Copy of a letter about a taxi.

Mr Sworld

Got hit by a taxi this morning. :x So this is a copy of what's been sent to the Council Hackney Office.


Dear Sir / Madame,

I am writing to inform you of a collision between a taxi and me this morning.

I was cycling down Lewis Road this morning (12th May 2009) at approximately 8.10am when as I approached the junction where Hartington Road meets Lewis Road a taxi pulled out to turn right in front of me. I collided with the taxi's front right wing, luckily I braked early enough to only hit him at a low speed. No damage was done to me or my bike.

However his attitude was that I was in fault. I was filtering along side stopped traffic, the next pedestrian crossing was currently on red but by the time I arrived at it it would of been green again. He clearly saw me as I looked him in the eyes before he pulled out in front of me. As I have right of way at that point and he was sitting at a give-way junction the fault was his completely. His excuse was that the lights ahead of me were on red and I should of stopped, presumably as one of the other stopped drivers had 'let him out'. I, as a cyclist to the rear of stopped traffic, cannot see any signals given by other drivers to him.

The Brighton Taxi Licence number was ***, he was a white male in his 40's/50's. I didn't have a chance to get any more details as he pulled away after abusing me.

I feel that this is the usual 'taxi driver' attitude that a car has 'right of way' over cyclists at any point and would like you to take note of this 'professional' drivers poor driving skills and/or ignorance of the Highway Code.

I hope you can help to resolve this matter or at least remind him who has priority over whom at give-way junctions.

Many thanks,

Mike[/i]

Gazzaputt

Report to the Police as well. Failing to stop at the scene of an accident.

greg66_tri_v2.0

If he's joining a major road from a minor road, and has to cross traffic on the major road to do so, his responsibility is (AFAIK) to give way to *all* traffic on the major road.

Bit like doing a right turn to join a dual carriageway. If the bloke in the slow lane flashes you, that doesn't give you right of way over the other bloke in the overtaking lane.

The taxi driver's position seems to be no more than "you should have been more courteous, as you were going to have to stop further down the road anyway". Maybe, maybe not. Still doesn't give him right of way.

So much for the niceties. As a practical matter, it's rarely a good idea to hare past a queue of stationary or slow moving traffic, for precisely the reason you've described. The safest speed in traffic is usually the same speed as the motor traffic around you.

jeepie

Well done on stopping and protecting yourself and bike. Let us know the outcome.

nameinuse

All the junctions along the Lewis Road are a pain when traffic is slow, the lack of awareness when one driver lets another go is shocking, too. I don't take that route any more it's so frustrating. Had a few courteous taxi drivers recently, though, you must have got a particularly bad one!

Anyway, my reason for posting was to suggest your police report might take the form of a visit to http://www.operationcrackdown.org/ if you don't quite have enough for a full-on complaint.

AndyOgy

I know exactly the junction that you mean and have shed much brake pad and tyre in the exact same place. When drivers join Lewes Road from any of those side roads, they always use the cycle lane as a kind of extension to the give way lines.

The cycle lane that runs along Lewes Road is one of the most popular cycle lanes in the whole of Brighton, mainly due to serving the student community. I can't believe that motorists never seem to expect cyclists to be there.

That cycle lane is also one of the most parked on cycle lanes that I have ever seen and yet it seems to be the one part of Brighton that traffic wardens appear to ignore.

Brighton recently recieved a massive government grant to improve things for cyclists. Apart from a few extra cycle stands up Elm Grove and in Kemp Town, have you seen any evidence of this?

Good luck with getting any sort of justice from our local council.

nameinuse

One day I swear I'm going to ride right over the nose of one of those can't-quite-stop-in-time cars, Danny MacAskil style (if only I had the talent)l!

I've seen a few bits and bobs the council have done, though the biggest one, the segregated path up The Drive in Hove has a couple of really horrible pinch points with no clear priority and the usual people wandering about in it looking lost... Don't know why they couldn't have just spend the money making the handful of dangerous junctions safer for /all/ traffic, and retraining a minority bus drivers.

I've found it much safer and not much slower to start taking primary in most of town, usually following the back bumper of something and only using the bike lanes if it's free-flowing and I'm slower or if there's a proper jam. Having said that, sounds like the OP was riding past a jam...

AndyOgy

I haven't checked out the cycle path up The Drive yet but the guy in Rayment Cycles was telling me that it's a bit dicey. I keep meaning to check out this disused railway track that goes to Devils Dyke. Somebody told me that the cycle route that begins on The Drive eventually leads to it.

Oh and +1 for riding 'primary'. I know it sometimes winds drivers up but we tried it their way and we kept getting knocked off.

It's good to see some Brighton people in here. I thought this forum was mostly dominated by Londoners. Thank god that there are actually people here who know what hills are.

Porgy

nameinuse wrote:

Anyway, my reason for posting was to suggest your police report might take the form of a visit to http://www.operationcrackdown.org/ if you don't quite have enough for a full-on complaint.

So what's the deal with this? sounds fishy to me. someone has a grudge against you and gets you put on some semi-official list of anti-social drivers.

