New Zealand and Australia this September

Nick Hill

So flights now booked :shock: and no going back

we are planning a world tour, not all on bikes at the moment but starting in New Zealand in september for 3-4 months then on to Australia for 6months (keeping bike but probably pick up a camper van for the longer trips).

Not sure after that but planning to work our way back to the uk somehow over the next two years landing back in 2012 unless we find a better way of living on the way round

I am going to get measured up for my cheviott SE on Friday and am going to go for the 700c variety as the better half has a 700c already so might as well try to keep some commonality.

not really done any planning yet as we have a couple of big events to get over before the big off.

any advice on kit or route for NZ and Oz greatly appreciated

blog set up to keep in touch with everyone

cheers

Nick

Brian NZ

Hi Nick
September is early for NZ weather. Expect it to be wet and cool. As for routesdepndeing on whether you want to do the tourist trail or not. the is Pedlars Paridise which list some good routes, I would use their alternative routes as my main ones. There are a good selection of journals on www.crazyguyonabike.com Between us Jo and Dave Whitney, Steve Glasgow and me( Brian Brown) have pretty much covered most of the North and South Island and the bits we haven't done some one else would have.
Just be prewarned the North Island takes foriegn cycle tourist by suprise. It is is like Devon and Cornwall on steriods. The other thing is to get good maps and stay off the main roads. This is a fault of most cycle tourists in NZ they spend heaps of money to get here than won't pay $60.00 more for good maps and complain about the traffic.
We get back from our Winter trip to Europe 17th September. So if you happen to be passing from Rotorua to Taupo, main tourist route. Get in touch, we have a large house on our farm and welcome cycle tourists to stay, have a coffee or just meet for a ride.
Cheers Brian & Sue

pottssteve

I would certainly agree with Brian regarding the maps and staying off the main roads - driving is fast, aggressive and of the tail-gating variety. There is still quite a lot of drink-driving, especially in the rural areas, and young, inexperienced drivers quite commonly kill themselves...I lived in NZ for 18 months and can't actually remember seeing road cyclists on more than a cople of occasions.
Enjoy the trip - NZ is, as they say, "sweet as, Bro'"....

Steve

lloyd_bower

pottssteve wrote:

I would certainly agree with Brian regarding the maps and staying off the main roads - driving is fast, aggressive and of the tail-gating variety. There is still quite a lot of drink-driving, especially in the rural areas, and young, inexperienced drivers quite commonly kill themselves...I lived in NZ for 18 months and can't actually remember seeing road cyclists on more than a cople of occasions.
Enjoy the trip - NZ is, as they say, "sweet as, Bro'"....

Steve

I'd agree with some of that, NZ drivers are the worst I've experienced by far, but I'd disagree road cycling actually very popular in NZ. I certainly see more than I used to in the UK, though some it will because off road opportunities are on the whole pretty limited.

I'd agree with Brian's advice re maps. The range of Kiwi Maps are a decent scale and good level of detail for cycling, though all too often distances aren't marked. September's not too bad a month cycling, certainly in the Northern half of North Island it's not too cold from my limited experience to date.

cpeachey

We spent March in South Island NZ. Toured by car from Greymouth. The west coast (mountain side) road is VERY quiet. Long stretches without tea stops or traffic. There were several cycle tourists on the road and cycling looked very pleasant. Even the main highway past Christchurch was not very busy. There was very little heavy traffic. Remember South Island has a population of just 1million. Scenary is awsome but you will need waterproofs.
Motels in March were between $NZ95 and $NZ120 per night. Plenty of "backpacker" accomadation from $20 although we did not try them
Twizel has a good youth Hostel. Double room was $NZ50 (for 2) Good facilities. Went from here to Mount Cook and up to Tasman Glacier on a ski plane. A truly memorable experience landing on the glacier with sunshine and not a cloud in the sky.
Chris

Nick Hill

thanks for all the replies guys

starting to get very excited about the planning stage

we will be arriving at the very end of September so probably be on the road October

so leave the sandals at home?

As I said this is the start of a three year odessey (SP?) so we will be taking a lot of stuff for warmer climes along with us.

