Is MBUK value for for money?

mfin

ANSWER: No, its not. (and I wonder if this post will be deleted, it probably will).

MBUK has deteriorated, its lazily produced and they need to pull their socks up ...and £4 for a 1 to 1.5mm thick magazine?? ...who'd pay for that? What do I mean by this? ...read on...

Just got April's MBUK and went to read it last night. Compared to the other bike magazines it really is terrible value for money. Apart from the 3 index pages (which I am not going to count as 'proper' pages) the first thing you can read that someone has actually had to type starts on page 16. Of that page and the next 6 pages all the text written could fit on one page its so heavily biased to photographs.

Now, I know it takes photos to show stuff but there also a fair few pages with nothing more on them than a title of an article and a sentence or two and stuff like that. Also, with regards to photos, I know what cycling looks like, I do it all the time!

I don't mind massive photos of review bikes as an exception cos there's value in seeing what they look like. Plus, if you're going to review a ride somewhere, actually write something that would take more than an hour to perfect please! ...after all you get to p1ss about on a bike for a few hours and don't seem to do much than bung a load more photos than are needed just up to fill up more mag pages with minimum effort. Lazy.

I did a quick count.... its a 210 page magazine.... if you take away the useless pages that fall into the following categories...

1. Advert
2. Page with a photo and a title and thats about it
3. Page with total text you can hide under my (small) mobile phone
4. Index Pages
5. Pages that are just labelled up photos of kit with no useful comments

...then there are only 100 pages in the magazine... even a lot of those Id like to dis-count too cos they really barely have anything on them, either cos they're repeated stylesheet pages with 'naff all' on them, or pages where there's nothing much said, as in, its repeated from other old issues. Or those where, lets say, 1/5th of the page that has actually been written so is still mostly a photo.

Importantly ...lets also take it into consideration that the mag isn't focused on any genre so Trail, Downhilll, Freeride etc etc all have to have their place within the 100 pages. A difficlut balance but who does this offer value for money to then? ...so, at best you should consider the mag half as thick, then who would pay £4 for it? ...but even worse I reckon there's about 40 pages I read, which that would be a 1/5th of the mazazine - that would make the magazine between 1 and 1.5mm thick for me !!

Well, if the team tried a bit harder I'm sure they could write more stuff and change the balance, its lazy and self indulgent as it is, cmon editor, line up the whole team and give them all a big slap each... if it changes I'll buy it again, cos it has been a lot better in the past . If it doesn't change this will be the last one I ever bought cos I don't like being ripped off.

I put mine in the bin this morning cos I don't want to see it lying around to remind me what a waste of money it was. I think WMB, SingleTrack and MBR are much more professionally produced, I don't doubt the knowledge of the MBUK lot but they're making a magazine with mininum effort and are probably happy cos of circulation figures alone, but mis-guided into thinking that this makes it a 'good magazine'.

Anyone else agree/disagree?

P-Jay

Would you prefer plain white paper with just text on it? Photos are an important part of any mag, they tell the story far better than words can.

I was a bit disappointed with this months Fork review, seemed a bit all over the shop. Some Jump forks, the odd big single crown and two DH forks at each end of the price range? Where were the Boxxers, the 888 WC's, they cost a staggering £1500 this year so I'd like to see a review of them.

And they've been teasing me with "up coming" details of this years Mash-up Events for months, but still no details.

But I like almost everything else, the monthly trail centre review is an absolute must, far better than some OS map for a boring ride around some farmers field. Loads of items about trails/ride locations aboard which is handy when you're looking forward to your 3rd annual trip to Morzine, but you know you'll need a change next year.

Lots of bike reviews and interviews.

And what are the other options, MBR is BORING, Dirt is unreadable if you're over 15 and singletrack seems to come out when it fancies and has a much higher photo/word ratio.

The Northern Monkey

Its been floating around a few times that MBUK has been getting thinner and thinner and thinner and thinner and thinner.

I remember yeaaaaars ago, when I used to steal my bro's MBUK, and they all used to be around the thickness of what the 20thC Anni mag was.

It does take me....possibly half an afternoon to finish an MBUK? not really VFM when I'd ideally want to read it for a few days.... last months was tiny btw!!

Less is more?! No, More is More... Please!

Either that or make it a mag every 2 weeks, the GF's girls mag has more content than MBUK these days!!!

mfin

P-Jay wrote:

Would you prefer plain white paper with just text on it? Photos are an important part of any mag, they tell the story far better than words can

....and what are the other options, MBR is BORING, Dirt is unreadable if you're over 15 and singletrack seems to come out when it fancies and has a much higher photo/word ratio.