What do the police do with this list? If they use it to harrass or target certain drivers, then do they check the evidence first? I can't see it being admissable in court.

I really don't like this and won;t be using it. Hopefully noone else will either.

Porgy

AndyOgy wrote:

It's good to see some Brighton people in here. I thought this forum was mostly dominated by Londoners. Thank god that there are actually people here who know what hills are.

I ride up shooter's Hill every day - twice. That's a hill. And it's in London.

Also - like many Londoners I wasn't born here. I grew up in South Devon and mainly cycled on Dartmoor until I was 18. Now, thems is hills.

OutlawTorn

AndyOgy wrote:

It's good to see some Brighton people in here. I thought this forum was mostly dominated by Londoners. Thank god that there are actually people here who know what hills are.

Welsh born Londoner here. I know a hill when I see one :P

AndyOgy

OutlawTorn wrote:

AndyOgy wrote:

It's good to see some Brighton people in here. I thought this forum was mostly dominated by Londoners. Thank god that there are actually people here who know what hills are.

Welsh born Londoner here. I know a hill when I see one :P

Oh yeah, Wales trumps Brighton for hills alright. I'd love to get out that way with the bikes at some point. Never seems to happen though.

I lived in the Scottish highlands for a while but bizzarely, I lived in the flattest part. Just near Inverness airport.

My comment was only a tounge in cheek dig about the hills in Brighton. If anything, they're quite frustrating when you're using cycling purely as a method of transport (as opposed to training/enjoyment) and even a short ride seems to work up quite a sweat.

nameinuse

AndyOgy - It's a good route, though I wouldn't do it on proper skinny road-bike tyres all the way as there's a gravelly/cinder bit before you cross the A27. Lots of dog walkers, but then I've yet to find somewhere near town that isn't full of people.

I think there are a few of us Brighton people lurking, I certainly see enough bikes every day to account for a few posters. Mostly drivers down here are reasonably good at coping with bikes, too, so perhaps we have less to complain about than London-based riders!

Porgy - I quite like operation crackdown, it's a pretty good way of dealing with the kind of antisocial driving that's dangerous and unpleasant but doesn't immediately result in anything prosecutable, IMO. If anecdotal evidence is to be believed, enough entries from different people will get followed up (after a call from the plod to complainants) with a visit and a talking-to. They also use it to follow up if they need some more evidence of bad driving in court, too, assuming the people who've complained will take the stand. Having said that, I'm of the drive-properly-or-not-at-all speed-limit-obeying school of driving. If people are in charge of something that dangerous they can at least have the decency to /try/ and do it safely.

Porgy

nameinuse wrote:

Porgy - I quite like operation crackdown, it's a pretty good way of dealing with the kind of antisocial driving that's dangerous and unpleasant but doesn't immediately result in anything prosecutable, IMO. If anecdotal evidence is to be believed, enough entries from different people will get followed up (after a call from the plod to complainants) with a visit and a talking-to. They also use it to follow up if they need some more evidence of bad driving in court, too, assuming the people who've complained will take the stand. Having said that, I'm of the drive-properly-or-not-at-all speed-limit-obeying school of driving. If people are in charge of something that dangerous they can at least have the decency to /try/ and do it safely.

Well I was suspicious as the website you linked to contained no information about what Operation Crackdown was about - at least I couldn;t see any. The way you have described it sounhds reasonable, and possibly very useful, but I have an inherent distrust of the police and databases.

Mr Sworld

Wow, thanks for all the support and replies peeps.

"Greg66 wrote:

As a practical matter, it's rarely a good idea to hare past a queue of stationary or slow moving traffic, for precisely the reason you've described. The safest speed in traffic is usually the same speed as the motor traffic around you.

I did think about that Greg but I found out a long time ago that cycling aggressively rather than passively gives me more of a chance on the road! However I'll keep that in mind....

Nameinuse and Andyogy, nice to meet fellow Brightonians on here too. Lewis Road is a right sod to commute on especial Vouge Gyratory! On the whole I find Brighton not too bad to cycle around apart from the centre of Brighton where there are too many pedestrians who just step off the pavement in front of you! :roll:

AndyOgy

Too true about the centre of town. I've vowed never again to ride along Western Road or St James Street on a Saturday afternoon. They're filled with spaced out shoppers who need the sound of an engine to let them know that something is coming.

And nameinuse, thanks for the tip about the Devils Dyke route. I've got a MTB as well as a road bike so I might give it a go in the next few days. Have you ever used the bridleway just up past the top of Elm Grove (after it becomes Wilson Avenue) that eventually leads to the South Downs Way? A lot of my rides begin with that section.

Has anyone ever done the Downs Link route? Might give that a go sometime this summer. Somebody (a cabby, funnily enough) recently told me that he rode the Downs Link and back again in the same day. Sounds like quite a challenge but I'm worried about how clearly the route is marked.

Mr Sworld

AndyOgy wrote:

Have you ever used the bridleway just up past the top of Elm Grove (after it becomes Wilson Avenue) that eventually leads to the South Downs Way? A lot of my rides begin with that section.