BrianNZ Will definitely pop in and see you guys on our way past

Thanks for the links crazyguy is blocked at work :evil: so will look through at home

would like a full map of NZ to start getting to grips with the layout and distances, and sugesstions?

many thanks

Nick

dilemna

Josie Dew writes of the many very dangerous NZ drivers cars especially trucks in her travelogue around the country. I was consisering a tour of NZ by bike but have decided against it following her experiences. Backpacking and working around NZ is a lot safer which I did in '93. Agreed the west coast road is a lot quieter and the scenery is stunning as is the rest of the South Island and parts of the North Island, but you would still have to negotiate other roads elsewhere and IMHO it is not worth losing your life for. The NZ government really has to tackle the poor standard of driving in NZ. Many drivers drive drunk as well...... and get away with it except when they cause carnage when they crash. Also occupants of vehicles enjoy hitting/slapping cyclists as they pass by. It occurs far more frequently than in the UK something about which JD also has a tell or two to tell .

Nick Hill

The idea was to escape idiots in cars

I have heard the Josie Dew book is pretty damning of the driivng in NZ

But then a lot of people wouldn't ride my commute for the same reasons

Nick

dilemna

Nick Hill wrote:

The idea was to escape idiots in cars

I have heard the Josie Dew book is pretty damning of the driivng in NZ

But then a lot of people wouldn't ride my commute for the same reasons

Nick

I've been in NZ as a non-cyclist travelling around in cars and buses and that was scray enough! Make sure you've got mirrors, nerves of steel, good insurance and a head cam is all I would say if you want to chance it. Plus read JD's book on NZ. She's done an awful lot of cycle touring and knows what she is talking about. She does make very positive descriptions of NZ but for me not enough to outweight the negatives she describes of cycling there - the traffic. Plus I have already seen the natural wonders of Mount Cooke, the Fox glacier and the Remarkables. I would not go back to tour by bicycle. Maybe by motorbike as you are moving a little faster so are not so much of a target. Anyway there is so much walking you can do in the Southern Alps near Queenstown and the fijords in the far south . The Milford Track is one of the best walks in the world. You don't really need to cycle if you don't have to.

Brian NZ

I have read all her books and ridden in some of the countries she has. If I reacted like you guys have I would have never had some of the best cycling experiences of my life and meet some lovely people. I wouldn't have ridden in the UK for a start, or ride here in NZ or Australia. I found all her books ephasise the negative, every where she goes and she is obsesive to the extreme. I think it must sell books.
Sure some NZ drivers are not kind to cyclist but that is the same all over the world. We are getting better as more people cycle. We have 4000 cycle past our farm every April on a Sportive and around 13000 turn up for the around Taupo as well as many other sportives. More bikes were sold last year than cars. As I said before stay off the main roads. Would you ride A roads and Motorways, if you were allowed, by choice in UK? So why would you ride the main arterial SHW here if you have a choice. I know sometimes there isn't but often there is. On my last tour we were seeing about 1 car an hour for most of the 3 weeks away..
Get good maps. Kiwi maps are most likey the best and most readily avaliable. I have brought the books ($30.00) each for the Nth and Sth Islands and just take the pages I need. Have a bike with 700*37 or 26 *1.6 tyre or bigger so you can ride gravel and I can usure you, you will have some of the riding of your life, with hardly any vehicles. For those of you who didn't get my last post. Go to www.crazyguyonabike.com , use the locals and go to Oceania then NZ. Ready what normal people not trying to sell a book have experienced, you may be pleasantly suprised.
I wish I could post a photo to show you some typical riding.
I have raved enough.
Cheers Brian

