owd folk like me should be got off the road - it will reduce the number of accidents as the 18-25 age group won't have as many targets for their creitinous, reckless, inexperienced driving habits.
    Organising the Bradford Kids Saturday Bike Club at the Richard Dunn Sports Centre since 1998
    http://www.facebook.com/groups/eastbradfordcyclingclub/
    http://www.facebook.com/groups/eastbradfordcyclingclub/
  • liversedgeliversedge Posts: 1,002
    As you get older your cognition and eyesight are more likely to fail or falter. I know lots of folks in their 70s and 80s that are fine. They aren't the risks, its the ones who can't.

    A sample of 3 people isn't particularly useful to form a valid opinion from now is it?
    --
    Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com
  • dennisndennisn Posts: 10,523
    Thank goodness I've got over a year to go before I'm elderly. I''m already making preparations to go into a rest home/sheltered housing and I've put an order in for an electric scooter and an ankle tag so that I can be found when I wander off.

    If I can still ride my bike, as I totter, on palsied limbs, thro' the lower foothills of senility, I'll make sure that I only go out wi' t'Autumn Tints, who will look after me and make sure I don't ride on the wrong side of t'road.

    It is very important that owd folk like me should be got off the road - it will reduce the number of accidents as the 18-25 age group won't have as many targets for their creitinous, reckless, inexperienced driving habits.

    THAT was great.

    dennis noward
  • downfaderdownfader Posts: 3,686
    I wont sign it, and wouldnt when it first came out, due to the fact that it is descriminatory against the elderly. All the insurance and police stats seem to show that the elderly are quite safe because they wont rush, the under 25s however are significantly more dangerous on the roads and vastly more likely to cause death or injury.

    I forget the link but there is a petition on there for retests every year until 25 I think, then every 5 years until 65 and every 2 years again iirc. I beleive I signed that. I think it also called for periodic medical tests like eyesight examinations on all (dont they do this in the USA?)
  • liversedgeliversedge Posts: 1,002
    if they can't pass the vision test they shouldn't be on the road.
    --
    Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com
  • downfaderdownfader Posts: 3,686
    liversedge wrote:
    if they can't pass the vision test they shouldn't be on the road.

    And how many do you know that havent over 70? There are 40 year old drivers with ineffective eyesight out there driving. These things need to be done for all or not be bothered with full stop
  • liversedgeliversedge Posts: 1,002
    You denying the aging process then?
    --
    Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com
  • Mike HealeyMike Healey Posts: 1,023
    liversedge wrote:
    You denying the aging process then?

    You denying the growth of experience and wisdom process, then? Yes, my reflexes are slower than youngsters of 20-25, but then, my driving habits mean that I don't put myself into a situation where I need to test them. It's called judgement, something which comes with experiences reflected on - a process which takes a bit of time. Which has given me a 70% NCB with never a claim against me in 48 years of driving - just one minor prang on a scooter, 40 years ago, when a learner stalled in mid-junction.
    It was my error.

    Which taught me a lesson about assumptions.

    If I start having minor prangs, let alone anything serious, I'll look very carefully at what led to them and give up my licence if it is a reduction in my powers of observation on traffic behaviour which led to them.
    Organising the Bradford Kids Saturday Bike Club at the Richard Dunn Sports Centre since 1998
    http://www.facebook.com/groups/eastbradfordcyclingclub/
    http://www.facebook.com/groups/eastbradfordcyclingclub/
  • liversedgeliversedge Posts: 1,002
    If I start having minor prangs, let alone anything serious,
    Horse meet bolt.
    --
    Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com
  • Mike HealeyMike Healey Posts: 1,023
    liversedge wrote:
    If I start having minor prangs, let alone anything serious,

    Horse meet bolt.

    Tell me Liversedge, how you would assess the difference between minor prangs which might simply be the law of averages catching up with me and those which might arise from a diminution in my ability to judge traffic conditions?

    Except by doing what I wrote.

    By the way, "stable door, meet lock", would be a more logically coherent expression of your opinion
    Organising the Bradford Kids Saturday Bike Club at the Richard Dunn Sports Centre since 1998
    http://www.facebook.com/groups/eastbradfordcyclingclub/
    http://www.facebook.com/groups/eastbradfordcyclingclub/
  • liversedgeliversedge Posts: 1,002
    A few of the things I would do, thanks for asking;

    1. Driving licences would be only be valid between the age of 17 and 80
    2. Licences would expire at 65 and every 5 years thereafter.
    3. When a licence expired the renewal process would comprise; i. GP fitness to drive assessment with formal cetification of cognitive and physical capability. ii. full driving test (written and practical).
    4. Anyone (of any age) involved in a RTA would have a formal fitness to drive test
    5. Any driving related conviction would result in a full retake of the test, including speeding
    6. Serious offences involving dangerous driving and loss of life would result in a lifetime driving ban.
    7. Insurance companies would be required by law to validate driving licence details directly with the DVLA (computer link) before insuring parties
    8. Tax discs more visible.
    9. Punitive fine for driving without tax and insurance (like the TV licence).

    ... lots more thought but this should be a starter for 10.

    I certainly would not let the individual decide their fitness to drive, they are the LAST people I would trust. A bit like MPs and expenses..........
    --
    Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com
  • liversedgeliversedge Posts: 1,002
    By the way, "stable door, meet lock", would be a more logically coherent expression of your opinion
    You clearly understood my meaning and since that is the purpose of language I'm fine. No need to be such a tawkster.
    --
    Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com
  • and a lot of the time they have no idea of the road rules and normally blame YOU for it. That and the fact that they always nearly hit you.
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