I use that route a lot too! Come up Bear Road, past the Racecourse, along the back of the houses and up to the TV mast. Then past Lewes along the South Downs Way and down to Telscombe. Then back along the seafront/Coast Road but I'll try the Dyke route too, I have walked it before but not biked it.

AndyOgy

Sorry Mr Sworld, I didn't mean to hijack your thread, weren't we talking about taxi drivers at one point?

Just started a thread in MTB - Routes, if you want to check it out the thread is called 'Brighton'.

Also, as a point of local interest, has anyone seen the DVD 'Brighton Aint Ready'? It's all BMX but still worth a look if your from Brighton. Got this clip from youtube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hCPczRJzLmY

Oh yeah, one more thing - Has anyone else in Brighton used South Coast Bikes? I'm delighted that somebody has finally started a bike repair company that picks up your bike from your house in the evening, delivers it back (usually next day) and they clean it as part of the service. I absolutely promise you, I do not work for them but I do highly recommend them.

nameinuse

Western Road's a nightmare now, all of the things to herd the pedestrians safely across seem to cause the buses to want to occupy the same few feet of road as me on my bike... Can't say I mind the gyratory any more, just do my best car impression and the vast majority of drivers are great *touches wood*. Lucky really, as I'll be there in about an hour... I think the key thing is assertiveness rather than aggression, you just have to know what you're doing, what's going on around you, and make it very obvious that you're going to take your priority. Most drivers don't really know what's going on anyway and will respond sensibly if you make it easy for them*.

Most of my riding's been to the west of Brighton so I've not explored the top of Elm Grove. I've done a very short bit of the Downs Link, though, from Shoreham to the South Downs Way, and it was a mixture of slightly rutted mud and gravel, much smoother than the SDW itself. Seemed pretty well signposted the bit I did, but you can't beat having a map for that kind of thing.

*Doesn't apply to skip trucks, Big Yellow buses, Audis, student cars or school-run parents

Mr Sworld

This has arrived in the mail box...


Dear Mr ******

Thank you for your email. I am copying in Chris **** on the Enforcement Team who will contact you shortly about your complaint. Should you wish to add anything or receive an update please do not hesitate to contact Chris directly. His telephone number is 01273 ******.

Best wishes

HCO

woodgob

I've never really had too many issues with buses or taxis....my route takes me past Patcham down London Rd to seafront. It's pretty busy leading up to 9am but lorries, buses and taxis generally seem to be fairly responsible and courteous. I admit that there are a few bad apples but I fnd a bigger problem with van drivers - particularly with hire vans where the driver isn't, perhaps, used to driving a large vehicle. It's OK if you see one up ahead as you can plan for that but it's the ones that speed past too far left and nearly take you out in the process that are the problem.

Mr Sworld - glad your OK...looks lime you came up against a bad apple. The fact that he saw you travelling, made eye contact and he still pulled-out.....not good.

nameinuse

That's a good response from the taxi people so far, let's hope they can actually do something about it! I had a close overtake from a taxi last week (6 inches from bars at most), caught him up, pointed out the error of his ways and he was remarkably apologetic... Hopefully the authorities can deal with the ones who are deliberately rubbish!

+1 on hire vans, some are ok, some are an absolute menace.

AndyOgy

You're absolutely right about the vans, especially rental vans. Before being made redundant, I used to drive a 3.5t van for a living and always made a point of being courteous to cyclists. I can tell you first hand that a lot of van drivers do find it funny to get as close to cyclists as possible.
People often pointed out the irony of my being a van driver and defending cyclists. I'd always point out that it'd never happen the other way around. I've never found myself chatting to cyclists and defending van drivers.
And as for rental vans, you just have to assume that they're being driven by someone who has previously only ever driven a Fiesta or something similar. Keep well clear.

SpinningJenny

Hello - another Brightoner here!

I live in the Lewes Road area so know exactly what you mean!

Good luck with the taxi firm - glad you're in one piece.

Mr Sworld

Well, I had a reply today from the Enforcement Officer:

Mr ******

I have now identified and spoken to the driver of taxi plate *** and left him in no doubt of your complaint. His response was far from convincing but unfortunately, without a witness to support your allegation I am unable to take this matter further.

However, a record of your complaint will be placed on his file should there be any future complaints.

Meanwhile, thank you for taking the time and trouble to put your complaint in writing.

Yours sincerely

Chris *******

Hackney Carriage Enforcement Officer

Too be expected really! This was my reply:

Hello Chris,

thank you for pursuing this matter. I appreciate that without witnesses that any resolution would be difficult to pursue.

However I feel satisfied that he realises that his actions were inappropriate, whether he admits it is another matter.

I would like to thank you for your time and trouble in following up this complaint and I do know that the majority of taxi drivers in Brighton and Hove are good drivers.

Thanks again,

Mike ******


All in all I feel satisfied, there was no real damage done and the driver will think twice about pulling out on cyclists!

AndyOgy

Nice one. Glad that you got a good response.

Lets hope that this cab driver has learned his lesson.