ralex

The traffic in NZ is not that bad, the North Island is busy but you can plan your route to get away from it to a large extent, especially if you are happy riding on gravel roads.
We rode from Auckland to Invercargill then back up the West Coast between December 2007 and February 2008, and I have toured all of NZ a couple of times before as well, and I lived there (South Island) for 4 years about eight years ago.
Yes, if you are cycling the major roads to the main tourist sites in the North Island you will be put off by the traffic, but there are still some great routes for cycling, Coromandel, East Cape, Wairarapa are all excellent areas to tour through (all sealed roads).
The South Island is still relatively quiet on most roads most of the time, although I would avoid as much of SH1 as possible, and weekends can be busy near the tourist spots.
October might not be the best time for starting a tour though, although there will be less tourist traffic on the roads!
For maps, if you are an AA member you can get free good quality maps from the NZ AA offices around the country, non members can buy them I think. Otherwise the LINZ (http://www.linz.govt.nz/topography/topo-maps/index.aspx) maps are good for more detail/topographic information, their 1:500000 series can be downloaded as jpeg files here : http://www.linz.govt.nz/topography/topo ... index.aspx

Photos from our trip here : http://www.flickr.com/photos/rualexander/sets/

Vidoes here : http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=ped ... iew=videos

Nick Hill

Ralex

Thanks for the maps they look just what I was after

We choose October as it would be the start of spring so we would get the spring and summer over there

are we going to early?

Brian, Thanks for the reassurance it was all getting a bit melodramatic

Brian NZ

I normaly don't start touring till November. October can be wet but then again the last two have been very dry. Who knows what the weather will do. Just come when you can, plently of light warm layers and be set up for the rain tent wise. All the camping grounds have kitchens and Lounges and the BPers are all normally very comfotable and some allow camping as well. Both nearly always have nice hot showers if you arrive wet and cold.
Chhers Brian

Michael Falk

I've gone for 3 rides in NZ. One ride for 3 months & 2 others for 2 weeks each. One ride I arrived in mid Oct & rode north of Auckland. I was surprised by the fine weather I encountered on this ride, I only had drizzle on part of one day. The other 2 rides had variable weather. On the west coast of the south island I certainly copped some large rainfalls.
Generally though, NZ was a fantastic cycling venue. On my 3 month ride I bought a good map in Auckland on my first day & despite the odd exception, crazy drivers really wern't a problem. I think it's really only necessary to avoid the highway connecting Auckland & Wellington as much as possible.
Continual great scenery & the camping /hostel system is fantastic. It's easy to find hostel/camping locations from tourist offices & hostels.

Michael

Nick Hill

so who can give me a top ten must see locations in NZ

we have not set route and no real timescales yet

but reading crazyguyonabike is providing some real inspiration

cheers guys

Nick

cpeachey

Taieri Gorge Railway and Dunedin railway station
www.taieri.co.nz
Mount Cook flight landing on Tasman Glacier. (expensive but worthwile in good weather.)
www.mtcookskiplanes.com
Buller Gorge Swingbridge if you are in that area.
www.BullerGorge.co.nz
Milford Sound or Doubtfull Sound. (Boat trip)
Route 6 The west coast road including Franz Josef and Fox Glaciers. (this was a good raod with little trafic in March this year)
Arrowtown. (Gold mining town)...there are others like it.
Tram ride in Christchurch and the Banks Peninsular.
Picton mail boat trip around Queen Charlotte Sound
Wherever you go should be well worthwile.
Chris

Nick Hill

thanks for those

my lonely planet book is boxed up at the moment

It all sounds good

Nick

Kiwi Kranker

Can I just say that dont be put off by the whole 'NZ are the worst drivers etc etc' We dont come close to some countries out there...insert 'Egypt' here.

As has been reiterated already stay off the main routes where possible and in general you wont have a problem.

Worth bearing in mind is that we are roughly the size of the UK, the road network length equivilant of the UK and where the car is more or less the ONLY form of viable transport for the young (who dont ride) so we have a lot of youth driving and that of course has its negatives.

We are not a dangerous country to ride around but you do need to have your wits about you in the obvious danger points. Much like the country lanes in England.

I get a little tired of the overreaction of many people and NZ drivers. We are not the best for sure but there is not a killer behind the steering wheel of every car.

Oh and the drunk driving line is a complete and utter crap. We are incredibly hard on drunk drivers and the percentage of them on the roads is actually quite low. I constantly see it here in England whereas I hardly ever saw it at home.