No, not plain paper, but I wouldn't mind something to read, its the balance of photos vs. text, the suitable balance in whatever the purpose of article - 'review', 'ride' etc... thats all to c0ck in my opinion. Like I said, its the overuse of photos which makes things appear lazy... you can go past page after page just going 'photo... next... photo... next... photo...' with nothing to read... I know what its like cos I write copy myself day to day and produce loads of graphics and let me tell you that photos fill up pages a lot quicker than writing - not that this is why the balance is that way, or not that the team would admit that balance being 'out' anyway, after all, they probably wanna be out cycling (or in the hairdressers) don't they, not slaving behind a laptop a bit more to try improve the mag.

I take it some people want something to read, perhaps they should make a 'pop up book' version for those who don't.

As for Dirt being unreadable if you're over 15, perhaps I forget that MBUK is aimed at kids more than all the other magazines (and that in itself is no bad thing of course, no problem with that).

Perhaps the balance isn't out at all for the demographic and I'm reading the wrong thing.

I think the MBR reference you made me twig again, after all MBR does have a little OS map guides pullout as you say, whereas MBUK has a cartoon.

Anonymous

You do have some fair points. Maybe you should consider a magazine aimed at an older audience?

What gets my goat is the fact that some of the writers that appear in the magazine photos always look like shit!

Hungover, unshaven and rough looking. Get a grip, clean up and sort yourselves out because this is how it looks:

Nice shiny, gorgeous new bikes with a dirty pikey sat on them. Is it Ric? The ginner that uses hair straighteners? You look like a bike thief not a journalist.

If I was your boss I wouldn't let you sell Big Issue never mind get in a magazine!!

You all write well, I just wish there was more of it like the OP.

I have been buying MBUK,WMB, MBR and Singletrack for the last few months to decide which one to subscribe to.

Difficult really and I think it will be WBM as I feel the writing and reviewing is of a higher quality overall. Maybe its my age as it is aimed at an older audience.

I prefer the look and feel of MBR but I after reading this months I think it has worst editorial and reviews of the lot.

I want to know which bike to buy and why? I don't give a shit if you would prefer the bike to have half a degree less head angle because guess what? It doesn't, so reveiw what it is and not what you think it should be.

As far as giving all review bikes the same tyres why not give them all the same components too. Really level the playing field? Idiots.

MBR has nice look and feel and I like the ride guides but after reading it I realised that I would be quite happy if the writers fell off their bikes and harmed themselves in a way that meant they could never write or ride again.

Single Track world is just a bunch of bike toffs sat in a crappy boozer with low tables and a rocket salad. "Mummies got a Santa Cruz you know...toff toff what what!!"

As far as the "subscription fairy" goes. Subscription FROG I would say.

Looks more like a "ten to two er"

"Its ten to 2 and the bars closing and I haven't pulled so I'll take owt thats left"

So it looks like it's WMB all the way for me!! Maybe some pull out ride guides and a classier overall feel for the future (mbr feels nice in your hands).

Anyway rant over, back to work.

Furbes

i agree to a certain extent mfin , it could do with a few less ads & why not have a section on readers bikes instead of sponsored riders bikes who don't have to scrimp & save every penny to buy ? having said that , there's worse things to be spending your money on .
by the way , it costs 5.65 euro over here !

Anonymous

No need to reduce the adverts but how about diluting them with some more quality content.

In fact increase the price a bit and just glue WMB to the back of MBUK.

Its a monthly magazine and after a couple of hours or so I'm already waiting for next months?? Whats that about?

Anonymous

Also what about a "subscribers only" forum or section of bike radar?

Or does this exist already and I don't know about it because I haven't subscribed yet?

mfin

Jstock, I'm with you and I've recently found WMB to be my choice... I used to think by inclusion of the buyers guide at the back (a sort of repeated Which? guide) that too much stuff is repeated each issue but, those few pages aside, its not the case and its a great mag. That's as long as your into XC, Trail or Enduro riding (but that covers me).

I also think the 'hair straightener' thing is probably part of the interview process to get on the team, but I don't really care what they look like, Id just like some more informative well-written content to get the balance back. (I do find it quite amusing that some of these guys are in their 30s and seem to dress like they're in McFly though, McFly with 'super-rad bandanas' - wicked).

As for a subscriber's only section of the forum, hmm, don't know why, I'd never subscribe but I've still got a four foot stack of bike mags in my house. Unless it would be a place for subscribers to ask for their money back of course.

pilsburypie

The fact is that it is a money making enterprise. There is a limit on how much can be written about general mountain biking. There are a limited number of techniques, tips that have to be regurgitated. New kit reviews can be limited if the kit really isn't that ground breakingly innovational. Reports and interviews will take a similar form throughout the years.......