I hope you enjoy your trip and Russell in the Bay of Islands is a definite top 10 contender as is the Raglan coast in the North Island and the Coromandel. Pretty much anywhere in the South Island will blow you away but I suggest you take the 'canal' road that feeds the Lake Tekapo Hydro Damn on the way to Queenstown as this will give you great views and a nice little detour away from all the traffic. You will finish up with a view of this.





Incidentally I wouldnt call this a very good picture of the area either!

geoff_ss

We toured South Island in February 1999 on a CTC tour led by Pete Crofts and didn't find the traffic a problem. In fact there was very little of it even around Queenstown. There certainly weren't lots of cafes and you definitely took advantage of just about every one you passed.

We were extremely lucky with the weather. In fact farmers were worried about lack of rain up the west coast and it was scorching when we took a coach trip from Queenstown to Milford Sound.

Geoff

Nick Hill

Nice picture Kranker

I'll put that in the list of must do's

Make you wonder what we would tell people that want to tour in the UK about the driving conditions

I seem to have a road rage incident about once a week and thats in a pretty rural setting

Flight booked new biike on its way can't wait

will 4 months be enough to see it all

Nick

lloyd_bower

Kiwi Kranker wrote:

Can I just say that dont be put off by the whole 'NZ are the worst drivers etc etc' We dont come close to some countries out there...insert 'Egypt' here.

As has been reiterated already stay off the main routes where possible and in general you wont have a problem.

Worth bearing in mind is that we are roughly the size of the UK, the road network length equivilant of the UK and where the car is more or less the ONLY form of viable transport for the young (who dont ride) so we have a lot of youth driving and that of course has its negatives.

We are not a dangerous country to ride around but you do need to have your wits about you in the obvious danger points. Much like the country lanes in England.

I get a little tired of the overreaction of many people and NZ drivers. We are not the best for sure but there is not a killer behind the steering wheel of every car.

Oh and the drunk driving line is a complete and utter crap. We are incredibly hard on drunk drivers and the percentage of them on the roads is actually quite low. I constantly see it here in England whereas I hardly ever saw it at home.

I hope you enjoy your trip and Russell in the Bay of Islands is a definite top 10 contender as is the Raglan coast in the North Island and the Coromandel. Pretty much anywhere in the South Island will blow you away but I suggest you take the 'canal' road that feeds the Lake Tekapo Hydro Damn on the way to Queenstown as this will give you great views and a nice little detour away from all the traffic. You will finish up with a view of this.

Incidentally I wouldnt call this a very good picture of the area either!

Nice picture, but I disagree NZ is certainly far from bike friendly, and a dangerous place to cycle compared to most 1st world countries. I've been knocked off twice by cars in the last 8 months, & numerous near misses. Even commuting in London was safer.

The standard of driving in NZ (I won't say NZ Driver's) are on the whole bad, look at the stats, 9 killed over the last bank hol w/end. Convert that per head of popn and ain't good.
Licence plate of the guy who knocked me off at a roundabout last week says it all, RAM U.

Still no law against hand held mobile phones and driving, and stack loads of people use 'em, I see it daily commuting. Low driving age, loads of automatics, makes learning driving easier.

I doubt that stats on drunk driving are that great in NZ too.

Kiwi Kranker

lloyd bower wrote:

Kiwi Kranker wrote:

Can I just say that dont be put off by the whole 'NZ are the worst drivers etc etc' We dont come close to some countries out there...insert 'Egypt' here.

As has been reiterated already stay off the main routes where possible and in general you wont have a problem.

Worth bearing in mind is that we are roughly the size of the UK, the road network length equivilant of the UK and where the car is more or less the ONLY form of viable transport for the young (who dont ride) so we have a lot of youth driving and that of course has its negatives.

We are not a dangerous country to ride around but you do need to have your wits about you in the obvious danger points. Much like the country lanes in England.

I get a little tired of the overreaction of many people and NZ drivers. We are not the best for sure but there is not a killer behind the steering wheel of every car.

Oh and the drunk driving line is a complete and utter crap. We are incredibly hard on drunk drivers and the percentage of them on the roads is actually quite low. I constantly see it here in England whereas I hardly ever saw it at home.

I hope you enjoy your trip and Russell in the Bay of Islands is a definite top 10 contender as is the Raglan coast in the North Island and the Coromandel. Pretty much anywhere in the South Island will blow you away but I suggest you take the 'canal' road that feeds the Lake Tekapo Hydro Damn on the way to Queenstown as this will give you great views and a nice little detour away from all the traffic. You will finish up with a view of this.

Incidentally I wouldnt call this a very good picture of the area either!

Nice picture, but I disagree NZ is certainly far from bike friendly, and a dangerous place to cycle compared to most 1st world countries. I've been knocked off twice by cars in the last 8 months, & numerous near misses. Even commuting in London was safer.

The standard of driving in NZ (I won't say NZ Driver's) are on the whole bad, look at the stats, 9 killed over the last bank hol w/end. Convert that per head of popn and ain't good.
Licence plate of the guy who knocked me off at a roundabout last week says it all, RAM U.

Still no law against hand held mobile phones and driving, and stack loads of people use 'em, I see it daily commuting. Low driving age, loads of automatics, makes learning driving easier.

I doubt that stats on drunk driving are that great in NZ too.

You are not in the slightest helping this thread are you!

Firstly it is incorrect to use the weekend death toll to emphasise your point. I am not saying it isnt bad (it is) but it is simply making people more apprenhensive when you have used essentially what is a blip in the death toll statistics is not useful, was there a cyclist incolved in any of the accidents???

Its not a debate its just laying it out as it is, not scaremongering so that people dont ride. Of course we are a high hazard cycling area simply because there are not many cyclists on the streets and many cars. As I said you need to be aware of what is happening around you, exactly like commuting in London (as I do every day) and if you ride aware you will be fine. I cant comment on your riding Lloyd but I have assumed you were riding in Auckland and the person that hit you was in a Dodge Ram? (I hope you are ok by the way). Do you follow the road rules? Do you give people the fair opportunity to see you? Bright clothes etc? It is commonsense in a country with low levels of cycling that you take responsibility for yourself and make sure that you can be seen and you respect the road rules. Most importantly if you cant respect the driver of the car respect the 1 ton of metal that the car is.

Another thing as long as the OP is not planning on doing much night riding then the chances of coming across a drunk driver while minute in the first place are almost non exisitent.

Incidentally I would say your strike rate is pretty much on a par with most serious commuters here in London

P.S Lloyd I am not trying to be rude I just think people need to be informed with impartial information so they can prepare. Starting anything 'scared' is not good for anyones morale. I truly truly hope that the OP has a brilliant time with no incidents.

jc4lab

Hate to be a damp squid are you sure September is best.? Wonder if you should just stay on the north island cos of daylight hours..Perhaps others with better knowledge can comment..

Tourist Tony

Moving this thread on to the next country...I have my own crazyguy logs up, but Oz can largely be summed up by a comment I had from a tourist office in the WA desert:
"Where else in the world can you ride on good roads, in such isolation, so far from any support, and not get shot at?"

nicklouse

Nick Hill wrote:

The idea was to escape idiots in cars

Nick

I did move out of the County was that not far enough?

Have fun.

lloyd_bower

Kiwi Kranker wrote:

You are not in the slightest helping this thread are you!

Firstly it is incorrect to use the weekend death toll to emphasise your point. I am not saying it isnt bad (it is) but it is simply making people more apprenhensive when you have used essentially what is a blip in the death toll statistics is not useful, was there a cyclist incolved in any of the accidents???

Its not a debate its just laying it out as it is, not scaremongering so that people dont ride. Of course we are a high hazard cycling area simply because there are not many cyclists on the streets and many cars. As I said you need to be aware of what is happening around you, exactly like commuting in London (as I do every day) and if you ride aware you will be fine. I cant comment on your riding Lloyd but I have assumed you were riding in Auckland and the person that hit you was in a Dodge Ram? (I hope you are ok by the way). Do you follow the road rules? Do you give people the fair opportunity to see you? Bright clothes etc? It is commonsense in a country with low levels of cycling that you take responsibility for yourself and make sure that you can be seen and you respect the road rules. Most importantly if you cant respect the driver of the car respect the 1 ton of metal that the car is.