So, what you end up with, having read the magazine for 12 months, is a template of future publications with little new content and some limited kit reviews that are not nearly as in depth, unbiased or as wide ranging as you can get off the net.

I buy them now and again, look at the pretty pictures and have finished them in a matter of hours. Can't remember which mag it was, but the only useful thing I have ever kept is a trail centre guide detailing numerous centres throughout the UK. A pair of cheap socks that would just about fit my misses, a beenie hat have not really been a highlight for me....

papasmurf.

WMB is far worse them MBUK..would be better off as a quartly..then again most mags are liek this at the mo..though at least they haven't gone th4e way of some of the ski mags that are just front to back advertorials.

Anonymous

The subsribers only section came about because I was thinking why subscribe apart from saving a few bob and getting it a day or too early?

A subscriber commits to the magazine financially and in doing so potentially reduces the likelihood of buying another mag.

So what does the subscriber get back?

It arrives a touch earlier and costs a wee bit less!

Well there isn't enough in it to last a month so getting it a week earlier doesn't matter because its over in a few hours anyway.

Also the free gifts are pants. I'd rather they accumulate all the gifts from a particular month and offer them as a job lot in a competition.

Winner at least can ebay the naff freebies and then use the money to buy new bike bits etc.

Free socks? FFS. Who hasn't got enough socks already? And they were shit.

If they sell 30,000 magazines the competition winner (30,000 pairs of socks, multi tools or whatever carp is free next )would be able to ebay them and buy themselves a new bike!!!

Or wear a new pair of socks every day for the next 80 years!! Wow thats a lot of socks.

The Northern Monkey

For me, MBUK "covers" everything that i'm interested in. Trail, freeride and DH. Its better that spending £12 on 3 different mags.

However, the content really isn't the best. It very sparse and vague. 2 pages for freeride, 2 pages for dirt etc etc......

off the front of every mag - "Cross-Country, Freeride, Downhill, Dirt Jump, Trials, Singletrack, Slopestyle". Quite a bit to cover in a 100 page mag eh?

Maybe MBUK should leave XC and singletrack to WMB/MBR (who do it better) and concentrate on different areas?

The Northern Monkey

For me, MBUK "covers" everything that i'm interested in. Trail, freeride and DH. Its better that spending £12 on 3 different mags.

However, the content really isn't the best. It very sparse and vague. 2 pages for freeride, 2 pages for dirt etc etc......

off the front of every mag - "Cross-Country, Freeride, Downhill, Dirt Jump, Trials, Singletrack, Slopestyle". Quite a bit to cover in a 100 page mag eh?

Maybe MBUK should leave XC and singletrack to WMB/MBR (who do it better) and concentrate on different areas?

FSR_XC

I wouldn't know how bad it is.

I stopped buying it over a year ago as it seemed it wanted to be everything to everyone & in my eyes fell short in all aspects, other than it being aimed a 4 year olds.

I don't want to read a mag written by kids for kids.

tompug

I had not purchased mbuk for a fair few year, but while at the post office I noticed the March issue had an article entitled 'Downhill racing on the cheap' or something akin to that on the cover. As I was in the market for a downhill rig I thought it might be helpful. Boy was I wrong, the entire article was drivel about two blokes camping in a van and scrouging parts. No kit guide, no entry level bikes mentioned, no info on amateur racing or locations. Complete toss.

I also noticed the 4 bike 'wrecked and rated' feature every issue was a mess. Page 126 the images don't match the descriptions, the meta and rune need swapping. You can pay me to proof read if you like MBUK, clearly you don't do it yourself.

At least the product rating is realistic these days, the last mag I purchased circa 2006, nothing ever was rated below a 7/10, even the most dire POS product.

Just to add, I just compared page numbers in 2006 june issue = 218, 2009 march issue = 200

mfin

pilsburypie wrote:

The fact is that it is a money making enterprise. There is a limit on how much can be written about general mountain biking. There are a limited number of techniques, tips that have to be regurgitated. New kit reviews can be limited if the kit really isn't that ground breakingly innovational.

I agree its a business BUT businesses lose focus and become complacent and lose focus.

BUT... I disagree on what you can write, there's stacks of kit out there, stacks to review, so many makes that they don't review enough when they could get off their asses and ask to try out rather than just waiting for what arrives in their laps. Of course there's the old 'i'll book an ad but I'd like some editorial' that happens all the time in any publication like this, but that shouldn't stop them seeking out stuff to review and reviewing it better.

The ride stuff is lazy, even with centres, they don't go into what the areas like, where you can stay, costs of things like this, whether its worth a long journey for a weekend or whatever. They should, they forget that, cos they're getting paid to go and don't think that other people have to commit their own money and time to going there and want to know what its really like.

I don't want to know who broke a mech or any of that rubbish. Facilities, costs, what the area's like and what the cycling is like, with photos that I can see what they are talking about, not just some snapshots of some d1ckhead lolling around in the back of a camper having a lovely time with his mates (who are also wearing bandanas).

The photos don't relate to the text, they'll talk about a section being 'a bit technical and tricky' and have a picture next to it and they don't bother captoning it with 'this is the bit we were talking about being a bit technical and tricky'. That kind of thing would be so much better. But they don't think obviously... they just do what they do... (that applies to a lot of mags though). Fact is (having worked in publishing) that the layout people probably get the text and photos and most of the time they have to pick something meaningless out from the text to make a caption for the photo ...and by that time the bloke who knew what the photo was and what part of the ride it related to is probably in the bogs doing his hair again.

If they cared about the mag in the product sense then they could improve it one hell of a lot, I have no doubt about it whatsoever.

mfin

Seems a fair few people agree in some form that its lost its way then.

The Northern Monkey

Should have posted in the MBUK office... Might get a reply from the "dudes" then :roll:

Anonymous

its in freeride mode


just going downhill

Anonymous

they are doing each others hair in the bogs

mfin

bigbenj_08 wrote:

Should have posted in the MBUK office... Might get a reply from the "dudes" then :roll:

Probably right. Didn't think, not that they'll respond to criticism in any positive way I would think, I expect they'd reply as if 'they'll know best' as 'voices of experience in publishing' and be able to pull any logic they want out as to why the balance is 'as it is' to make themselves feel better. Probably think 'well you can't please everyone' or something general that would save them from assertively addressing issues that make for a deteriorated product.

Again, they could make the magazine a lot lot better if they wanted to. To me its a product that doesn't deliver half as well as it could for any reader.

I'm sure they're nice people, I'd just like better value for money and I can't see anyone here saying it 'is for them'. I'll buy it again in 6 months and see if its changed at all.

The Northern Monkey

Couldn't Resist...

MBUK @ work..

pilsburypie

We could have a caption competition:

"After arriving at noon, Doddy thumbs through the freebies sent in, smokes a blunt and kicks back till home time"

supersonic

The mag does cover a lot of bases, albeit not as say focused as say WMB on a particular riding faction. But yeah, it is written and aimed at a younger audience and purposely has that style.

I get WMB (obviously!), MBUK, and occasionly MBR. The rest I can read through in less than 30 mins, no value there for me.

In the end, MBUK is the best selling bike mag in the UK. It does have an audience!

Anonymous

and windows is the best selling operating system in the world too


see the parallel?

supersonic

Works for me. And for millions of others!

But of course, some hate it. Which is the point, you can't please everyone with everything. MBUK doesn't try and monopolise the mag world though...

supersonic

Of course the writers and staff are always looking at ways to improve the mag, and it has undergone several changes over the last two decades, and will again: I am sure they are reading this ;-). But I feel it will always have the style that it has now and will simply evolve to reflect 'what's cool' in the MTB world and the younger audience.

samtope

I enjoy the mag personally, I like the enthusiam mbuk has and find it really rubs off when I am pressed to find the energy to ride after an exhausting work week. Were it not for all those action shots and reminders of skills I dont have but could have a good time working on, I might well spend my weekends on my backside while that expensive bike I am lucky enough to have rots away in the garage. I love being out knackered on my bike, and mbuk gives me the kick up the ar5e I sometimes need to forget how tired I am and just go and ride.

Anonymous

If you google "mbuk circulation figures"

this thread is the first search result...for now anyway

mfin

supersonic wrote:

Of course the writers and staff are always looking at ways to improve the mag, and it has undergone several changes over the last two decades, and will again: I am sure they are reading this ;-). But I feel it will always have the style that it has now and will simply evolve to reflect 'what's cool' in the MTB world and the younger audience.

'Will simply evolve'? Na... that's the point, doesn't 'evolve' imply that it gets better over time? Do you really think it has? Yes, its undergone changes. Maybe it needs to regress instead to get some quality back.

Is the real point that its going for a younger and younger target audience though? (how about some hannah montana stickers as a free gift then, perhaps thats a better suggestion) ...and of all the people I see riding, not many of them look like they've left a women's hair salon thats been running a Rambo Lookalike competition, is that to appeal to the younger audience as well? ...cos I don't even see kids dressing like that to be honest.