Another thing as long as the OP is not planning on doing much night riding then the chances of coming across a drunk driver while minute in the first place are almost non exisitent.

Incidentally I would say your strike rate is pretty much on a par with most serious commuters here in London

P.S Lloyd I am not trying to be rude I just think people need to be informed with impartial information so they can prepare. Starting anything 'scared' is not good for anyones morale. I truly truly hope that the OP has a brilliant time with no incidents.

Well I don't particularly want to get into an argument, but I 'll answer your points.

OK, but the w.end death toll just reflects that NZ has one of the first world's worst road death rates per head of popn http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-related_death_rate. Note the UK's somewhat safer stats. No cyclists involved thankfully, not that it matters, any is wasted death. There's been a couple of cycle tourists killed in the last 6 months, so it is better to be prepared.

I've not seen any stats on cycling deaths, but the US's high place on that previous link for road deaths and a separate figure which states '..U.S. cyclists are three more likely to be killed than German cyclists and six times more than Dutch cyclists...' http://bicycleuniverse.info/transpo/almanac-safety.html suggests there's probably some link.

FWIW I was wearing flourescent yellow top and similar ankle bands, but it didn't help in either case. Not that not wearing a flourescent top would be any excuse for a driver knocking a cyclist off in any case, as I rarely wore one commuting in the UK.
'...you ride aware you will be fine...' not sure about that, only way of trying to ensure that, would be to cycle at walking speed.

Drunk drivers don't necessarily drive only at night, saw what was suspiciously like one in the Northland early one morning when touring last year. But there's *heads everywhere.

I wouldn't what to put the other OP off cycling in NZ, but I don't want to hide the facts either.

Well I must of been lucky in London, I didn't get any serious knocks in 5 years of cycle commuting there.

Nick Hill

Hi Louse hows it going

you doing any riding at the moment?

thought you might like to know me an Jeanette got married weekend before last ;-)

thanks for the other guys comments and we will take it easy but I guess its the luck of the draw in the end. it certainly won't put us off ;-)

We were going to start in January but in the end couldn't wait!!

Nick

clanton

Personal observation from lots of reading on touring forums including CGOAB is that NZ is disporportionately dangerous to cycle in. Having driven there but never cycled I'm inclined to support that view. Lovely place but not somewhere I would personally tour.

ralex

For fear of repeating my earlier post, NZ is no worse than most other countries for cycle touring with regard to the traffic and drivers. I have toured there several times, probably about 8000 miles altogether, with no adverse incidents. The roads are good quality, generally have wide shoulders (although watch out for when they narrow down at bridges, especially the one lane bridges), and stay off the likes of SH1. The car accident statistics don't necessarily reflect the danger to cyclists. Personally i would say Australia is significantly worse.

Nick Hill

well we are in NZ and still alive ;-)

the roads have been ok so far with lots of drivers givings us the thumbs up or waving and only the one maniac logging truck driver but we were on SH1 so expected that kind of behaviour

trying to get to cape reinga in the next fews days currently holed up in Dargaville

If any of you guys would like to meet up that would be great

keep an eye on our blog form latest location but basically were are going clockwise round north and south Island over the next 6 months at about 60km a day ;-)

BRIANNZ is that offer of a place to camp still good? where abouts near rotorua are you?

keep a look out for two heavily loaded slow folks one on a yellow hewitt and one a blue hewitt

cheers

Nick

www.hillgurney.blogspot.com

jay_clock

You did well to ignore the people slagging it off.... My experience of NZ was that the biggest roads had a shoulder, the smaller roads are fine, but some of the main roads are narrow and busy (eg Taupo to Napier)

If Brian and Sue are back from Europe I would fit in a visit if they are offering - lovely couple who I stayed with and I was able to host them here in the UK last year too

My trip is here http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/doc/nz

have a great time!